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In GOD We Trust

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posted on Jun, 3 2005 @ 01:32 PM
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Generally speaking, I don't bang on about any particular right that is God-given and constitutionally protected, but all of them in general. I bang on about them because it is necessary that people know how it should be before they can try and get us back on course. That is the theory, anyhow. It is much like tilting at windmills, though.

While it is true that the courts are to "interpret" the constitution and the amendments, they are not to redefine them.
It is known that the establishment clause was to prevent any particular sect to be elevated to the pedestal of "National Denomination"; as it is abundantly clear that this was a "Christian" nation, there are different sects, as they called it, denominations as we call them today.

Separation of church and state" was written by Jefferson, and was to the membership of Dansbury Baptist church, who were a bit worried that another "sect" was vying for prominence. It had nothing to do with keeping God out of the nation. The phrase has been misused for decades.




posted on Jun, 3 2005 @ 01:58 PM
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But it's O.K. to place Christianity above other Religions?

Also the Seperation Between Church and State, idea came about years before Europeans had found America. It was a chriticism of Theocracy during the Roman Period.

Edit:
Protestant 52%, Roman Catholic 24%, Mormon 2%, Jewish 1%, Muslim 1%, other 10%, none 10% (2002 est.)

20% Following no Judeo/Christian Faith.

[edit on 3-6-2005 by Odium]



posted on Jun, 4 2005 @ 12:24 AM
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Uh, yeah, if this is a Christian nation, of course.
The whole idea of a Christian nation, is that it is a Christian nation. Does that mean that you must be a Christian? Well, of course not! That'd be pretty hard to enforce, as Christianity is a relationship between the human and the One who died so that the human would have salvation.

By being a Christian nation, our moral bearing, our principles and ethics are of the Christian faith. See the difference?

No culture can rise to be great, or even last very long, without a standard set of mores, taboos, etc. The laws must be based on something. The very rights we were meant to enjoy in this nation were given to us by the Christian God, and the Founders not only acknowledged that but, by stating as much, placed those rights out of the reach of the government. Well, they placed them out of their reach, legally.
This has been circumvented by attaching everyone to the District of Columbia, and they have clouded the issue by giving you "civil rights", many of which mirror those given to you by God. When they snatch away your civil rights, they expect that you will have forgotten about the rights they cannot touch, and therefore not stand on those rights.

Their job is being made easier by these folks who buy into the warped in historically incorrect usage of the "Separation of Church and State" phrase used by Thomas Jefferson. It is very difficult to coincide that assertion with the fact that Tom was in favor of the governemnt spreading the Gospel to the "Heathen" (Native American Indians), or the fact that Tom stated that he had looked at many a religion, but the Christian faith was the best one upon which to build the new nation.

Even if I were an athiest and thought the whole thing was hog wash, I'd push the true and correct history, so that the government would not be able to tinker with the rights.



posted on Jun, 4 2005 @ 07:52 AM
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Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Uh, yeah, if this is a Christian nation, of course.
The whole idea of a Christian nation, is that it is a Christian nation. Does that mean that you must be a Christian? Well, of course not! That'd be pretty hard to enforce, as Christianity is a relationship between the human and the One who died so that the human would have salvation.


Not that hard when you outlaw other Religions. Still to this day Native American's cannot practice their Religion in Prisons. (NNAPRAC)


Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
By being a Christian nation, our moral bearing, our principles and ethics are of the Christian faith. See the difference?


Yes, it would be simple to design a set of morals that apply to all that are not based on any Religion. Just involves some thinking and doesn't involve prayer in Congress or saluting the "One True God" in school. You talk about morals, but what about being fair and equal to all? Should that not be taught? And by getting children to pledge alligence it doesn't do that when it mentions God. There are a lot of people that do not worship a God or 1 God, as shown by those statistics.


Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
No culture can rise to be great, or even last very long, without a standard set of mores, taboos, etc. The laws must be based on something. The very rights we were meant to enjoy in this nation were given to us by the Christian God, and the Founders not only acknowledged that but, by stating as much, placed those rights out of the reach of the government. Well, they placed them out of their reach, legally.

This has been circumvented by attaching everyone to the District of Columbia, and they have clouded the issue by giving you "civil rights", many of which mirror those given to you by God. When they snatch away your civil rights, they expect that you will have forgotten about the rights they cannot touch, and therefore not stand on those rights.


They can be based on mores and values, that apply to all no matter the Religion. It's fairly simple. Also without things like Civil Rights, Blacks, Native Americans, Hispanics, etc, would all still being persercuted by "Christians". (Ku Klux Klan, etc)


Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Their job is being made easier by these folks who buy into the warped in historically incorrect usage of the "Separation of Church and State" phrase used by Thomas Jefferson. It is very difficult to coincide that assertion with the fact that Tom was in favor of the governemnt spreading the Gospel to the "Heathen" (Native American Indians), or the fact that Tom stated that he had looked at many a religion, but the Christian faith was the best one upon which to build the new nation.


Actually, the "Seperation of Church and State" phrase I use is one of the oldest, if Jefferson used an incorrect version well that says a lot about one of the founding fathers.


Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Even if I were an athiest and thought the whole thing was hog wash, I'd push the true and correct history, so that the government would not be able to tinker with the rights.


Or we just place laws down and educate people, that no matter their religion they are equal? Instead of placing symbols of one Religion in places of importance and putting that Religion above another - which is what it does. It's funny how you talk about "Correct History" when you seem to think Civil Rights have been given to people by God, if this was the case Christianity would have never persercuted people. Now would it?



posted on Jun, 14 2005 @ 11:45 PM
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Odium seems to have this one in the bag. This thread needs more lions.


At any rate, it seems to me that the poster shouldn't be bashed so hard. He seems as though he's questioning his faith (why else would he put something on here like this, lest he be proved wrong), so we should help him in his transformation.

- Fallen One



posted on Jun, 23 2005 @ 01:28 PM
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the united states is as unpure as it gets so much materlisam and greed.
If god would favour any country it would not be the united states.


Ox

posted on Jun, 23 2005 @ 03:44 PM
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Heretics, All of ya!.. Just kidding


I thought it was funny.. Just think.. Like in the pledge of allegiance.. which has been around for many moons, So has the "In God We Trust" on the U.S. Currency.. Now getting to my point, back when those many moons werent so many, Religion was a very big thing, That was society, Anyone who was Anyone went to church and was a big wig at the church, This is how the country socialised before night clubs, the internet and what not..

What Im getting at is ..Church was the social structure when the country was founded.. Religious freedom reigned, not like today where, you cant pray in school or say god bless you when someone sneezes without catching a sideways glance for being a churchie freak..

Get it?.. Good..

No offence on the churchie freak line.. ya freaks



posted on Jun, 23 2005 @ 08:12 PM
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One of the biggest pieces ot the puzzle to the true history of America is the dolalr bill. Hundreds of million sof people every day see the dollar bill every day yet have no idea what those symbols mean. You dont have to know anyhting about the Virginia pact, East India Trading company, Illuminati, etc to know what was going on back in the 1700's.

Now let's take just a general look at the bill:

*Federal Reserve Note: So just what is the Federal reserve? It's a privately owned system created by bankers and wealthy familes. Chase Manhattan, Rockefellers, and even the Rothchilds can be traced to it. JFK wanted to do away with Federal Reserve notes and introduce debt free silver backed notes. This is not conspiracy, this is just the facts.

*The pyramid, with detached top and all seeing eye. Even the evil corporate giant Disney spells it out for ya with their pro secret society film National Treasure. This is a long standing Masonic symbol symbol(confirmed), as well as believed to posisbly be used by aspects of th eBavarian Illuminati(unconfirmed)

*The eagle: It's the same symbol, minus a head, of the Scottish Rite Freemasonry. this could simply be because it looked good at the time and a lot of the foundation of the US be it men or the actual DC itself was Masonic.
Notice that the spears, twig brances, and stripes all are 13. There are 33 feathers on the eagle. At the bottom of the image it of course says 1776 in Roman numerals. 1776 was also the beginning of the Illuminati, whom Washington once wrote about as having heavily infiltrated European Mason tradition at the time.

*"Novus ordo seclorum" The new Random House unabridged dictionary says that this Latin phrase means "A new order of the ages (is born)." This is not conspiracy, this is what it means. Novus Ordo means new order.

So I mean take it as ya want, these are the facts and interpretations.



[edit on 23-6-2005 by 8bitagent]

[edit on 23-6-2005 by 8bitagent]

[edit on 23-6-2005 by 8bitagent]



posted on Jun, 24 2005 @ 01:02 AM
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What strikes me as ironic about the whole "In God We Trust" motto being printed on our money, is that it was added to our money to show the world what we stood for, yet nobody stopped to think about how those in the future would interpret the phrase's meaning.

If I had no knowledge of the historical events which caused the slogan to be put on our money or of the religious beliefs of those responsible for doing so, I might be inclined to think that the Money was the God in which we trusted. Or, better yet, I might even think that Americans worshipped a pantheon of Gods with many of their gods' portraits shown on the country's currency. Gods with such names as George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, and Abraham Lincoln, to name a few.

I wish I could be here in another thousand years when historians are sifting through the past, trying to determine what their predecessors were like, or maybe what happened to them. How do you think that they will interpret "In God We Trust" when they find it on our most precious possesion, money?



posted on Jun, 24 2005 @ 06:46 AM
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Originally posted by djohnsto77
Why does everyone examine the minutia of the dollar bill looking for evil hidden meanings when the true meaning is right there as plain as day:

All the symbology on the dollar bill leads back to a belief in the almighty God! Why do people have to keep using magnifying glasses and microscopes to find hidden meanings when the true meaning is there!


[edit on 5/27/2005 by djohnsto77]


I thought most of the Founding Fathers were deists not christain. in fact christian men probably would have not liked (if allowed) other men to call them fathers.

Take the DEC of IND for example. "Nature's God"... sounds illuminist and diestic to me. (not that the freedom part is all bad).

Being a christian myself, i think that the god a "banker" would serve is mammon.

In mammon (their god) we bank (or trust).

besides, anyone can pay lip service to God. ****
i have to add that God in the bible is also symbolized by an eagle. the Great Eagle in rev 12 that protects the woman from the flood of the Dragons Mouth. its also mentioned in Duet 32:11. this is not a endoresment or condemnation of scot masonrys useage of the symbol.

[edit on 2005-6-24 by NuTroll]

[edit on 2005-6-24 by NuTroll]



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 01:19 PM
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I came across something interesting, relating to the eagle on our money, which may or may not be coincidence.

This
is the obverse side of the Washington quarter (Note that the head and body are both facing left).

This
is the "Shekel of Tyre" also bearing the eagle facing and standing left.

What is interesting about this coin, besides being remarkably similar to ours?

The obverse of the coin shows the laureate head of Melqarth, the reverse an Eagle. It is dated to year 38 of Tyre which translates to 89/88 B.C. Ref: SG 5918; Historia Numorum, p. 799.

Sear notes that in the centuries following the Macedonian conquest Tyre was subject first to the Ptolemaic Kingdom of Egypt then, at the end of the 3rd century, to the Seleukids of Syria. In 126/5 B.C. the city regained its autonomy and commenced a remarkable issue of silver & bronze coins extending well into the Roman Imperial period.

These famous silver tetradrachms ("shekels") are prized by many as the most likely coinage with which Judas was paid his 'thirty pieces of silver' for the betrayal of Christ. deepfield.com...


Now I'm not saying this coin was the inspiration for our own, and I'm not saying it wasn't. I just thought it might be somthing to consider in your discussion on this topic.



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