Defending MY country! Lol, yeah right.

Let me ask you a question (and yes this is relevent here) when you talk about how your going to defend your country.. do you HONESTLY think it would do the same for you?

HA! Your country wouldn't look at you to spit at your ugly mug if it ment ONLY protecting you. If it WASN'T in your countries interests to defend YOU, then its not going to do it.

I keep thinking about this poor women who has been taken hostage in the drug war in Indonisia. And like.. when there is some draconian and obviously completely corrupt and ruined country like that how can a country stand by and WATCH HER BE DESTROYED!? It drives me crazy it does... really... makes me never want to say anything even minorly appreciative of anyones COUNTRY... how can a STATE just ruin someone like that?


And its not like the USA hasn't done it countless times to their own. AND YOU ARE NEXT! Make NO mistake about it! Doesn't matter if you a some white hick from "Arkansaw" .. if they don't like you.. they will 'blue dress' you. And if you some black man from L.A. well... you already know what you got coming if you get caught slipping.


Time and time again.. we 'stand up' for our country. What the HELL has it ever done for any of us?

Like and I mean DIRECTLY.. don't give me some hot air about it giving you 'freedom' or 'liberty' or something like that.. because they will also take that away from you right quickly too if they feel its in their interests.. in other words.. they never gave it to you.. its on loan.. maybe until you die.. maybe not.

All the evil that the state does... when has it EVER done ANYTHING for anyone? When has it EVER saved someones life? Never.. I can't think of one situation where it has.. in fact.. most of us know that the state will kill even up to and more than 3,000 of its own just so it can get the white card to go kill more.

Damn.

So why do you bother? This is my question. Just a question (with a statement.. okay.. but.. still I want to know why).

I for one understand exackly how you feel. The world is in such pityfull shape all around us. I'm not going to say i'd fight for my country, but I would my countrymen and women. Fellow fighters fighting for the same , beside me, moreso for each other.
I see many things that make me sick and tired of the world around me. God knows ya can't save everyone. And government would only fight for us if it's in thier best interest to do so.
Damn shame they don't feel like many of the people with the no one left behind, and everyone matters, that every life is worth fighting to save.
I wish the people could take over and start from scratch. Teach every man to live like God intended. Everyone that steals will lose a finger, then a hand, then his/her life. Everyone that murders someone would be publicly hung. For everytime anyone was raped, someone would get death by public beating.
Take away all the bad that the people could and do the best we could with the rest.
What's the first thing you'd do as a "we the people society" .
I'd put honey all over the naked body of that man that stabbed those baby girls to death, tie his backside to a tree and set loose some hungry bears.

Well Lets see, If you were recently unemployed our goverment (USA) supplies you with "Unemployment Compensation". If you are starving and are unemployed they issue "Food Stamps". If you are un educated they issue grants. So if you are in need, the United States actually stands up and helps us out!

So before you go bashing... think about how other countries will let you be a broke ass, uneducated starving mother Fk'er...


grow up and realise "we do have it better than anywhere else on the planet!!

Ineffectual malcontents...

I love them. They are my most favorite people in the whole wide world!!!

I think the best thing this country does for its citizens is allow them to do something for themselves. Such as complain incessantly. Now there's freedom.

Edit: Misunderstood the point the author was trying to make

[edit on 13/5/2005 by SportyMB]

BTW, I see that your location is Canada.....

If you are Canadian then do'nt refer to the US as MY country....

If your'e American....then you should be ashamed of yourself

Originally posted by Justmytype
Well Lets see, If you were recently unemployed our goverment (USA) supplies you with "Unemployment Compensation". If you are starving and are unemployed they issue "Food Stamps". If you are un educated they issue grants. So if you are in need, the United States actually stands up and helps us out!

The thing is thats not guaranteed there are aspects of our government that are in favor of doing away with social programs. There are people who believe that the government doesnt owe us anything and that we should fend for ourselves. I dont agree 100% with hes saying he is correct when he says the government doesent care about us out of altruism.

Like and I mean DIRECTLY.. don't give me some hot air about it giving you 'freedom' or 'liberty' or something like that.. because they will also take that away from you right quickly too if they feel its in their interests.. in other words.. they never gave it to you.. its on loan.. maybe until you die.. maybe not.

I totaly agree with your whole post, but i just wanted to point this part out because i find alot of people very misinformed on this topic of "freedom".
Ok now, when you come out of your mother womb, you are FREE. America does NOT give you freedom, what they do is restrict your freedoms less than other countires. Secondly america is not the only "free" country, and its there are other "free" countires that have not been "liberated" by america.
Im not american of course, but hey i live in australia and i tell ya now i see more american tv shows etc than most americans, and i watch good morning america everyday, so i kind of know the american pyshce. ALl i every here is, what great things america has done for its people, it has giving them freedom and liberty.........100 other countires give you freedom and liberty not jsut your own. But america seems to closed off from the rest of the world, that it seems it has been driven deep inside their heads that their country is "the best" and has the most "freedom". Then i turn on the show cops, and their busting a guy for a few grams of marijuana......

People of america dont give thanks to their country, when their country should be thanking them.

First let me say that I am American. And I love my country dearly. But before you go saying how much this country does for its people, let me tell you a story...a true one. 8 Years ago I lost my job, found out I was pregnant, and was in the middle of a hell of a divorce. With nothing, not even a place to live. My car was repoed, and I was fortunate enough to have friends I could call for a place to stay. After moving in with these friends while trying to get back on my feet I applied for everything a homeless, out of work mother to be could, guess what...my country turned me down for every single thing. I mean EVERYTHING. Food stamps, hud & low income housing, as well a medicaid. I still have all the paperwork from every single "government source"
You see if your white and not selling your body, hooked on drugs, or already have fifteen kids with no shoes and snottie noses, your OFL. Thats just the plain and simple truth.
Thank God I did'nt need an education, had one, just no jobs available at that time. When I did start that long climb back up that hill with NO help outside of friends, I told myself that freedom was a reason to stay. Now we have the patriot act and PA2. So I say I stay for the friends dear to my heart. Because I feel like that is no better country in which to raise my children
Just wanted to let you know those homeless that get a resting place for the night, most are drug heads, for those that get fed, you can bet most sold their body on the streets the very same morning, and for those that get those lovable gov grants for education, I have no clue but i'm willing to bet it did'nt come free for most. Like I said "most" Very few legit cases get any type of help at all. And the only white ones have had a lifelong bad history.
Still in all I love my countrymen and women that think with their own minds and not with whats shoved down their throats from congress, the media, and the system.
If you look around you'll see . There are children starving here in America, poverty stricken areas are avoided by everyone, except those that know what its like to do without, and want to help, you know ...those that are'nt afraid of getting dirty or losing one almighty dollar. Our tax dollars go to things outside our country mostly. That saying charity begins at home is BS.
If this post offends anyone, i'm so sorry the truth hurts.

And i decided in which ever country you are from.

I will not defend the "state", the government, because the state exists for the state alone. Not for you, not for me, but simply for itself. Often governments are traitors, and who ever defends the crimes of their government, is no patriot, but a traitor too.

But i will defend my family and my home, if it is invaded. My family is an extension of me, they are a part of me.

I will defend my city, if it was invaded, because my city is my home, and it's people are my family. My city is a part of me.

I will defend my country, if it was invaded, because the country is my home, and it's people are my family. My country is a part of me. Syrian is what i am, so Syria is a part of me.

I will defend this planet, if it was invaded, because the planet is my home, and it's people are my family. This planet is a part of me.

Infact, I will defend and support any country who's people are fighting against invasion and occupation . I will defend what is right always and forever!

BUT i will never transgress! and i will never become the monster i am fighting against.



[edit on 12-5-2005 by Syrian Sister]

[edit on 12-5-2005 by Syrian Sister]

Not to beat a dead animal any worse but I wanted to ask how many of you people have ever known anyone who really was disabled get approved for disability within a timely manner? I ask this because I know a 23 year old girl that got approved after only 8 months because she has asthma. She has a year old son and a part time job. Lives in a low income apartment and had medicaid, foodstamps, and on top of all that gets a check from the government for her son. She drives a 2004 Jeep Liberty.I also know a lady that has many medical problems that really does need it and applied 4 years ago and still waiting. An uncle of mine applied when he was 54 and in need of it more than anyone i've ever known. He was a diabetic and his kidneys were failing, had heart problems, and lung disease...he died two years ago. He was finally approved just three months before his death. He was 61. Tell me there are some stories out there of people being treated better by this fine government of ours? I have a real need to know this.

I for one understand exackly how you feel. The world is in such pityfull shape all around us. I'm not going to say i'd fight for my country, but I would my countrymen and women. Fellow fighters fighting for the same , beside me, moreso for each other.

Well yeah I can understand protecting your neighbours.. IF your country was invaded or something. But whats going on these days? This isn't war for freedom or safety or any usefull and decent or positive change.

But I understand what you are saying.

This though...

I wish the people could take over and start from scratch. Teach every man to live like God intended. Everyone that steals will lose a finger, then a hand, then his/her life. Everyone that murders someone would be publicly hung. For everytime anyone was raped, someone would get death by public beating.

.. that is the stuff that got us in to this mess in the first place. And dude, if you had a country run by the people for the people... sick stuff like what you are talking about would NOT happen. That stuff happens because of the mess we have made (and btw.. it ONLY happens it seems in the US.. other countries have bigger populations.. and do not have those kind of things happen) out of our country and the mess it makes in peoples lives. Some of the stuff the state does man... REALLY drives people insane. It really is abuse in a lot of cases. I won't like.... that the guy doesn't have life in a small room coming to him.... but do you ACTUALLY THINK he is SANE? He isn't.. something DID something to him to make him do that.. think about what is required to DO what he did... that is a major leap that the brain has to take to do that (or that COP who shot his wife and kids today) because when it comes down to basic human nature.. I really don't think that we WANT to hurt each other... I think THAT is what TPTB want us to believe. That there are BAD people by nature.. and I don't think that there are... I think we set people up for thing like that.

I'd bet dollars to donuts that the two guys who did what they did to those defenceless childeren were ALSO abused as childeren. AND I bet they were on some serious medication that probablly was working against them as well.. they usually are.. I mean.. if they had been WELL medicated.. then that stuff wouldn't have happened right?.

Well Lets see, If you were recently unemployed our goverment (USA) supplies you with "Unemployment Compensation". If you are starving and are unemployed they issue "Food Stamps". If you are un educated they issue grants. So if you are in need, the United States actually stands up and helps us out!

Can you please explain to me why so many of the people in the USA are living BELOW the poverty line? The MAJORITY are stuggling like hell to make ends meet.. most of them are in unwinable credit card debit situations. Did you know that the most common reason for bankrupsy is unplanned for medical expencies? In other words.. you get hurt.. you lose your job.. you couldn't even afford insurance in the first place (OR better.. yet.. you use to have a decent life.. then got injured and the insurence ran out.. THEN your family lost everything). BTW, have you ever used any of the services that you are talking about? I hope you never do, because they work VERY poorly and in a lot of cases either not for very long or only for certain people. There are SO MANY insane, homeless people in the USA.. why? And why is a country that is RICH and yet allows that to happen to their population worth fighting or dying for?

Nothing that can do that to someone.. or allow that to continue.. is worth keeping around. They WANT you to THINK there is a social safety net in place but its not in the condition YOU THINK it is.. and Bush is thinking about getting rid of what little there is left or haven't you heard?

And btw... I HAVE IT better then anywhere else on the planet (I'm in Canada) .. I HAVE free health care. Why don't you? You have more people, way more money... your country could afford health care that would make ours look like the dark ages.. but its not implemented for some reason. However.. things are going south.. and whats being done to the USA now in a way was done to my country not to long ago on a smaller scale and over different issues.. but the end result was the same. Less for the people and more for a select few.. and even then.. there were so many people who thought they were part of the select few.. and that THEY had it good. And now some of them can't get operated on in time to save their lives because of the state of our system now (its still not as bad as yours.. still awhile yet before they take our health care away completely).

Besides.. in THIS day and age.. isn't a country that's best solution to MOST problems is to kill and destroy it a thing of the past? So many smart people and none of them are leading any people.. instead there are rich men who failed school leading you.. why is this? Why is THAT worth DYING FOR?!

This one is great...

People like you piss me the hell off!!! You talk so much trash about America and act like your country is soooo isnt.

I never ever ever said my country doesn't have problems (number one being you guys to the south.. but that is another story completely). And actually I'm not picking on any particular country.. I'm asking you if you think that any of the leaders of any of these countries give a god damn about you personally or your family. This women in Indonesia who got caught alledgedly smuggling in pot.. she was set up and everyone knows that. Why is australia not mounting a SERIOUS FREEKING campaign to get her back? You think if it was a US person that the US would be there saying "If you go through with locking up this innoncent women for life or even CONCIDER giving her death then we will cut off millions of dollars in aid and come up with some excuse to bomb the crap out of your capital.. and don't think we haven't done it before.. because you know our record."? No.. they wouldn't do that for you or anyone else. Maybe if you were warren buffet and you got caught with 4 pounds of weed that you were smuggling in to the country at a proffit loss of about $1500 a pound THEN they'd talk to them for you. But otherwise.. no.. they don't care and they are not going to save you either.. no one is going to save her.

Americans can vote right, We have freedom of speech, freedom of whatever...yeah we have our problems and issues....but at least people like me try to make a difference...unlike you.

First of all.. I know people who fight to make a difference daily. ATS is fun but it isn't making a difference in your local community or state or whatever so if that is what you do to make change then.. argh.. anyways. Don't you go judging my activism without knowing me buddy.. you have no idea what I've done to make things better for people.. and I CAN PROOVE and I CAN GET YOU FAMILIES WHO WILL TELL YOU "VIS MEGA MADE MY LIFE BETTER BECAUSE HE STOOD UP!" .. so chill out.. I wasn't even attacking YOU or YOUR COUNTRY.. I was attacking all of them.. specially the ones that want you to go die for them.. they are the last ones that you should do that for.



What bothers me people.. is that we could be doing SO MUCH BETTER right now. Do you not agree? Are you dumb? I don't think you are dumb so lets try something.. pick a problem in the USA.. ANY problem.. think of a BETTER SOLUTION to the problem then the way the problem is currently being dealt with. Just do this on your own spare time later and then ask yourself.. if YOU, someone who is NOT DUMB but also has no REAL training in civil and social structuring.. you are just a 'good' human/citizen .. then if YOU can at least think of a better way to solve the problem that SHOULD work.. shouldn't they be able to figure out a way to solve the problem that WILL work?

And if they can then why are they doing it the way they are doing it now?

The biggest point? War in general.. I mentioned this up a little earlier in the post. I think if a counties BEST way to solve disputes is to kill and destroy. IF THAT is what it has come to.. that THIS is the way we make progress in the 21st century then why is that worth dying for?

If the message that a country sends to its youth is.. "You are SO NOT worth our time.. you are to die for us.. get maimed for us.. we won't even equip you properly for the job. We will reduce your benifits when you get back here too. We'll give you DU poisoning because we could care less if the stuff is toxic or not."

I mean right there.. if they are willing to poison you (or RISK poisoning you in the case of "we are not sure if its bad for you.. use it anyways") then this is an insitution that you want to throw away your life for?

These are ideals that are worth giving up everything you love for?


Do you REALLY think.. that your country is going to be there for you EVEN AFTER you fight and lose ALMOST everything for their goals?

They are cutting vets benifits all over the place.. and you know that so what are you fighting me for on this?



Why die for these people who made things this way? Who HAD the power to MAKE THINGS BETTER and didn't ... just did not care to make things better .. like YOU WOULD if YOU were in power (I know you would.. I am sure you would do a better job.. and I mean any of you.. even ).


For that matter.. why take someone elses life just because people told you to.. people who YOU KNOW won't ONLY lie to you about anything they feel like lying to you about (including why they want you to kill that person) but WOULD PROBABLLY KILL YOU TOO if it suited their needs (just like those 3,000 a couple years back - don't argue with me.. YOU KNOW at the LEAST that they LET it happen.. at the LEAST).


And for the reactionary.. No, I wasn't knocking JUST the USA but I suppose either you have a guilt complex about what your country has done and having to LIVE in a country that is doing that to their own and other people all the while TELLING EVERYONE ELSE what a GREAT THING it is they are doing for those people.. and then you go and repeat it for them on a message board like this. Tell it to the people who were sleeping on the street that you walked over top of when you were doing your shopping for crap you probablly did not need. Then when you get sick and start losing all of your savings you can burn the cheep plastic crap for heat.


We could ALL be doing SO MUCH BETTER.. and yet we NEVER ever allow our species to reach its full potiential.. look at the difference between the haves and have nots...

.. now.. if the difference between the HAVES and the HAVE NOTS was the same as the difference between where we are as a global society today and where we could be (if we got rid of these horrible leaders and these rich men who abuse us and the system) ... if THAT was the size of the difference we could have as a society for the better if we stopped killing each other and stopped allowing each other to be destroyed for the benifit of some rich guy. If the entire world could have what us Candians have up here.. and much much more..

.. now isn't THAT worth dying for?

You said you would die for your fellow man .. fighting beside him for freedom .. you think THAT is going to happen in Iraq? Do you really think that another man is going to invade your country and try to take your land and kill your wife unless he was told to do it by some rich guy? No, he wouldn't.. because he has his own and he is happy and does NOT want to risk his life in an action that might cause him to be killed. Its just the wealthy and greedy that want you to go and kill and be killed so they can get MORE wealth and power. How much do they need? It never will end.

The only thing worth dying for anymore.. is getting rid of these people who are doing this to our planet and to us.

Because we can be so much more. No more dying.. no more unnessesary suffering.. we can fix all of this.. we can make it ALL go away.. for the first time in history we can make EVERY MAN EQUAL! We have the opertunity to do that now! And I assure you it is the only thing worth dying for.. the whole ball of dirt or nothing.

But you know as well as I do.. that.. there isn't much time left.. and we all know it don't we?

So do 'they'.

VMX

PS: this was the serious post for the day.. get the diff now?

"Well yeah I can understand protecting your neighbours.. IF your country was invaded or something. But whats going on these days? This isn't war for freedom or safety or any usefull and decent or positive change."

When you make that distinction i agree with everything you have said!

i comend you on your intelligence!

Excellent post and your absolutely right! I think maybe we should be asking what our country can do for us for a change. Like this guy who held illegal immigrants and made a citizens arrest and now mexico wants to sue him, I dont hear our gov. willing to back him and he's a vet! congressman and people in other high positions dont do enough for us. Let's ut their benefits and make them work for a change.

I never specified any country once so ever in my first post.

But there we go.. within the first two posts or so.. someone telling me that I'm a jerk for hating on the US (or whatever) .. how does that happen when I haven't suggested ANYTHING about anyones country at all? Or my own for that matter?

"Go back to RUSSIA!"

All I asked is "DO YOU BELIEVE.. that YOUR COUNTRY is worth dying for?"

This is the ONE life you get (well maybe not.. but .. you know) .. and you are going to use it to fight in some god forsaken hell hole for someone you don't care about who DOES NOT care about you and kill someone for the same person .. because your COUNTRY doesn't want you there.. neither does the other guys country... neither does he. So why are you there?

All I was asking! Had a point there.. as you can see.

Hope that you payed attention at least ON THE SECOND post.. that was the important one.

Well only to the topic of course.. but I think its VERY interesting how just about all of you took it personally ... one of you even told me to grow up.Are my perceptions not grown up enough for you because I thought ideas like dying for ones country were things only childern and 'special' people thought still actually happened.. I thought the REST of us knew that we were only being asked to die for rich men at this point.. it was a rhetorical question.. but you opened up a whole new can of worms there too. I feel bad for the kids in america if this is how they are being brought up.. and the rest of us too... we are ALL screwed, people.

VMX

PS: Okay yes, I cheated by using the USA as an example.. but its JUST BECAUSE its SO EASY to do it these days! The question was in general though.. and you know that nothing I said about the USA was NOT true. Its all true. You know it. Don't take it all so personally and MAYBE this planet can have a chance.. but only if you get rid of that mentality that your country can't do no wrong.. because it ain't doing any right either.



[edit on 13/5/2005 by Vis Mega]

It exposes the arrogance of some of the US people, who belive themselves to be the only country in the world.

I took your post in the general sense. browny points for me!

One question. You say people that abuse children were prolly abused as a child. These people are repeat offenders....they cannot get better with therapy in most cases, so what do you do? Lock them away till they die, and drive up the taxes of the working class people, or give them that shot that makes death painless? I say since most have been in prision and had therapy and have learned trades, been prayed for, joined the church, ect...and still come out and sexually molest a child, then kill that child ...this person be it man or woman should taken out into the middle of downtown and beaten to death.
Do you have children? How would you feel if someone raped and beat your mother to death? Little sister maybe? Little brother got sexually molested at a church..how would you feel? And what would you want to do about this somebody that has been given more help than a pregnant woman without a home or food? 90 % of the time criminals have way more rights than the victim.
This may very well be the only issue I disagree with you on.
Everything else is like hitting twin nails my man.

Originally posted by Vis Mega
I never specified any country once so ever in my first post.

You didn't have to. Your location given right under your avatar gave you away as "un-American" and likely sparked those comments.

Interesting post.

Blind patriotism is a potent fuel used by those in power to stoke the furnaces of hate and war for their personal gain. Speaking out against the injustices of a certain country sadly makes you "one of them" in many peoples eyes.

[edit on 13-5-2005 by Syrian Sister]