A theory regarding the Mandela Effect seeded in a Neal Stephenson novel..

I'd like to introduce a theory which I've developed off the back of the novel/s I describe below. I placed this post in another thread & it received no responses, but I began to feel strongly that the connection to the matter of the King James Bible is serious enough that we should all be able to review the possibilities ascribed by the books. The principle theory is that through a combination of modern physics understandings & engineering, in tandem with the working of 'real magic' (which I am certain does exist, though I won't go into the reasons why at this point) - the black ops agents of various factions were able to act as described below. So without further ado:

Novel - 'The rise & fall of D.O.D.O.' by Neal Stephenson.. It's a fantasy novel about a government department which learns how to manipulate real magic in the modern age, the most useful aspect of which is the ability of witches, under certain scientific circumstances, being able to send operatives back in time to real historical times & places, in a multiverse of different historical 'strands'..(each strand is a slightly divergent thread of the historical narrative, different timelines which evolve separately - some are close to our reality, some are very different..) The idea is that the operatives repeatedly travel back to the same time & place, with the same mission, each time arriving on a different 'strand', which may entail history being ever so slightly different than the previous strand visited in the pursuit of the mission. The operative then must carry out some small, specific activity which will spawn a beneficial 'butterfly effect' which propagates desirable changes in the historical timeline of your own strand, all the way into the future. Various effects ensue, various adventures are conducted, and various things are changed & counterchanged as the opposing factions compete in their attempt to control the historical narrative.

To me, aside from being a great premise for an enjoyable novel, this felt like Neal Stephenson (a very intelligent, genius, polymath - a specialist in the research of multiple complex subjects) - basically addressing the Mandela Effect 'conspiracy theory'.. I believe that he himself may in fact be a Mandela Effect experiencer, though of course he does not name the theory or publicly acknowledge that he experiences the effect. Through the medium of his novel, he sets out possible explanations for how these weird changes are coming into being, and the reason for very small, seemingly inconsequential changes made by the operatives in the historical timeline on several strands, which in the long term on your own strand results in much bigger changes, such as the relocation of a border, the relocation of an important historical battle, a change in ownership of certain valuable items, shifts in political power structures, changes to the words of holy Scripture, changes in the dominance of the nation as compared to other superpowers, and so on.

I have had a suspicion that black ops military activities have something to do with the Mandela Effect in our universe, 'on our strand', and so although this novel is a somewhat quaint & playful treatment of the topic, it may very well be the case tht this genius polymath has come closer than any of us to answering the 'how' of the Mandela Effect - deliberate tampering with the timeline by the use of advanced technology, done by black ops teams by changing small events in the historical past on many strands, black budget operatives in covert military organisations with connections to the highest levels of scientific research in the realm of physics & engineering - all with the intent of increasing the dominance of the US superpower hegemony in our modern world.

If you review the Bible, there is a warning in the final book, in the final verses, the 'Book of the Revelation of St John', a specific instruction - that nobody should attempt to change the words in the holy Scripture, that dire punishment would await any who did so. In fact, in one specific translation - the King James Bible - there have been some remarkable, striking changes of the Mandela Effect type, which millions of people can verify based on their very specific, lifelong memorisation of myriad Scriptural verses over the course of their religious studies over many years. To suddenly see such changes is deeply troubling, but it seems that God specifically warned of the possibility that one day people would be able to tamper with the timeline, and thus the words of the most important book in the world, in the final verse of that very book...

"For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book."

Revelation 22: 18-19

It is perhaps worth noting that in Neal Stephenson's novel (and the follow up 'Master of Revels' by his co-author) focus heavily on the period of English history when King James was on the throne - the whole of the books is mostly focused around matters which ultimately pertain to the court of King James. I don't think this is a coincidence - I think it is a sign of his truly held beliefs concerning the impact & nature of the Mandela Effect. Changing the words of holy scripture is sure to have had huge effects on the world we live in - but because most people dn't remember the original words, and because we have only the reality before us to review in trying to understand the matter, we shall never know what reality we shared before on this strand, before the changes to scripture (combined with the butterfly effect of other random, small changes) - we shall never know what has changed as compared to that former reality, because the moment something changes in the past, as we dream in the night te changes are wrought on our strand, and we awaken to a world which potentially, has shifted in its nature quite radically while we dreamt in the land of Nod.

Serious stuff - existential paradoxes abound."

I may try to add some of the proposed changes wrought in the King James Bible translation at some point in the thread - but I should also make you aware that even though almost all other translations were created by reference to the King James version, newer versions do NOT record many of the REALLY weird changes which made it into the King James Version. To me this strengthen the hypothesis that the changes were wrought artificially by manipulating the timeline specifically regarding that one translation - but the changes didn't 'take' in later translations which were based on the original KJV translation.

Let me know your thoughts!

For the sake of avoiding boredom I'm less likely to be inclined to respond to people who insist that the experiencers of Mandela Effect are all insane or stupid mis-rememberers.. I don't really care if you don't like that because I'm solely interested in sharing theories & ideas, debating intelligently - not deflecting idiocy which is posted to make the person involved feel clever by denigrating the intellectual capabilities of people they've never met.

I find the Mandela effect fascinating. I personally remember Berenstein bears, the fruit of the loom Cornucopia and several others. I don't have a working theory but it is strange that so many people would "misremember" such things.

Really cool thread dude. I would like to read it for myself. Whether Neal is an "effected" or not, he certainly seems to be aware of ME according to your description.

My current belief is that both sides of a Mandela Effect may be right. Or rather It was spelled Berenstein, but it was also spelled Berenstain (add in Bernstein and Bernstain). That isn't a satisfying answer, and I certainly can't explain the mechanism behind it.

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

After repeated badgering from my brother I have just started reading Quicksilver by Neal Stephenson.
He certainly has a unique style of writing and his books appear to be quite complex.

I suspect I'll end up reading all his books.

I'm not too sure about The Mandela Effect or Stephenson's belief in it, I'm just enjoying reading his book.

Sometimes we have a tendency to over analyse things.

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

The other day I had the most profound Mandela effect of my life, so much so I wanted to do research on it.
I was distracted and then I could not for the life of me remember what it was. It has been bothering me ever since.

It was something that I remember so clearly as being one way growing up but now everyone is saying it another way. It was not any of the common ones either like Bernstein, or fruit of the loom etc.

If I can remember it I’ll post! The weird thing is that I don’t often forget things like that… so that is weird in itself.

a reply to: JAGStorm

It wasn’t that men can be women was it?

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

The thing about a digitised world is you don’t have to go back in time to re-write history. This seems to be the way it is and will be done.

Black ops have definitely experimented with magic and the paranormal, but if they could time travel and slightly alter events how would they be sure they would get the pacific outcome they desire? Just imagine the myriad of possibilities, I doubt it’s possible to calculate the outcomes.

It’s a cool theory you put forward though, I remember the seen from bond where Jaws with the metal teeth falls in love with the girl with braces when they smile at each other. Apparently she never had braces... but her having braces was the whole point to the scene and their connection.

What if the Mandela effect is itself a psy op created to confound people’s trust in their memories? I’ve seen Wikipedia altered before my practically so it is a thing.

c3po's leg being part 'silver'....?? was always gold all over from my recollection....??

Great thread, I think Neil Stephenson is channeling something special...

ever since I read the Diamond Age I have been a fan. That book described the now.

The Illustrated Primer (iPAD)

Nano tech - but also in the book there was a tribe of people who could hack into the net using "seers" and ritual, to manipulate data.

I hadn't heard of this book but I will now have to read it.

originally posted by: surfer_soul
a reply to: JAGStorm

It wasn’t that men can be women was it?

Bahahahaha.... Awesome.

But yeah, we seem to have landed in crazy dimension haven't we?

a reply to: surfer_soul

Have you witnessed a flip-flop?

originally posted by: AcerM
a reply to: surfer_soul

Have you witnessed a flip-flop?

I have witnessed 2.

The statue, The Thinker, by Rodin has changed at least 2 times, in the last 5 years.

Also, "Houston, we have a problem", has changed 2 times.

I found an obscure one, a few weeks ago.

There is a band called The Atlanta Rhythm Section.

I worked in a record store, in the '70's, and I POSITIVELY remember the band's name as being The Atlantic Rhythm Section.

They are best known for their hit, SPOOKY.

I have found several instances of "residue" on the web.

a reply to: JAGStorm

Originally posted by JAGStorm
The other day I had the most profound Mandela effect of my life, so much so I wanted to do research on it.
I was distracted and then I could not for the life of me remember what it was. It has been bothering me ever since.

A good trick to jog the memory is to think back to that exact time…like what were you doing…and thinking. Maybe even sit in the same location…keep the same posture etc…and see what springs to mind…

I do something similar when I can’t remember a dream I’ve had…I’ll go back and lie on my bed and just try to focus on what I can remember…too see what else begins to unfold in my memory…

- JC

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

Originally posted by FlyInTheOintment
being able to send operatives back in time to real historical times & places, in a multiverse of different historical 'strands'..

The thing is, these “back in time” travel possibilities only take place in another multiverse…so they shouldn’t actually affect the real universe you belong too…

If these multiverses however could be peered into to see what a likely outcome might be…then we could then try to change or prevent something similar happening in our own world/universe…but if that’s the case then surely other multiverses would be doing the same thing (looking ahead)…which kind of leads to a paradox in itself…

Imagine if you travel psychically back in time or forward in time into another multiverse…and your other multiverse selves do the same thing. This could possibly create some kind of crazy ripple effect…that could literally produce chaos!

- JC

a reply to: Joecroft

Just having fun with ideas here, rather than trying to argue a point. I suspect that if we ever have the ability to "time travel" the way our media portrays, it won't be physical time travel as you are suggesting there seems to be issues with it. I suspect it will just be information alone traveling forward or backward in time. I personally believe that information may exist outside of space-time to begin with so it isn't traveling forward or backward as much as just accessed in a way that it appears to travel backward or forward in time.

I have nothing to base this on other than a hunch though.

a reply to: sputniksteve

Originally posted by sputniksteve
Just having fun with ideas here, rather than trying to argue a point. I suspect that if we ever have the ability to "time travel" the way our media portrays, it won't be physical time travel as you are suggesting there seems to be issues with it.

Well, my post talked about both physical time travel (into multiverses) and peering into multiverses…and by peering into…I meant non physical travel…not sure if I got that across effectively…but that’s what I meant…

But Yeah, I agree with you about the physical form of time travel, because I believe it would create to many potential problems with Paradoxes…split timelines…ripple effects and so forth, within various multiverses…just looks too risky imo…

Originally posted by sputniksteve
I suspect it will just be information alone traveling forward or backward in time. I personally believe that information may exist outside of space-time to begin with so it isn't traveling forward or backward as much as just accessed in a way that it appears to travel backward or forward in time.

I have nothing to base this on other than a hunch though.

Absolutely a lot of this stuff is hypothetical…

In my second paragraph (2nd post) the paradox I was alluding too was the following…

Let’s just say there’s a Multiverse that has a world very similar to ours but only it’s…let’s say…2 months ahead of our timeline…we find a way to peer into it…to see what to avoid etc…but what if that same world peered into another Multiverse itself and found a similar world 2 months ahead of it’s timeline etc…and so on and so on lol…And this can work in either direction i.e. the ones 2 months behind us…viewing our timeline!

The question that naturally arises…is when/how did the first correction take place…It becomes like a chicken before the egg type Paradox…

Anyway, I hope that all makes sense…as this is all hypothetical at the end of the day…

- JC

That actually makes sense to me, as water is supposed to have some sort of memory or transmission with data…..no idea where I read that though…..

a reply to: sputniksteve

a reply to: YesTodayTomorrow

Neil Stephenson

I thought we were talking about Neal Stephenson.

In any case, I looked at the photos of this guy, and ... he doesn't ooze charismatic spiritual wisdom, more of a 'Evil B-movie villain'-look with the bald head and the devil-beard.

Maybe I am judging the book by its cover, but a bad tree can't produce a good fruit.

The Mandela Effect is what it is, it can't be solved by 'new theories' and it can't be 'proven' positively or negatively.

The only thing that can be pointed to as SOME kind of flimsy evidence at least, is the 'residue', which I have found plenty of. The only real function of such residue, however, is just to soothe the mind of the victim of Mandela-Effect, to make them realize they're not alone, to give some, however small glimmer of HOPE that something really did change and the sufferer is not crazy, and that some day, there will be a satisfying explanation.

Even if I try to make it all just fiction, and let myself completely free to think of anything, however impossible, I STILL can't figure out how to explain Mandela Effect - that's the most frustrating part about it. If there was at least a plausible explanation, even if a little flimsy, it would help psychologically a lot. It wouldn't convince the deniers, of course, but nothing could.