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Proverbial characters; The Troublemaker

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posted on Apr, 12 2019 @ 05:00 PM
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The collector of the Old Testament Proverbs makes his purpose clear from the beginning.
“That men may know wisdom and instruction, understand words of insight” (ch1 v2).
Then he further defines this wisdom as “fear of the Lord” (v7). This phrase, when used in the Bible, means respect and willingness to obey.
I’m studying the different characters of Proverbs, as one way of organising and understanding the teaching

The Wise Man, by definition, is the man who understands “fear of the Lord”, and the Fool, by definition, is the man who does not.
The Fool gives himself away when he opens his mouth.
One of the frequent effects of his use of the tongue is that he stirs up trouble;

A common starting-point is the lie, which God hates;
“Lying lips are an abomination to the Lord, but those who act faithfully are his delight” (ch12 v22).
He hates them because of their social effects;
“A lying tongue hates its victims, and a flattering mouth brings ruin” (ch26 v28).
Therefore these people have no share in the future which he intends for the righteous;
“Truthful lips endure for ever, but the lying tongue is but for a moment” (ch12 v19).

So nobody who understands the wisdom of God will engage in slander;
“He who utters slander is a fool” (ch10 v18).
“One who speaks foolishly” is also the description of the man who “goes about gossiping and revealing secrets” (ch20 v19).
“He who goes about as a talebearer reveals secrets, but he who is trustworthy in spirit keeps a thing hidden” (ch11 vv12-12).
For there are some things, relating to personal affairs, which ought not to be spread about even if they are true.
This behaviour should be avoided because it is a cause of strife;
“The north wind brings rain, and a backbiting tongue, angry looks” -ch25 v23

Proverbs is eloquent on the insidious effects of slanderous gossip;
“The words of a whisperer are like delicious morsels; they go down into the inner parts of the body” (ch18 v8).
It works best when the people receiving the gossip have the same evil intentions as the people giving it out;
“An evildoer listens to wicked lips, and a liar gives heed to a mischievous tongue” (ch17 v4).
The effect is to alienate people from one another and provoke friction;
“A perverse man spreads strife, and a whisperer separates close friends” (ch16 v28).
Similarly a “bad messenger” plunges men into trouble (by distorting their understanding of each other?), while “a faithful envoy brings healing” (ch13 v17).
In fact there’s a reasonable possibility that strife would die down if people would stop stirring it up;
“For lack of wood the fire goes out; and where there is no whisperer, quarrelling ceases.
As charcoal to hot embers and wood to fire, so is a quarrelsome man for kindling strife” (ch26 vv20-21).

Of course the most dangerous kind of liar is the one who appears in court.
The character of the evidence follows on from the character of the witness;
“He who speaks the truth gives honest evidence, but a false witness utters deceit” (ch12 v17).
In fact a false witness “breathes out” lies (ch14 v5). That is, they are part of the very life that is in him.
A worthless or lying witness “mocks at” justice (ch19 v28), he betrays lives instead of saving them like the truthful witness (ch14 v25), and he is like a war club, a sword or a sharp arrow directed against his neighbour (ch25 v18).
We are told that “A false witness will not go unpunished, and he who utters lies will not escape” -ch19 v5
And again; “A false witness will perish, but the word of a man who hears will endure” ch21 v28
That last contrast implies that the way men speak, in truth or falsehood, reflects whether they have or have not heard “the truth” from God.

That is one way of detecting the difference between wisdom and folly, between righteousness and unrighteousness.
“A fool’s lips bring strife, and his mouth invites a flogging.
A fool’s mouth is his ruin and his lips are a snare to himself” (ch18 vv6-7).




posted on Apr, 12 2019 @ 06:14 PM
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I'd say the fool is the person that fears your god. There is no wisdom in fearing something that doesn't exist.



posted on Apr, 13 2019 @ 12:03 AM
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a reply to: DISRAELI
Oh ya, troublemakers indeed. Like the guy who wrote the bible. And the people who latter revised it. Tsk tsk, troublemakers indeed. But hey all religions go from prophets to profits. It is the way of the world.



posted on Apr, 13 2019 @ 03:12 AM
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a reply to: galadofwarthethird
The subject of the next thread in this series is "The Friend". I'm not sure how far "responding to the title alone" will get you on that one.



posted on Apr, 13 2019 @ 03:34 AM
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a reply to: trustmeimdoctor
You were covered a couple of threads back, under the heading of "scoffer".



posted on Apr, 13 2019 @ 08:18 AM
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Religions need to be edited to not exclude gay people. Nearly all religions do this.



posted on Apr, 13 2019 @ 08:32 AM
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a reply to: Trucker1
Not relevant to the topic of the thread. You might try reading the opening post.



posted on Apr, 13 2019 @ 11:49 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI
Should you be so lucky that I would respond to another such thread. But anyways, you may want to flush out your thread a bit, you know explain a bit more on why you posted random quotes and why...Just saying.

But hey, Confucius say...Many arguments have two sides, but no end. Confucius is also fond of saying...Sumo wrestling is survival of the fattest.

True wisdom indeed. Do you not agree?



posted on Apr, 14 2019 @ 12:48 AM
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a reply to: galadofwarthethird
Not random They are expressing a human character as described in the book of Proverbs, and I said so in the opening paragraph.



posted on Apr, 14 2019 @ 01:48 AM
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a reply to: DISRAELI
You did no such thing. You merely hinted at it, in fact not even that. Its more like some guy mumbling to himself.

I congratulate you, few have achieved such a feat as mumbling to themselves, only in writing form.

Or maybe. Have you thought, that maybe your just bad at communicating things through?

But anyways, here is the kicker. What if there is more wisdom on what Confucius said about sumo wrestlers then in all you fancy bible quotes?



posted on Apr, 14 2019 @ 02:58 AM
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a reply to: galadofwarthethird

I’m studying the different characters of Proverbs, as one way of organising and understanding the teaching.



posted on Apr, 14 2019 @ 08:33 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

Yes. And you know what. I have looked at these sayings, or characters in proverbs as you say. And its funny that the majority of it still stands as truth for a great majority. A bizarre state of affairs I suppose, when stuff from ages and ages ago still pertains. But then again its not surprising.

But then. I thought on what Confucius said. Is sumo really the survival of the fattest? Now as we know sumo wrestlers are some of the best athletes in the world at what they do. And I suppose in that small ring they go at it, the fattest would have an advantage. But make the ring a bit wider, and stick a skinny 180 pound guy in there, and well with a bit of room to move, would not be that hard to get out of the way of a 500 plus size guy way and trip him out of bounds.

They would probably run out of breath trying to catch him. Would not be able to push him out unless he is stupid enough to engage in a pushing contest, so the only option is to pick him up an throw him out of bounds. And well easier said then done when you get tired going up the stairs to reach the bathroom. It would be a game that can be played all day, to no avail.

So sumo, may be survival of the fattest, but only under its context and current rules. Context I suppose and the size of a ring make all the difference.




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