Has anyone asked Teachers what they want?

originally posted by: UpIsNowDown
I doubt they want arming, I have worked in education and would not want 90% of the other teachers holding a weapon during any class.

No justifying losing control but it happens, would a gun have helped in this situation

maybe the "teacher" could have just pistol whipped him

Teacher body slams student

guns in school is not the answer, I seriuosly can not fathom how far from the norm that idea is, but hey its America, land of the "free"

Teachers were probably armed all the way into the 70's or 80's.

originally posted by: Mandroid7

originally posted by: knoxie
a reply to: neo96


maybe as a responsible gun owner you should do something about all those who aren't responsible! ffs.

Hey, if you can't have an honest conversation, maybe you should gtfo.

Putting the blame on a lawful gun owner is pure bs.

Yep.

The fifth amendment got trolled hard.

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime,unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

www.law.cornell.edu...

My oldest son is a teacher. He teaches the kinds of kids that do these things (he teaches "Behavioral" classes, handling kids with behavioral issues that cause them to disrupt normal classrooms). Ill share his thoughts (as a gay liberal raised by me):

- teachers who are comfortable carrying a gun, and already have the CCW, should be allowed to keep a gun locked in the classroom or secured on the person.
- he is horrified that schools would have doors that are able to be open from the outside. This is a breakdown in security that puts full culpability on the school
- he is horrified that once someone breaches the outside doors, there is no response to stop them before they gain access to stairwells and central hallways
- he thinks that there should be more officers there, but not policing students (he thinks students are threatened too much with police as it is)
- he mentions the comment by the parent last night that the US Dept of Education has security guards, but the schools they administer do not.

he would not be one carrying a gun, as he just doesn't like them. He has a .380 i bought him, but he has left it with me at my house. He has spent time on a range, and can handle a firearm (but is a terrible shot as he never practiced enough to gain aptitude). He is one of the ones wanting more gun control, but doesn't have any novel ideas that you guys haven't heard before.

ETA: forgot to add...he thinks parents need to be held legally responsible for failing their children. Not sure that is do-able...but i get where he is coming from after hearing some of his stories.

originally posted by: neo96
Has anyone asked me WHAT I WANT?

I have committed no crime.

So why I am being held answerable to a capital or otherwise infamous crime I had nothing to do with is beyond me.

This is the perfect example of what is wrong with the American society. It's all about ME ME ME ME.
Sometimes I wonder what purpose of America is? Most of you lack empathy for your fellow citizens. You arm yourself because you don't trust your fellow countrymen.
Dying society

Before arming teachers, how about come up with some kind of containment system for school shooters? Maybe like an emergency button that locks all classrooms down in the event something is happening.

If the shooters can't get into any classrooms that would probably save some lives. It isn't perfect, but it would definitely be a start.

a reply to: underwerks

Yeah, I don't get it, we even had magnetic locks both ways back in 1991 in my school.

I've never been a teacher myself, but I belong to what amounts to a dynasty of teachers, on both sides of the family.
Apart from the rights and wrongs, wielding a gun is a separate skill-set in its own right.
I would say; this is not a skill that should be required of teachers, and it would not be easy to make it normal practice without turning it into an expectation. Let them concentrate on the different skills required for their calling.

originally posted by: underwerks
Before arming teachers, how about come up with some kind of containment system for school shooters? Maybe like an emergency button that locks all classrooms down in the event something is happening.

If the shooters can't get into any classrooms that would probably save some lives. It isn't perfect, but it would definitely be a start.

How much would such arrangement cost?

When I was in Jr. high in 1972 we had a shooting after school.

Some kid ran home got his rifle and pumped two rounds out.

He hit his tormentor twice in the a$$.

The difference was the Media. They didn't put it on the TV.

There were no Specials, meetings or discussions or scorecards.

So, this is not new. They just have better guns.

a reply to: ErrorErrorError

This is the perfect example of what is wrong with the American society. It's all about ME ME ME ME.

There's no problem with that.

We were founded as a state that's suppose preserve individual RIGHTS.

Don't like it?

Sieg Heil.

a reply to: ErrorErrorError

Magnet locks? Idk 300 per door a grand to wire it to a button.

I would install it for that price. They just bolt to the existing door frame on top.
Drill 4 holes, throw in 4 security bolts and wire to a power source and switch in office. Everyone has radios, the office can do a lockdown.

originally posted by: ErrorErrorError

originally posted by: underwerks
Before arming teachers, how about come up with some kind of containment system for school shooters? Maybe like an emergency button that locks all classrooms down in the event something is happening.

If the shooters can't get into any classrooms that would probably save some lives. It isn't perfect, but it would definitely be a start.

How much would such arrangement cost?

I have no idea. However expensive it may be, when it's kids safety we're talking about we probably shouldn't bargain shop for solutions.

a reply to: Reydelsol

The head of the NRA said that only a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun. I digress. With rampant PTSD, a good guy can flip out to become a real danger. So why not have it changed to "Two good guys with a gun, can stop one bad guy with a gun"? I'm thinking of a Bio metric gun safe which requires two right hand/finger prints to open the case. The Teacher or Staff member, who is trained, can open one side, but another generic right hand print is needed to finish opening the case.

Nothing is idiot proof, but like a Minuteman Missile Launch drill, it would take two people, "to turn that key", so to speak. So if the stray teacher or school Staff, went bonkers, his gun would stay out of reach. And that safe would have to be tethered to a reinforced metal desk, so it didn't "walk off". Two school Staffers could get together, when no students are present, to open and service these weapons.

I calculated that Stoneman High School might need as many as forty to fifty guns in biometric, two right hands, gun safes, in order to back up their lone armed school guard. In my math, that works out to around $50K, plus the costs of affixing these safes to myriads of metal desks, so that these firearms cannot be "Liberated"!

Putting this into Naval context, Locking down Schools' perimeters, is like a Battleship's shell plates. Putting biometric gun safes, in Teachers' desks is more like the "Barbettes" beneath the naval rifles, in light to medium, Battle Cruisers. Outside their barbettes, these light merchant cruisers were just like any other merchant ships.

You don't have the element of surprise in a School setting, so you need some serious repellent. Putting up, " Death Valley ", signs in front of schools, makes more sense to me, than using "Gun Free" signs to ward off troubles. Being caught with an unauthorized firearm inside a school, would mean being shot down, period. Since concealed weapons need the element of surprise, there couldn't be any "warning shots", or put you hands up, demands. Only leaving, "hot lead", to restore tranquility.

a reply to: carpooler

Ok, let's say you arm the teachers, now let's say you have 50 teachers with guns chasing down a suspect, and now the police and swat are on scene, how the heck do they know who the shooter is. What if the shooter looks like a teacher, what if the shooter is a teacher?? Does it turn into a scene from the wild west? I just don't think this is the answer.

a reply to: JAGStorm

What they want is irrelevant without choice.

That's not meant to belittle teachers, it's to make the point that without the choice to be armed or not, their desires are irrelevant because choice is removed.

Currently, I know more than a few teachers who would absolutely take on the responsibility to carry a firearm in their classroom, and who have had a CCDW license for years already. But they cannot, because the district or state removes their choice, and many might say their right.

And like has been noted at least in the first response to this, it's not only about the teachers.

So, if you are a teacher and you are irrationally afraid of licensed, trained people in your same profession having firearms on their person--oh f**king well, because it's not only about you, and you really need to consider the fact that, just maybe, if the psycho ever hits the campus, you'll prefer the immediate response of someone on-site from the start than having to wait precious minutes for the first government-paid guy with a gun to show up.

If you are someone who is anti-choice on this measure, you have very little to stand on, both statistically and logically. No one is forcing you to carry a firearm, just like no one should be forcing those who are willing and capable not to do so.

This is the American Way, this is your precious democratic republic, let other people tell you what to do, how to 'live' and what should or should not be "legal", imposing morality based on "Religion" or worthless pieces of paper, but "Vote" because "Muh Democracy"

Do Teachers want to be armed and go through training and be in a position of a school shooting and them potentially not being able to do anything?

doesn't matter, "own the Libs' socialist, Commies...


doesn't matter, own the "Right" they are authoritarians, we are a better version, with gun control and other worthless reformist positions


meanwhile, the people of the moment who are getting exploited for political power have no say

A RAISE! GIVE THOSE PPL A RAISE

or you're not gonna have any left

Teachers publicly saying they don't want guns, is why you should home school your kids. It shows the big government/fascist/communist/group think of some teachers. Just because the government says you can do something, one still has the choice not to. Every teacher does not need to be armed to protect the school, only the possibility of every teacher is what's needed. If a student turned shooter knows who doesn't like guns, guess what room they will pick

a reply to: Jubei42

We can just make all the people on welfare work as teachers.

a reply to: SlapMonkey

I don't think a ccl means you can shoot in a crisis. I think that class is a different classification and should have monthly maintenance.

Ccl is for getting mugged as far as the test. Ccl weapons areally mostly small barrel innacruate guns and most don't even have very good sights as they hang up on clothing or in purses.