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Don't forget that the ones who lose the most in wars are always the civilians who live nearby. It's their neighborhoods, workplaces, roads, bridges, and property that always gets ravaged (not to mention the obvious deaths among them, their families, and their neighbors).
(Sigh...) I wanted to like the Saudi Crown Prince because I like his modernization efforts & pro-women's rights reforms. But he's looking more and more like a common warmonger.
Yeah, I just don't agree with brushing them all with the same brush like that.
I can cast the same kinds of judgment on the warmonger families right here, especially the ones here in the South (where I live) that know they have slaveowners in their lineage. And the ones who willingly hire and exploit undocumented workers. And the ones who have family members in the KKK, street gangs, organized groups groups, etc. Guilt by association works both ways.
originally posted by: CranialSponge
This sh** is starting to get real over the past few days folks.
The positions of President Michel Aoun and Parliament Speaker Nabih Berri coincide with the crisis of the resignation of President Saad Hariri from Riyadh and his detention as a hostage by the rulers of Saudi Arabia. This full harmony between the two heads of state reflects a cohesion at the level of the Lebanese state and at the grassroots level, embracing the political forces of the Hariri family and ensuring the return of the kidnapped prime minister before looking into anything else.
Bari boycotted yesterday, with Aoun's positions before the delegation of economic bodies and the delegation of the General Workers' Union, where Aoun said during the meeting that "Hariri is being held by Saudi Arabia." For his part, Berri stressed that he is waiting for Hariri to return from Riyadh and that "if he returns and resigns in accordance with the constitutional framework, then he will build on the matter." He repeated that "Hariri is not resigned", more than once, and that "what happened is a precedent, a prime minister with immunity under the Vienna Convention. Had he announced his resignation from here, his resignation would have been constitutional and a window. " Asked if Hariri would not return soon, he said: "Our patience is long, we wait 20,30, 50 days ... our patience is long. We want regularity of relations with all Arab countries, and we were not the initiators of what is going on ». On the repercussions of sanctions and economic pressures on Lebanon, the Speaker of the House of Representatives responded with much confidence that "we have gone through many of these circumstances and under economic pressure. Lebanon is stronger than America if we are united and weakened from the spider's web if we are scattered. "
Those concerned that he may have been pressured or even detained by Saudi Arabia — including Lebanese officials, Western diplomats and some of Mr. Hariri’s political allies — were unlikely to be convinced by anything short of his return to Lebanon. Adding to their suspicions, Mr. Hariri’s resignation came on the same day that the assertive Saudi crown prince, Mohammad bin Salman, oversaw the arrests of hundreds of Saudis in what he says is a corruption crackdown and critics say amounts to a purge.
The resignation announcement was widely seen as a Saudi effort to bring down the coalition government in which Mr. Hariri served along with representatives of the Hezbollah, a Shiite militia and political party — and an ally of Iran. At least five Lebanese television stations refused to carry Sunday’s interview, saying it was still unclear whether Mr. Hariri was able to speak freely.
Lebanon’s president, Michel Aoun, had said earlier that anything Mr. Hariri says from Saudi Arabia “does not reflect the truth, and is but the result of the mysterious and dubious situation he is undergoing in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, and hence cannot be taken seriously.” “I’m free, I could leave tomorrow,” Mr. Hariri told Ms. Yacoubian. He added, however, that information had come to light while he was in Riyadh that persuaded him that he needed to review his security arrangements before returning. Lebanese authorities have said they have no information about a plot against him.
Hariri’s Resignation as Prime Minister of Lebanon is Not All it Seems He certainly did not anticipate what happened to him. Indeed, Hariri had scheduled meetings in Beirut on the following Monday – with the IMF, the World Bank and a series of discussions on water quality improvement; not exactly the action of a man who planned to resign his premiership By Robert Fisk - Beirut
The Saudi paper describes the issues and process steps towards a deal in five points: First: The Saudis demand a "parity of the relationship" between Israel and Saudi Arabia. On the military level they demand that either Israel gives up on its nuclear weapons or Saudi Arabia is itself allowed to acquire such. Second: In exchange Saudi Arabia will use its diplomatic and economic power to push through a 'peace plan' between Israel, the Palestinians and Arab countries along the lines that the U.S. will lay out. Within such a peace plan the Saudis, according to the memo, are willing to make extraordinary concessions: The city of Jerusalem would not become capital of a Palestinian state but be subjected to a special international regime administered by the United Nations. The right of return for Palestinian refugees, who were violently expelled by the Zionists, would be given up on. The refugees would be integrated as citizens of those countries where they currently reside. (No demand for full sovereignty of a Palestinian state is mentioned.)
Third: After reaching an agreement of the "main principles of the final solution" for Palestine between Saudi Arabia and the U.S. (Israel), a meeting of all foreign ministers of the region would be convened to back these up. Final negotiations would follow. Fourth: In coordination and cooperation with Israel Saudi Arabia would use its economic power to convince the Arab public of the plan. The point correctly notes "At the beginning of normalizing relations with Israel, normalization will not be acceptable to public opinion in the Arab world." The plan is thus to essentially bribe the Arab public into accepting it. Fifth: The Palestinian conflict distracts from the real issue the Saudi rulers have in the region which is Iran: "Therefore, the Saudi and Israeli sides agree on the following: Contribute to counter any activities that serve Iran's aggressive policies in the Middle East. Saudi Arabia's affinity with Israel must be matched by a sincere American approach against Iran. Increase US and international sanctions related to Iranian ballistic missiles. Increase sanctions on Iran's sponsorship of terrorism around the world. Re-examination of the group (five + 1) in the nuclear agreement with Iran to ensure the implementation of its terms literally and strictly. Limiting Iran's access to its frozen assets and exploiting Iran's deteriorating economic situation and marketing it to increase pressure on the Iranian regime from within. Intensive intelligence cooperation in the fight against organized crime and drug trafficking supported by Iran and Hezbollah." The memo is signed by Adel al-Jubeir. (But who were the 'advisors' who dictated it to him?)
First, any rapprochement between the Kingdom and Israel depends on the parity of the relationship between the two countries. At the military level, Israel is the only country possessing nuclear weapons in the Middle East, which gives it a factor of superiority in regional balance of power. Therefore, the Kingdom should be allowed to possess such deterrent elements Or Israel's demilitarization.