Great Speech on Where we are as a Nation and Where it's Headed

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: mOjOm

About what time does the trump diatribe stop?

Maybe I'll try again in a bit.

In return, I kindly offer:

This may sound a bit off, but this is why the domestic gangs are in cahoots with the US govt. They are the ones that are changing the rules of freedom for the American people. I'm a bit too tired to go into detail, but, just think, the FBI and local police know the gangs, why are they allowed to exist, to help the politicians take away the rights of the population. Can't you all see it happening in front of you. Kill off the gangs and you'll (US) will regain your freedom.
I understand now one must have a passport to travel domestically in the States. I always said, when China gains its freedom, the US citizens will lose theirs. Am I right or wrong here?

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

BS. That's totally intellectually dishonest of you and I won't bother even discussing it with you.

You are one member that I thought might actually respect the idea of debate or discussion. Or just maybe show me enough respect to at least try and come at this with some kind of integrity.

But I can see it won't happen. I mean just looking at your history of posting here you're hardly a man of few words. Until now of course when the intent is one of simply shutting down a conversation rather than engaging in one.

Well that's fine. But I'd rather you not fake some attempt at all. Just ignore the thread from here on if you don't mind. It's been noted that you disagree. Great. I'll put that in my log. You no longer needed and free to go about something else.

a reply to: mOjOm

I’m talking about Hedges and his speech; you’re talking about me. It wasn’t going to be a discussion anyways.

originally posted by: 3daysgone

Everything. Marx was speaking about only a capitalistic situation with no socialistic situation to contain it. We are a capitalistic and socialistic society.

Cool. I'm getting excited now actually!! Not only are you addressing what was said but even have some reason for why you think it's incorrect.

I'd give you a damn cookie if I could at this point!! But just wait a bit until we dig into some of this stuff. I really want to talk about that opening quote too. But not just yet. Let's allow some listeners to listen first before we jump in. Also, I'm making dinner. Man's gotta eat ya know. But we'll get into this soon. If you want.

a reply to: mOjOm

I won't listen to an hour long political sermon by anyone. I skimmed instead.

He makes points I would have expected 90% of ATSsers to agree with. He says the Liberal elites and Trump administration are equally guilty of refusing to condemn corporate elites. 'Marginalising reality' is how he describes the actions of Trump and the Liberals as they both use deflections to distract the population from real issues that directly affect us all. Trump is quick to get people frothing about the cost of illegals and the Dems are all about the Russians. Both sides are responsible for creating and publicising fake news and teasing away the public from reality.

As long as these opposing political classes keep drawing our attention to scapegoats, the corporate machinery will continue to avoid taxes and bankers will constantly jeopardise the economies of the world. The democratic institutions have lost all credibility and the public are in a state of existential angst at the collective inability to cause actual change.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

No, not about Hedges. I don't care about Hedges. I'm talking about the material in his speech. Hedges is a man who's done and said many things. Not all of them are correct or incorrect. I'm not interested in the man who said them, just what is being said.

I don't for one second buy that every single thing that he says you disagree with. So much of his speech is on the failure of Liberal and Neo Liberal Policy which has infected Government that you couldn't possibly disagree with completely.

Unless of course you're going to try and tell me you're a proponent of Neo Liberal Corporate Power dominating the planet.

a reply to: Kandinsky

Yay!!!!

You focused on mainly certain parts, but that's cool. You're still totally correct in paraphrasing some of his ideas.

I know it's a bit lengthy. He's a one time preacher so I guess that's where he gets it from. It wasn't easy for me either to be honest. I drifted near the last of it myself and still need to go back again.

But I'm glad you stuck to my request the best you could.

a reply to: mOjOm

Don't you think he kinda symbolises a major problem with the way we talk politics? Half the members in the thread won't listen because the guy calls out Trump. Others won't listen because he calls out the Dems. Or they listen and can't *hear* the message above the digs at whoever they follow.

If we map the response onto the wider population it suggests his argument would fall on deaf ears.

Ironically, the thrust of his argument is that Trump voters and Liberal voters should turn away from their chosen leaders and unite against the common enemy of corporate elites. Isn't that what most people believe about the *other side?* They can't see it on their own side.

Since we are throwing the ball around, I'll post another great speech for your entertainment. You all know about Bannon and where he stands on certain issues, aside from the typical evil nazi white supremacist propaganda the MSM shovels.

This is the speech he gave at the CAGOP the other day that CNN started broadcasting live, then abruptly cut after they realized he was making a bit too much sense.

a reply to: Kandinsky

Damn. You really just cut right down to brass tax don't ya. You went to the message behind the message even right from the start. I didn't think we'd even get to that realization until after we talked about the actual stuff in the speech for a while.

You're moving along quicker than I figured. But yes I agree and I get the impression that you've probably had that figured out already for some time.

That's only part of what I thought would be interesting to talk about though. There are other detail in there that also are worth talking about. I thought the message behind the message would be more of an afterthought for those paying attention. But we're there now.

a reply to: mOjOm

I took you at face value and went straight into the video instead of googling the guy for soundbites. I still don't know who he is

The overall message is a good one.

a reply to: mOjOm

I apologize for throwing shade on your video, but my criticism still applies. What little bones he throws to right and left mean very little in the direction of his overarching, anti-capitalist premise.

“This resistance must be accompanied by an alternative vision of a socialist, anti-capitalist society.”

a reply to: Konduit

I'll say one thing about Bannon. He can certainly speak on his own with confidence and skill to deliver his message.

That was a good speech as well. Although it exposes the problem with his way of thinking if you pay close attention also.

As for the content he speaks about he does a good job but also purposefully leaves out the stuff which would go against his own interests. Although sometime when it's not possible to ignore he includes it but washes by it and you have to catch it yourself. For example, he must include the Conservative/Republican Establishment at certain point because you can't avoid it. He'll slam them on one hand but elsewhere admits teaming up with them to suit his own agenda. At other times he'll ignore their involvement when it would work against his overall message.

But it's clear also why this is even though he doesn't come right out and admit it, it's still there and he says it, but without the context of why it's important. Winning. That's all he cares about and all that matters to him. How you win seems totally unimportant to him. The ends justify the means always. That is a dangerous perspective to have IMO. Accomplishments of course matter but some come with a price that make them better left alone. But not to him.

He's acting like he's against both Established Parties when it suits him but then sides with one of them happily as if it's perfectly fine. Enemies one day and friends the next.

He even mentions his involvement with targeted media using Cambridge Analytica and Mercer as if it was so heroic, although anyone who's looked into that will know it was far less noble, but he's correct in it being effective.

a reply to: mOjOm

Spot on in my book. Many things he said in the video are political views I have espoused in many of my threads and posts.

"Mafia economy. And a mafia state."

a reply to: mOjOm

"Fanatics in power will always become inquisitors."

"The voter is just a prop in this political theater."

"Narratives are believed to be true because they are emotionally appealing."

"No institution left in the United States that can truly be called democratic."

I would like to read the transcript of this speech.

a reply to: dfnj2015

I thought about that as well. If I come across the transcript I'll post a link for it in here.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: mOjOm

I apologize for throwing shade on your video, but my criticism still applies. What little bones he throws to right and left mean very little in the direction of his overarching, anti-capitalist premise.

“This resistance must be accompanied by an alternative vision of a socialist, anti-capitalist society.”

Wealth inequality is at all time highs. What is your solution? Do nothing and let the status quo continue to drive the worker making the median wage deeper and deeper into a poverty wage? Every year the rich get richer. Money talks, all your "this is anti-capitalism" and "capitalism is sacred" is BS. Nobody is talking about getting rid of money from society. But having a little economic equality and justice would be nice rather than the billionaire extremism we suffer under now.

originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: dfnj2015

I thought about that as well. If I come across the transcript I'll post a link for it in here.

Absolutely terrific video and thread. Many of the things he was saying are ideas I have recycled and posted here many times. I will watch the video another time or two. I may have some new ideas to recycle. I thought the term "kleptocracy" was an interesting one to use.

I thought Chris Hedges was practically quoting from the article I posted in this thread:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

mOjOm: I will wager that 90% of those who have attacked the video didn't get past the first few seconds of a female First Nations singer.

I can guarantee you they didn't get to the part about 20 minutes in which the speaker calls out the defunct liberalism of the Democratic Party in general as well as Obama and the Clintons specifically. As you said, that alone puts the lie to what many have said here.

ANY reasonable person who holds the least belief in individual freedom and concern about the power of the authoritarian state should be chilled to the bone by the words of Goebbels-lookalike Stephen Miler that Mr. Hedges quotes:

We have a judiciary that has taken far too much power and become in many cases a supreme branch of government. Our opponents, the media and the whole world will soon see as we begin to take further actions, that the powers of the President to protect our country are very substantial and will not be questioned.

Sadly, Hedges very valid points regarding the rise of authoritarianism will be lost in his academic language and his themes of socialism and Christian anarchism.

The points he is making, however, are critical to understand regardless of political affiliation or ideology.

The rapid rise of authoritarianism and incipient totalitarianism in the United States and many European countries can be terrifying. The alignment of these ideas with fundamentalist Christianity, rampant militarism and failing "casino capitalism" (to quote Hedges) certainly spells out the course of doom we may be facing if there is no counter-reaction in the hearts and minds of Americans and the West to stand up for the Enlightenment ideals that most of our nations were founded on.

The feculent responses from many received to this point in your thread, mOjOm, underscore this very point. Thanks for bringing the video.

originally posted by: Konduit
Since we are throwing the ball around, I'll post another great speech for your entertainment. You all know about Bannon and where he stands on certain issues, aside from the typical evil nazi white supremacist propaganda the MSM shovels.

This is the speech he gave at the CAGOP the other day that CNN started broadcasting live, then abruptly cut after they realized he was making a bit too much sense.