Scenarios

What would it take to avoid a collision between the Milky Way Galaxy and the Andromeda Galaxy which is supposed to occur in 5 billion years?


www.nasa.gov...


So basically in about 5 billion years these two Galaxies become one.

Can we do anything to change that or is it wrong to even consider it?


Is it possible that we could generate a gravitational effect that could move the Milky Way, away from the Local Group?

Any thoughts?

a reply to: Kashai

1) no

2) laughably no


the sheer scale involved.... bafflingly no.

Sorry!
the two will become one

a reply to: lordcomac


So you saying it is impossible for Mankind to develop the means to generate on its own, a Supermassive Black Hole in say 1.5 billion years, that could pull the Milky Way out of harms way?

Why do you think that is impossible?

Who cares , everone will be dead long before that happens .

a reply to: lordcomac



See if you think that it is impossible for mankind to exist for billions of years where there knowledge of history dates back to when humans first walked upon Earth?

What exact position are you taking that explains otherwise?

Astrophysicists think there we be little calamity if galaxies collide. What they do is merge. The stars are so spread out in the galaxies, that stars would rarely collide.

So when galaxies collide we certainly don’t see Hollywood style explosions; in fact, close up you probably wouldn’t notice much at all. The collisions are so tame that they are usually just referred to as ‘mergers’.

Source: Space Answers

What would change, most likely, is the rotational speeds of each. This would most likely change our "procession" and make things a lot more complex, as a processional cycle today takes about 26,000 years to complete.

a reply to: charlyv

Calculations indicate the supermassive black hole at the center of the Andromeda Galaxy is roughly one to two hundred million solar masses. By comparison, our Milky Way galaxy's own supermassive is just over four million times the mass of our Sun. For a sense of scale, if the Milky Way's black hole was placed where the Sun is, its size would make it a little under a quarter of the orbit of Mercury. By comparison, if Andromeda's supermassive black hole was put where our Sun is, its outer edge would reach somewhere between the vicinity of the orbit of Jupiter almost out to Saturn's.

www.answers.com...


So if one has a disparity of such a scale what as to the effect of an impact?

originally posted by: Kashai
Any thoughts?

*scenarios

nm

#othergalaxylivesmatter

a reply to: Kashai

This an odd mental exercise. We, being humans, will be long ago dead before 1.5 billion years passes. Unless you assume we move en masse to a different planet.

Future of the Earth.

During the next four billion years, the luminosity of the Sun will steadily increase, resulting in a rise in the solar radiation reaching the Earth. This will result in a higher rate of weathering of silicate minerals, which will cause a decrease in the level of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere. In about 600 million years from now, the level of CO2 will fall below the level needed to sustain C3 carbon fixation photosynthesis used by trees. Some plants use the C4 carbon fixation method, allowing them to persist at CO
2 concentrations as low as 10 parts per million. However, the long-term trend is for plant life to die off altogether. The extinction of plants will be the demise of almost all animal life, since plants are the base of the food chain on Earth.[11]

In about one billion years, the solar luminosity will be 10% higher than at present. This will cause the atmosphere to become a "moist greenhouse", resulting in a runaway evaporation of the oceans. As a likely consequence, plate tectonics will come to an end, and with them the entire carbon cycle.[12] Following this event, in about 2−3 billion years, the planet's magnetic dynamo may cease, causing the magnetosphere to decay and leading to an accelerated loss of volatiles from the outer atmosphere. Four billion years from now, the increase in the Earth's surface temperature will cause a runaway greenhouse effect, heating the surface enough to melt it. By that point, all life on the Earth will be extinct.[13][14] The most probable fate of the planet is absorption by the Sun in about 7.5 billion years, after the star has entered the red giant phase and expanded to cross the planet's current orbit.

Also you have global catastrophic risk.

A global catastrophic risk is a hypothetical future event that has the potential to damage human well-being on a global scale.[2] Some events could cripple or destroy modern civilization. Any event that could cause human extinction or permanently and drastically curtail humanity's potential is known as an existential risk.[3]

Potential global catastrophic risks include anthropogenic risks (technology risks, governance risks) and natural or external risks. Examples of technology risks are hostile artificial intelligence, biotechnology risks, or nanotechnology weapons. Insufficient global governance creates risks in the social and political domain (potentially leading to a global war with or without a nuclear holocaust, bioterrorism using genetically modified organisms, cyberterrorism destroying critical infrastructures like the electrical grid, or the failure to manage a natural pandemic) as well as problems and risks in the domain of earth system governance (with risks resulting from global warming, environmental degradation, including extinction of species, or famine as a result of non-equitable resource distribution, human overpopulation, crop failures and non-sustainable agriculture). Examples for non-anthropogenic risks are an asteroid impact event, a supervolcanic eruption, a lethal gamma-ray burst, a geomagnetic storm destroying all electronic equipment, natural long-term climate change, or extraterrestrial life impacting life on Earth.

Then you have the ongoing Holocene extinction.

The Holocene extinction, otherwise referred to as the sixth extinction or Anthropocene extinction, is the ongoing extinction event of species during the present Holocene epoch, mainly due to human activity. The large number of extinctions spans numerous families of plants and animals, including mammals, birds, amphibians, reptiles and arthropods. With widespread degradation of highly biodiverse habitats such as coral reefs and rainforest, as well as other areas, the vast majority of these extinctions is thought to be undocumented. The current rate of extinction of species is estimated at 100 to 1,000 times higher than natural background rates.

Then you have the possible Impact event large enough to cause an ELE.

The point I'm trying to make here is that is so far in the future it is highly unlikely we humans will exist. Not to mention the amount of energy it would take to redirect the path of a galaxy.

It would probably be beneficial. The two black holes would revolve but never merge. Most stars would be fairly unaffected. Our virtual environment in the galactic core would double our connected real estate.

1)Prove the existence of worm holes
2)generate one big enough
3)put a big ring with lights around it,
4)dial it up,
5)send the galaxy through it to another sector.

You're asking for a scenario that is impossible to generate a theory on, if in 1.5 billions years time we are still here in some form of existence, the way of our thinking would be completely different.

We could not generate a theory in our current form at this time on how to do it, who we are now and who we will be then will not be the same in any form.

It would be like going back in time and asking that single celled organism on how we could build a fusion reactor.

a reply to: MuonToGluon


Actually I am offering that it is conceivable today to generate a condition. In which it is possible to cause the Milky way Galaxy to achieve, escape velocity from the gravitational effect of the "Local Group".

Mathematically it is not impossible.

a reply to: Kashai

Nothing catastrophic will happen when the galaxies collide/combine.

To illustrate it to you, imagine only 1 drop of rain fell annually somewhere random on earth, and there are only 100 people on earth. The odds of anyone ever getting rained on are near zero.

The distance between stars is enormous, and as mentioned, earth won't be habitable in 5 billion years.

a reply to: Kashai

I don't think you see the problem.

We, who we are now cannot do it, even in theory.

I gave you a mathematically sound way to do it, I fulfilled your request with a scenario using a wormhole that is allowed with general relativity/special.

While something may not be impossible, it can still be practically impossible to achieve.

And you have a problem with the super massive blackhole in the center of our galaxy, gravity of blackhole attracts, how do you prevent your massive blackhole you generated from colliding and absorbing with our own?

Your theory does not work, even mathematically.

In theory you could use the black hole you somehow generated to attract the smaller one in our galaxy as a magnet and drag it....there are no maths we could ever do in our time line to work out how that is possible - a pink elephant coming out of the blackhole is also possible, in theory.

a reply to: MuonToGluon



Simple. The local group is not related to some "Nexus", that cannot be affected by an event that contradicts that force.


Exactly how such a force could be applied to accomplish such a task is rudimentary despite scale in retrospect.


In relation to Wormholes perhaps you should read up on quantum foam

a reply to: Kashai

Quantum foam is a broken theory, it is one of many that attempts to fill in gaps but needs a lot of other theories to be filled before evidence to it's concept can be started to be conceived.

a reply to: Kashai

We won't even be a species that depends on a corporeal existence at that point.

I'm pretty sure our descendants will be cheering on the beautiful collision.

a reply to: Vector99



When the Andromeda Galaxy's black hole is within 100,000 light years of the Milky Ways Black Hole? The Milky Way's Black Hole will drag this Galaxy with it as the two Galaxies coalesce gravitationally.

Consider the potential of Gama Radiation due to.....

originally posted by: MuonToGluon
a reply to: Kashai

Quantum foam is a broken theory, it is one of many that attempts to fill in gaps but needs a lot of other theories to be filled before evidence to it's concept can be started to be conceived.

John Wheeler applied the theory of general relativity to the ZPE by creating a natural cut off in his theory of geo-metro dynamics. In general relativity, the texture of space curves as a function of the energy density. When the density becomes sufficiently great, space pinches like it's forming a black hole.

This gives rise to the formation of hyperspace structures, that Wheeler called "wormholes."

The resulting view is, that the fabric of space consists of constantly forming and annihilating pairs of microscopic "mini" black holes and white holes, which channel electric flux into and out of our three dimensional space. These mini holes manifest dynamics which could be modeled as turbulent, virtual plasma, that Wheeler calls the "quantum foam." In this view the elementary particles are like bubbles or vortices arising from the dynamics of the vacuum energy.

www.vaczy.dk...


This relates to String theory.