When is the Catholic Church Going to Allow Priests To Marry?

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posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 02:48 PM
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and....FLYERSFAN...let's see that original post of mine.....take your time, I know you need to create it first!! What are you scared of that makes you need to lie?




posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 02:58 PM
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Originally posted by Zabilgy


Duh, you DID say it (as my quote of your original post shows.)
However after both Nygdan and I caught you,
you reworded your original post to delete that you said it. YOU SAID
that because these men weren't married, they took out their sexual
frustrations by molesting boys. That's what you said. No amount
of editing of the original post will change that. (you edited it twice).
My quote of your original post is there.



Once again Flyersfan...you are wrong I didn't say this and it appears you are the instigator and the child here. You want everyone to follow your rules or you're going to take your ball home. You feel you are losing this argument so you make up bs that I didn't say and decide you've had enough of this thread. This thread has had enough of you.

Don't argue with me based on bs you made up. Argue with me on the facts I've presented and the ones you've presented. Argue the point like a man...not like a little boy that doesn't get his way and goes home crying to his mommy!


[edit on 9-2-2005 by Zabilgy]


Can you two take this to the playground, where you can use your 'outside' voices?

Seems this thread has turned into a private discussion. I (and others) have posted links, thoughts, and opinions on the subject which have been ignored. This is an interesting thread, but will surely be dead soon if other views aren't brought into the discussion.

Of course, this is just my opinion, I'm sure other people may find your ramblings entertaining.



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 03:19 PM
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Man this thread is so anti-catholic its unbelievable. Priests cant marry. If they did it would interfiere with theyre holy duties. So some ppl thought this was wrong and started protestant, lutherin, ext., but Catholic was first. Jesus didnt want to start a new religion. Catholisism was formed by those who accepted him. It wouldnt make sence for some jews to believe that he wasnt the savior and some to believe he was. So they started a new religion keeping the old testiment and adding the new testiment with Jesus.

Plus priests are supposed to lead a life of poverty. If they were to start a family how would they support it? Theres now way they could afford college from the collection plates.

As for sex. Sex is not a sin. Having it b4 marriage is because sex is supposed to be an expression of love between a man and his wife and a child is stuppposed to be the ultimate expression of that love. It was alot easier back then to not have sex b4 marriage because ppl would get married at 13/14. So they would not have much time to commit that sin. Mary the mother of Jesus was probably 13.

Yay Catholisism



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 03:22 PM
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Just having a tough time with one particular person.....I have read your posts and have found them educational. I apologize for not responding sooner but I had a bit of a battle going on with flyersfan, who by the way, I called correctly that he would leave when he decided he was losing the battle.......

This of course, does not need to be a battle. Sometimes people just get a little too high strung.

Now....where were we??



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 03:28 PM
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Originally posted by Zabilgy
Even Jesus was married!


Provide source please.



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 03:33 PM
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Originally posted by Zabilgy
Even Jesus was married!


Provide source please.


The source is my own mind. It's my belief based on years of research. So I'm not spewing someone else's theory here, I am stating what I consider to be fact!



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 03:36 PM
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Originally posted by Zabilgy
The source is my own mind. It's my belief based on years of research. So I'm not spewing someone else's theory here, I am stating what I consider to be fact!


Oh. In that case, my own mind says he wasn't and is based on my years of research. I'm stating what I consider to be fact. Who wins?



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 03:36 PM
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Uh, gonna use google, but anyways, the books the church banned had Mary the wife of jesus and a leader, explained what happened to all the good people who died before Jesus was born, told stories of jesus as he was growing up and learned how to use his powers for good, things like that. But since these gave women power, gave information to the people, things like that they were banned.

Here, dang, google was so full of www.catholicchurchisrightoryougotohell.com with "Are there lost books? NO! They are evil satanist books the holy church destroyed for being evil satanists!!!!!! We gonna burn your house down for not being our bitch!"

Anyways, here some links to books banned by church for giving women power, explaining things, you know, evil things.

reluctant-messenger.com...
www.ecmarsh.com...


[edit on 9-2-2005 by James the Lesser]



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 03:43 PM
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Oh. In that case, my own mind says he wasn't and is based on my years of research. I'm stating what I consider to be fact. Who wins?


I'd say it's a stale mate. Let's have a beer and a good cigar and find something new to discuss......



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 03:48 PM
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Why is it when someone challenges me with what is in the Bible I have to pin down and recite not only one verse, but two or three supporting verses and then when I ask for a reference, I get a link to a website with the multi-book volumes of pages. Should I read them all, study them and get back with you in a month when I find it? Please extend the same courtesy with giving me one book and if you can, a specific verse or five.

[edit on 9-2-2005 by saint4God]



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 03:49 PM
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Originally posted by Zabilgy



Oh. In that case, my own mind says he wasn't and is based on my years of research. I'm stating what I consider to be fact. Who wins?


I'd say it's a stale mate. Let's have a beer and a good cigar and find something new to discuss......


LOL!
Good answer. Surveeeeeyyyyy says? DING!



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 04:30 PM
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Was Jesus married? I think so.

Jewish custom (back in the day of Jesus) required that ALL Rabis marry. Men who were not married were considered 'low life', and a curse to the Jewish church. Jesus may not have been a 'perfect' Jew (in the eyes of the Jewish society), but his parents were. It is said in the bible that Mary and Joseph obeyed ALL laws regarding the church. Since the Jewish culture had arranged marriages and boys were considered 'of age to marry' at 16, what makes you think that Mary and Joseph would not have complied?



DIRECT EVIDENCE

1. Hippolytus, a Christian leader from the late 2nd Century, was followed by Origen in the 3rd Century in saying that the Song of Solomon was a prophecy of a marital union between Christ and Mary Magdalene. Although they believed Mary was symbolic of the Church, nevertheless, the notion presupposed a real, albeit a spiritual (meaning non-sexual), marriage between Mary and Jesus.

2. There are hints scattered in the Gospels of a special relationship between Jesus and Mary. If she is the same Mary of Bethany in John 11, then we can explain why Martha arose to greet Jesus and not Mary. Some scholars say she was sitting shiva according to Jewish custom. "Shiva" was when a woman was in mourning. Married women were not allowed to break-off from their mourning unless called by their husbands. In this story, Mary does not come to Jesus, until He calls her.

At the Resurrection, when Mary meets Jesus in the Garden, there is a degree of intimacy (see the Aramaic here) which one would expect between lovers, not friends.

The Greek word for "woman" and "wife" is the same. Translators must rely upon the context in deciding how to translate it. Sometimes, the translation is arbitrary. When Mary is referred to as a "woman" who followed Jesus, it can just as easily be translated as "wife".

4. The story of Mary with the alabaster jar anointing the feet of Jesus is cited by some scholars as the most direct witness to their marriage. It is in all four Gospels and was a story in which Jesus gave express command that it be preserved. This ceremony was an ancient one among many royal houses in the ancient world, which sealed the marital union between the king and his priestess spouse. We find it mentioned briefly in the Song of Solomon. Although we may not understand its significance, Jesus and Mary knew exactly what they were doing. To be the valid Messiah, He had to be anointed first by the Bride. They were by-passing the corrupt Jewish establishment.

There is more support for the marital status of Jesus. However, it involves a discussion of the Old Testament prophets which would be too tedious to undertake, here. It is important to realize, however, that belief in a married Jesus does not require any more faith than a resurrected Jesus. And if you know where to look, you can find just as much biblical evidence for both.



Since there is more evidence than not, I believe it's up to the 'non-believers' to show evidence of his not being married. Where in the bible does it say that he was NOT ever married?

I think it's safe to say that the bible is not meant to be a play-by-play exact account of the life of Jesus. (I've yet to read what his favorite food was, or his pets' names.) So, until I find where it states exactly that he was never married, I will continue to believe he was.

Pity the church for taking so much power away from females! They must have done this out of fear. Could it have been the fear they may not have been as pure as the women in their societies? (My opinion, of course)



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 04:34 PM
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Celibacy is not dogma, it's a rule that was passed in the 12th century. Ihas nothignt odo with anything of actual teaching from bibles or god or jesus. And the Catholic Church already recognizes some married priests (scores of Anglican priests who were allowed to switch to Roman Catholicism, even though they were already married). It's a man made up law.



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 05:27 PM
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Saint...some suggested reading:

Was Jesus Married?, by William E. Phipps, Harper & Row, 1970

The Woman with the Alabaster Jar, by Margaret Starbird, Bear & Company, 1993

Hierogamy & the Married Messiah

Mary Magdalene: Author of the Fourth Gospel?

This was just some quick look ups to get you started Saint...I'm at work, not at home, so I don't have all my references here. But I can say that in my heart I believe Jesus was married to Mary and that they had a daughter and there is some well documented proof of this. Proof that the Catholic church would like to suppress and has been suppressing because they wanted to make Jesus the Messiah of their church and felt their Messiah should be free of the human need to procreate. I feel that Jesus was a mortal prophet and therfore it only makes sense that he would marry as any rabbi would....and have children. It's just common sense in my mind....not rocket science.......

In my mind and my faith, it all makes sense. I'm not saying it has to make sense in anyone else's mind!! PEACE!!



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 05:32 PM
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The biggest thing you gotta remember about scripture is that you canot interpret everything on your
personal opinion.

This is what helped lead to the 3,000 different denominations in the 1500s



2 Peter 1:20

" Understand this first, that no prophecy of scripture is made by privae interpretation "



2 Peter 3:16

" As also in all his epitles, speaking in them of these things; in which are certain things hard to be understood, which
the unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also to the other scriptures, (to their own destruction) "



You can't interpret everythng to your own liking because it will dstroy you,and will destroy whats really true.



Priest are not allowed to be married because the vow to a life of christ, working soley for the kingdomofheaven. That does not mean they will not get unwanted urges, because they will, but with
the help of Gods grace he will see you through a life ofcelibacy.

Thats how I plan to live too, its a decision your own will makes as a sacrafice for God and his kingdom.




Nobody put a gun to their head makin them vow to celibacy and a life of Christ. You can easily serve Christ by being married to a wife.



Those who chose the priesthood chose their path in life. Nobody told them t do anything.



peace.



posted on Feb, 9 2005 @ 05:41 PM
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The biggest thing you gotta remember about scripture is that you canot interpret everything on your personal opinion.


Are you kidding? I can read the Bible and decide for myself what it means. I do not need someone else to tell me what it says. That's what religions do and I don't belive in religion. I believe in faith and I have faith and I read the Bible and I decide for myself what it says and what it means.

I have been part of some bible studies and enjoyed the debates on what some parts of the bible meant.....just like I don't mind debating issues here, but when it comes right down to it, I make up my own mind!



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 07:13 AM
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Originally posted by Truth




Priest are not allowed to be married because the vow to a life of christ, working soley for the kingdomofheaven. That does not mean they will not get unwanted urges, because they will, but with
the help of Gods grace he will see you through a life ofcelibacy.



Why!? It doesn't say they have to do that in the bible....it was made up by man in the 12th century



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 07:39 AM
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Honestly, there is no problem with celibacy and priesthood. ONCE again I will raise the fact that Buddhist monks live a life of poverty and chastity and pedophilia and sexual activity amongst them is unbelievably low. Yes, Zabilgy, you can throw your toys out of the crib again because I mentioned this fact. If you want to discuss the issue you should allow others their perseptions and comparisons. Buddhist monks and catholic priests should not get married as theirs is a choice of service to God, which in turn is a service to man. They remove attachment to other people in order that they can serve man and God without any other attachments taking priority.

As for the whole Jesus was married not married debate - I am so bored with Dan Brown and his da Vinci code and all the other little authors using the same logic after his books success. Show me any historical book that states that Jesus was married. Give it a break already.

Pedophilia is like rape in both cases the perpetrator can not be cured by having a relationship by having a relationship with a willing partner. Its about power and helplessness.



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 07:56 AM
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Originally posted by Mynaeris
Honestly, there is no problem with celibacy and priesthood.



I never said there was a "problem" with it...only "why"...as it is not required by your god......though there seems to be some type of problem here, as many seem to be getting release in the abusing of children...surely it should be an option and not mandatory.



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 07:57 AM
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What will it change in your everyday life if tomorrow, priest can get married?! What will you do?! When you wake-up in the morning, are going to freak out because of that and think about it all day? Are you going to start a revolution or what? There are so so many thing much more important than that!

Look at you all fighting for religion beleifs, is religion suppose to be about love, respect and faith....totally absurd....

Ameliaxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
still I send you love dear ones





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