Hell is a 404

originally posted by: LumenImagoDei
'Hell' is a state of mind where one has separated themselves from the knowledge of God, it is not a place where people are sent to suffer.

Sheol means 'asked for', we as a society are always asking for more, we are consumers who consume anything and everything we can get our hands on. Our current consumerist society is Sheol where people are always asking for more because of the void they feel inside themselves.

Material wealth is the veil that has been pulled over everyone's eyes, our materialistic society teaches that true value lies outside in material things when in realty real wealth comes from within ourselves.

The Bible plainly states that you cannot get away from God. Keep reading and you will find it.

"Sheol" refers to the place or state of the dead. It means "covered" " hidden" and "the unknown." "Hades" and "Hell" mean the same thing, in their original uses.

But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”

“Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

there seems to be a few references to hell fire and the lake of fire and eternal torment. a lot of them are in revelations, the prophecy of apocalypse where at least two thirds of everyone alive or who has ever lived will be given eternal suffering. thats just what it says according to the KJV.

a reply to: Lazarus Short

I have spent the last two years digging into my KJV to see if the Hell theory holds up or not.

You have spent much time in your search and I commend you for that. The following is another search that might interest you. Wishing you well.

You have covered a lot of ground of which most Christianity is not associated. When you search Christianity it is impossible to establish theological understanding of the Christian covenant of the Christ with any other covenants whether by the same deity or various deities.

The apostles had the same problem as you have. The NT letters are not the first and only means of Christianity just as the OT is not of the same structure. The Synagogue of James did not have the NT letters as their liturgy or the same temple structure as rabbinical Judaism had but both doctrines are intermixed in the understanding of the apostles. The apostles were all born and educated in the doctrine of rabbinical Judaic teachings and when Jesus came upon the scene they did not understand His doctrine at all. In fact all apostles [except John] died in ignorance of two resurrections as is described in Revelation. All through the letters of the NT there are overlays of the doctrine of Jesus and the doctrine on the Judeo rabbinic understandings.

As one example I would have you look at the word “Paradise”. Using your KJV bible it appears three times. Let me give you the three times and then you do your own search and when you read about paradise please read in context and complete thought. That means before and after the verses.

Luke 23:43 –- 2nd Corinthians 12:2-4 --- Revelation 2:7 with Revelation chapter 22:2-14 inclusive. The entire Revelation CH 22 read in conjunction of relation.

Paradise was first noted by Jesus to His death companion. The very day they died they either ascended or descended to Paradise? Conscious or unconscious? Paul was taught by Jesus that Paradise was in the third heaven. Not in Sheol or the grave but in the third heaven and out of this universe. Where is the Paradise which is in the third heaven located? It is located in the celestial city of New Jerusalem is it not? And what is the purpose of New Jerusalem? John taught that the purpose was to receive a new celestial body and live forever with the celestial food and water of life.

When you put all of the Paradise together you can then realize that this is that kingdom of heaven that Jesus preached but had never revealed while alive. This is why many Christians believe that as your soul dies your spirit is just as the companion of Jesus experienced. The trip to this paradise is within a moment of time.

Now what about the person that is rejected citizenship into Paradise? Believe as you will but the NT Christianity does say that the rejected ones are in hell [Sheol] and both death and hell [Sheol] will be consumed eventually. Your afterlife and the OT afterlife are entirely two different covenants which eventually will bond together as one but as yet have not completed the circle.

Now after you investigate this Paradise I hope to discuss your thoughts on the afterlife that Jesus taught.

a reply to: Lazarus Short

I agree, you cannot get away from God because you are God's expression of light. 'Sheol' is where the truth is hidden, covered, unknown by dogmas and materialism, a.k.a. Earth and the current society we live in.

Most do not see their true nature which is God's Spirit living within a temporary body, God's Spirit is true and eternal wealth whereas the material is false and temporary wealth, most are stuck in the material like Narcissus.

There is no such thing as a '404' in my opinion, life is eternal we only switch our perspective after this body dies.

a reply to: Seede

Seede, I appreciate what you say, but I'm doubtful that I can come to any useful conclusion with only three instances of a word. Nevertheless, I will look into it. I did notice "paradise" on my trek through the Bible, but it was incidental to my thesis/question.

Good job Laz.You have laid out the foundation of the evidence that testifies.However the dilemma of proving there is no eternal punishment of Hell from the scriptures is those that want to believe it will still infer it is in the scriptures yet Yahoshua clearly stated:

“You search the Scriptures, because you think that in them you have eternal life; and these are they which testify about me. Yet you will not come to me, that you may have life”.


…and that is precisely what the religious mind does seeks when it seeks to justify there beliefs through the study of the scriptures yet fail to come to Yahoshua (Yahweh…the creator God’s…. deliverance/salvation) that they would be delivered from their ignorant belief religion.

All of those(everyone) that will enter into the Kingdom(rulership by authority) of their heavens will be delivered from Hades(the realm of death…the grave.. and imperception..their false religious beliefs).Yahoshua clearly stated how entering the kingdom of your heavens happens in the preamble to the explanation to the disciples of the parable of the seed and soils.

“And the disciples came, and said to him, Why speak you to them in parables? He answered and said to them, Because it is GIVEN TO YOU to KNOW the mysteries of the kingdom of your heavens, but to them it is not given. For whoever has, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whoever has not, from him shall be taken away even that he has.Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand”.

This concept in Matthew 25 (age lasting fire)and Revelation 20 (lake of fire) is the same thing…. it is the tormenting(testing) cleansing destruction of the religious minds Belief System religion.That is why the disciples did not believe in a literal place of infinite punishment..Hell… not because it wasn’t in the scriptures.The scriptures purpose is a testimony that testifies of Yahoshua(deliverance of the creator God from Hades) it is not the deliverance itself by studying and practicing the doctrines extrapolated from it in any form.

Fortunately ALL of mankind will be delivered from their Belief System religion(imperception). However Yahoshua clearly stated only the disciples were given to enter their kingdom of their heavens(forgiven..freed from bondage) while living in the physical realm.Everyone else who does not have what they have will be taken away(the fruitless seeds of religion).That doesn’t mean the disciples were perfected(matured).It just means the disciples where the first fruits of the harvest born of the “seed”(Yahoshua) that grew the GOOD tree and the seeds were sown to produce 30,60 and 100 fold good fruit.A bad tree(religion..the tree of the knowledge of good and evil) cannot produce good fruit.

Hades is very real because everyone will enter the realm of death (the grave) and have entered the realm of imperception(religious belief).In effect everyone was born into Hades(imperception of religion) in the valley of the shadows of death(the physical realm).That is what Yahoshua “will” deliver ALL of creation from to LIFE(spirit).It should be obvious that none have ascended and entered into the Kingdom of their heavens that have not descended from it even though billions(the many) “believe” they have through their religion…and that is the great deception….to believe a lie of the father of lies…mans religion…satan..the adversary….their carnal religious mind.

However none can deliver themselves from themselves!!Only the creator God can deliver a person from their death to Life and from imperception of knowing the Truth. What you have presented is very important however it is only the precursor to being delivered and freed from bondage(forgiveness).The fall of the many are called(all of mankind) is to “believe” they have a will free of cause and they can “choose” to enter Life or remain in death.It is the great delusion of free will when in fact EVERYTHING is the will of the creator God which is in contradiction to EVERYONE’s Belief System(BS) religion.

That is why the disciples did not understand anything Yahoshua said either UNTIL they were delivered from their BS and “knew” the Father just as Yahoshua did because they (alone) were sent(apostles) as Yahoshua was to be seeds(first fruits).Mans mind is from below(religion..the religious mind) the creator Gods mind is from above(the Kingdom of the heavens).

The GOOD news is everyone will be delivered from their false imperception of life(the valley of the shadows of death) to LIFE by the creator God not their false Belief System religion which everyone has because it is their nature(the fruit/seed of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil).

a reply to: Rex282

Thank you Rex, that may just be the best post of the thread!

originally posted by: Lazarus Short
a reply to: Rex282

Thank you Rex, that may just be the best post of the thread!

You sowed the good seed.The salvation of all(Yahoshua) is the good fruit.

a reply to: Rex282

Good job Laz.You have laid out the foundation of the evidence that testifies.However the dilemma of proving there is no eternal punishment of Hell from the scriptures is those that want to believe it will still infer it is in the scriptures yet Yahoshua clearly stated:
“You search the Scriptures, because you think that in them you have eternal life; and these are they which testify about me. Yet you will not come to me, that you may have life”.

The above quote from John in the KJV bible is referenced as that which Jesus said.
John_5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

The inference that you have presented is that Jesus meant to search the NT scriptures which is not correct. The NT scriptures were not written at this time He said this and there was no eternal life given to mankind at the time He said this. Jesus clearly said to search the OT scriptures for eternal life simply because at this time no one had ascended to the kingdom of heaven. The kingdom of heaven was presented to mankind after Jesus died and by His new covenant. Prior to this, all spirits were contained in the Hebrew Sheol or Nether World or as the Greeks understand this as being Hell.

The KJV bible does not say that hell is eternal and in that respect there is no one that will be in hell for eternity. Hell and death will eventually be consumed according to Revelation.

The Hebrew rendition of the OT does not reference any Greek translation of the word Hell. Their translation to English is Sheol and or Nether World. The translation Sheol appears in the JPS twice while Nether World appears 42 time and Nether Parts of the earth appears once.

a reply to: Lazarus Short

15. The idea of damnation of people to Hell is at least absurd, and possibly blasphemous. See Genesis 1:26-27, 2:7,3:19, Ecclesiastes 12:7.

Yes. It is at least absurd, and at worst (and in truth) a fictitious 'consequence' meant to instill FEAR in order to CONTROL people (or one's self, if that is what it takes to keep people from slaughtering others, then fine, but in my opinion, if a person needs to be afraid of "hell" to be a decent human being to others, then they really aren't all that ''decent" to begin with.)

24. When we dig out mistranslations and peel away misinterpretations, we find that Hell is a 404. With Hell so deconstructed, the Bible and God are both silent on Hell. See Numbers 23:19, John 14:2.

It's good to see some of you coming around to this realization.

zosimov has recently posted about feeling a "buzzing" or "high" in the area of the Third Eye....
this is the same experience as Buddhists call "enlightenment" - a connection between us all. We are all connected. We are all part of the same Uni-verse. "Christ" tried to teach people that, but they lacked the sophistication to comprehend it, so allegorical fables were used.

This is the evolution of the human specie. I'm glad to hear, Laz, that you have come to this conclusion through your own courage to really look into it. Please spread the word.

S/F

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Thank you for the kind words. The same material on the Christian Forum is not going over so well...

a reply to: Lazarus Short

Did you expect them to agree with you?

Without "HELL" they are no longer held within the boundaries that it enforces...... and also they are without brakes.

It takes a talent for critical thinking (which can be nurtured by education if it is innate, but can not be 'forced' into a person) to realize the things you are seeing now.

Congratulations. Keep up the good work.

a reply to: Lazarus Short

Understanding Heaven or the Kingdom of Heaven, is what leads to understanding the word “Hell…”…Hell is a spiritual state. A state of being disconnected from God, in the here and now…IMO…

Only by receiving the Spirit of God, can we move out of that Hell like state and move into the Kingdom of God, which is within us…

There are many clues found in Jesus words to this truth; Such as “let the dead bury their own dead”…Jesus was clearly referring to a spiritual state of mind, in that those who were “dead” were not alive spiritually and were therefore living in a Hell like state…

And in Matthew 23 verse 13 Jesus accused the Pharisees of being “Children of Hell”…which is again referring to being in a specific state of mind in the here and now…

Receiving the Spirit of God, is what moves us out of hades; it removes the veil and allows us to see the kingdom of God…

All the horrible depictions of hell fire and torment etc…were all metaphors and parables/stories used only to help describe the pain of living in such a state…IMO

Living in a Hell like state and not being aware of Spiritual things, is what leads to evil, hate, anger, and all other types of sins…This is why Hell is said to be a painful place to be, and it’s also why the wicked are said to be there…in a metaphorical sense…


Personally I believe Jesus refutes any literal interpretation of Hell, (Fire, torment and judgment etc…) by his own words regarding judging others…

Luke 6:31
Do to others as you would have them do to you.

Luke 6:37
37 ‘Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned.

Matthew 7:2
For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

Imagine you commit one sin in your entire life, and lets just say that one sin, was that you told one lie…but you didn’t find Jesus before you passed away; According to standard Christian doctrine you are now going to be tortured in Hell for all eternity or destroyed for ever…


That simply cannot be the (fair) “measure” that Jesus spoke about in the above verses…because it just doesn’t fit or make any sense…


Of course take away that key doctrine of a literal Hell and you then have to ask other more difficult questions like, “What did Jesus death save us from…?” and “did Jesus die in vain…?” etc…and many other similar type questions…

You’d pretty much have to rethink a number of key Christian concepts and beliefs. Which is going to be difficult for most Christians to contemplate…but there are answers to those questions…if people would honestly search for them…


- JC

a reply to: Joecroft

Having seen a black silhouetted angel with sword and shield about 20ft in the air above me Id say hell probably actually does exist.

a reply to: khnum

Originally posted by khnum
Having seen a black silhouetted angel with sword and shield about 20ft in the air above me Id say hell probably actually does exist.

Well, I believe those entities and others like them do exist!!!…but that doesn’t mean a literal Hell fire of torment exists, as described by standard Christian doctrines…

I do believe however that there are lower Spiritual realms where these types of bad entities reside or are sent…which might represent a type of movie version of a Hell, but it’s certainly not the standard biblical version of Hell fire and destruction…

Good and bad spiritual entities existing within lower and higher realms does not mean there is a literal Hell fire…IMO…


- JC

a reply to: Joecroft

As the Buddha suggests 'to exist is to suffer',your already on a hell staffed and managed by what you would expect to find in a hell,its a moot point I am more interested in liberation this lifetime as for any afterlife we will cross that bridge when we come to it.

a reply to: khnum

Originally posted by khnum
As the Buddha suggests 'to exist is to suffer',your already on a hell staffed and managed by what you would expect to find in a hell,its a moot point I am more interested in liberation this lifetime as for any afterlife we will cross that bridge when we come to it.

“Cross that bridge when we come to it”…?

But didn’t you initially state that you believe Hell probably does exist…?

Here’s your first reply to me below…

Originally posted by khnum
Having seen a black silhouetted angel with sword and shield about 20ft in the air above me Id say hell probably actually does exist.

If you believe in a literal Hell (fire, torment and destruction etc.) then surely you would have to do something about it…now!!!…

Maybe you meant the movie version of Hell in your initial reply and not the Hell fire and torment version…?


- JC

a reply to: Joecroft

The world is more than a two choice option and there is more than just the Christian reality,or Muslim,or Jewish or whatver the trick is discriminating between that which has been set up by archons and that that hasnt.

a reply to: khnum

Originally posted by khnum
The world is more than a two choice option and there is more than just the Christian reality,or Muslim,or Jewish or whatver the trick is discriminating between that which has been set up by archons and that that hasnt.

Yes, this is true…

I’m just trying to get some extra clarity about your first reply, and how you meant the word “Hell”…it’s an open ended question…so you’re not restricted to only 2 options in reply…


- JC

a reply to: Joecroft

Physical hells are in Christian(Tartarus),Muslim,Hindu,Buddhist and many other faiths.But what is a Religion its an information meme or in some cases contagion which is communicable, you download the unassailable texts and have spiritual 'guides' steer you towards the false or real reality(depending on whether its archon or not)soon you will have synchronicities or proofs that your ego believes you are onto the truth.Now with the power of consciousness if you really believe in a physical hell ,you might when you die end up there- its spirit/consciousness that moves on and if it judges itself unworthy and has invested a lot of time in fear and negative emotion it may gravitate towards a worser reality.It is your job to create yourself and I would strongly suggest a positive empowering meme be selected as what you expect you get.