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The Mandela Effect and John Titor

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posted on Nov, 2 2016 @ 11:00 PM
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Well this is probably going to be the craziest thread I've ever written but I feel it's worth discussing since the science isn't so insane and I'm coming across more and more examples of things throughout history which I seem to remember being different. Assuming it's not just a case of faulty memory, there aren't many plausible explanations for the Mandela Effect. Living in a simulated universe is one possible answer. Another potential answer is that someone figured out how to travel into the past or some method to alter history.

Neither of those options is very appealing because they both imply our past can be altered by intelligent forces. I'm assuming most people on ATS are already familiar with John Titor so I will skip over the explanation of who he is. I read about him many years ago when I first started getting into conspiracy stuff, at that time I dismissed it as a hoax because it sounded very far fetched and his predictions were wrong a lot of the time. However after the recent events related to the Mandela Effect I decided to go back and take another look.

One of the first things I noticed is that he talks about problems with the elections in 2004, which sparks a civil war and eventually leads to a nuclear war in 2015. Now obviously none of that has happened in this reality, but we are now coming up to an election which seems like it could have the potential to spark a civil war. Also keep in mind that Titor himself stated this time line was not exactly like his own, it varied by up to a few percent, and that just by being here he had changed things.

I think we had to avoid that war after John Titor appeared in our time line because imagine if all his predictions actually turned out to be true... people would know he actually did travel here from a different time. That would mean any secret plans by GE and CERN to develop a time machine would be exposed. Assuming Titor was legit, the people behind the development of time travel would have recognized that his science was valid and from that point on do everything in their power to avoid the war he predicted.

They would choose to make society in this time line technically advanced instead of war torn, so that they may reach their goal of achieving time travel even quicker than they did in the Titor time line. Titor clearly knew a thing or two about science, particularly special relativity, quantum mechanics, and black hole physics. He even provided pictures of an operating manual for his time machine which contains diagrams of how his machine is designed and the fields it generates around its two micro-singularities.

Titor predicted that CERN would make some important discoveries once they started moving into the higher energy levels, and in 2013 they confirmed the existence of the Higgs boson. He specifically predicted that the LHC would create micro-singularities which evaporate quickly around 2001, which didn't happen according to the official version of events, but even if they did would they really announce it after what Titor said and after so many people were worried they would create black holes which would devour the Earth?

Many scientists predicted that micro-singularities should be created in the LHC but would evaporate quickly, so the idea has some merit to it. Pretty much everything Titor said has some legitimate scientific basis to it. He also claimed that the Everett Wheeler model is the correct interpretation of quantum mechanics, also known as the "many-worlds interpretation". Essentially he was claiming an infinite number of time lines exist, so anything that could possibly happen, has happened in at least one time line.

Personally I've always found that interpretation of QM to be very unattractive because it implies there are other versions of me which have made the worst possible decisions in life, and in some way it implies my decisions are completely meaningless because I always make every possible decision. But just because I find something distasteful doesn't mean it's false and I wouldn't discount it just because I don't like what it implies. It's still a perfectly valid theory and probably the top contender against the Copenhagen interpretation.


It is thought that the event called the "Big Bang" was the start of not only this worldline or universe but all worldlines and all universes that make up the super universe. It is also thought that the super universe can be imagined as an expanding sphere with the big bang in the center. Individual worldliness (or timelines as you call them) can be imagined as lines originating at the center and "trending" toward spiraling around the sphere until they reach the edge.

The individual worldlines expand in length and widen as you follow them from the center. Each individual "moment" or "event" on a worldline has infinite possibilities or outcomes. Imagine this as a single point with infinite lines shooting away from it, which in turn, are made up of points with their own possibilities and outcomes.

~ John Titor


What Titor describes in the above quote is essentially the Everett model. To explain it in simpler terms, imagine you're trying to make a decision about whether or not to buy KFC for lunch, there is a universe where you do and a universe where you don't. At the most fundamental level we're saying that for any uncertain quantum event, like the decay of a particle, there's a universe for every possible action the particle could take at any given moment in time, assuming there are discrete moments in time.
edit on 2/11/2016 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)




posted on Nov, 2 2016 @ 11:00 PM
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Another big question is whether time is quantized or continuous. Quantized space-time is useful for describing when branching occurs in the Many-worlds interpretation, but it also means the universe couldn't start as a singularity. There are still many unknown variables even if we assume the Many-worlds interpretation is correct. One of the comments by Titor which I found particularly interesting is where he talks about the problems that science is still trying to tackle in 2036 even after they manage to invent time machines.


1) Did your worldline exist at all before I got here from mine? (personally I don't see how it couldn't)
2) What happens at the end of a worldline at the edge of the super universe?
3) If there are infinite worldlines and infinite possibilities and an edge to the super universe, doesn't that mean occurring events on worldliness are staggered as they reach the edge? (time could end at any moment without warning).


These are all very interesting points but the first one is perhaps the most interesting. Every particle on Earth has a finite number of actions it can make at the next moment in time, so we might assume there are a finite number of time lines branching off from our current point in time, but actually there's a chance that particles from another moment in time can suddenly appear in our time, which means the branching doesn't just feed forward, there must be feedback loops linking the future to the past.

The 1st point is essentially asking whether those feedback loops always existed or whether they get created only after some mass travels backwards in time. If those links already exist that would imply all time-travel events are predetermined, literally woven into time. In the words of Titor, "the reason we don't know if Schrödinger's cat is dead is because it might have had a time machine". The last two points seem highly related to the first, they seem to be asking if there's actually an end to any of these time lines.

An expanding model implies all time lines are still growing, and beyond that end point the future is undetermined. Does that imply the only people with any real decision making power are the people existing right at the very edge of time where the possible branches and links have yet to be determined? This all gets very complicated rather quickly, even scientists have a hard time trying to understand the full implications of the Many-world interpretation. But how does any of this really help explain the Mandela effect?

What could possibly cause my perception of the past to change, did I some how shift into another time line, is CERN and GE already messing around with time travel technology thanks to information provided by Titor, are the time lines just naturally shifting around? I don't really know but every day something like that seems more and more plausible. I still don't subscribe to the Everett model but it's certainly a very interesting model with wide ranging implications about the nature of the universe.

After going back and re-reading a lot of the stuff Titor wrote, I think what really struck me most was the level of humility he displayed and all the little details in his story, it really gave me the sense that this was a guy who had actually experienced life in a post-apocalyptic type of world which was devastated by nuclear war. If it was a hoax then the amount of effort put into it is absolutely outstanding, from the documents he produced, to the scientific knowledge and the depth of his back story.


I watch every day what you are doing as a society. While you sit by and watch your Constitution being torn away from you, you willfully eat poisoned food, buy manufactured products no one needs and turn an uncaring eye away from millions of people suffering and dying all around you. Is this the "Universal Law" you subscribe to?

Perhaps I should let you all in on a little secret. No one likes you in the future. This time period is looked at as being full of lazy, self-centered, civically ignorant sheep. Perhaps you should be less concerned about me and more concerned about that.

~ John Titor

edit on 2/11/2016 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2016 @ 11:31 PM
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a reply to: ChaoticOrder

I can't wait to read this and I will be back..

Here's what's weird for me a few points:

1) I have a LOT of dejavu, and those dejavu can be long movies so I can fast forward in my memory and know the future..

2) I've noticed lots of mandela effects and even tried to prove one, which led me into I don't even know what, but in doing so I found a lot of manipulation of internet data going on.. What it meant I don't know because another rabbit hole almost killed me soon after..

3) my history appears to have been changed.. Well, it's too long a story but basically it's like some "higher power" had to change my past to change my future.. Sort of like I was on a path to death, but it wasn't allowed so the next easiest course was made, which predated medical conditions.. how should I say that clearly.. I all the sudden had a medical issue that doctors say was 10 years progressed, but even in that 9th year no one noticed anything, and just at the end all the sudden it's like I'm almost dead.. but funny because that's what saved my life too.. NVM I won't say it here.

In any case the mandela effects also had this air about them that feels like synchonicity.. and the timing matches with synchronicity too, as in they come in the same waves and same intensity.





...It's almost like my alarm clock is going off and I'm about to wake up.


I wrote all of this without reading a word of yours. I wanted to get it out and be able to say I didn't read you, so if anything I say you agree with you can know it's coming from me for real.

In the time I was looking for a movie called "Jupiter Rising" two people even accused me of being john titor...
I do have some weird similarities, and ideals, but I can't be him that makes no sense.. BUT... I do think I'm accidentally time travling.. Like becoming the other me in the mirror or something like that.. MAybe realities are being destroyed so whole timelines are disappearing, and depending on which me I am if mine goes away I become another me and it's slightly off..

wouldn't it be weiurd if we all died in WWIII, the ones of us who notice these "memory faults"
and we came back to this line where WWIII never happens??

If that's how it works we should all end up in the last reality...

the one that works.




ok I'll go back and read as I have time, but I'm doing so many things at once..

Oh and my weird meter is on silent.. no synchronicity no new dejavu, no new mandela effects..

I'm on empty, like all the magic got up and left..

has me worried... Something big might be coming.




So some of mine

1)Kit-Kat
2)Jupiter Rising
3)Interview with a vampire
4)mirror mirror on the wall (by the way researching this me and another poster hear noticed that in every translation it says mirror mirror still)


many others including mandela actually died 3 times for me.. when he died this last time I looked at the TV ad said NO WTF!!! through down the paper in my hands.. Gave my gf an intense look, and just walked off. You die twice and maybe I got confused, cause the second time I was like oh ok I must have been wrong I guess, so after going "he's dead now I guess I was wrong" he then dies again.... Then you KNOW...

dude..



posted on Nov, 2 2016 @ 11:39 PM
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a reply to: ChaoticOrder

one more point..

I think the reason I remember "other timelines"

I think it's because my memory is not all stored in my brain.




posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 12:05 AM
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a reply to: ChaoticOrder



Perhaps as time progresses, the number of possibilities / world deviations decrease, thus collapsing many worlds into a few and eventually one, surviving timeline.

The collapse of multiple timestreams together could account for Mandela Effect, assuming for the moment that it is more than bad memory or mass psychological manipulation.



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 12:13 AM
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a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Earlier this summer when the Mandela Effect topics were being posted fairly regularly I did go back and reread all of the John Titor stuff as well. I was really fascinated by the part where he said he was going after IBM 5100, as I had never heard about this.

Back in the early days of ATS when Titor was a common topic, I only skimmed over the subject and didn't ever really read deeply into it - it was heavily ridiculed and I didn't realize there was a deeper story behind all of it.

I am interested in the concept and the speculation it evokes, and all of the connected topics that it leads you to when you really begin to dig into it, like timelines, quantum mechanics, and yes, even the Mandela Effect.

I'm very skeptical about all of this of course, and like to make little jokes about aspects of it in passing to those who know about it, but it is truly one of those things that really makes you think deeply. I am curious and interested, and honestly crave to find out more about it. I am attracted to reading threads that mention Titor or ME and usually end up reading all of the pages of comments as well.

My position is the open minded skeptic willing to entertain the notion, fascinated by the possibilities.
Thanks for bringing it up.



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 12:25 AM
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Outstanding OP!!!

I think of this often...and actually this topic informs some of the work I do.

I too feel like something "shifted" radically in my timeline about 2 years ago. I have never felt that way before or since.

I won't go into details as they won't mean anything to anybody, but I am certain something happened around that time.

Titor has always interested me. On multiple levels. Was he authentic? I don't know, but like hidden-hand in the Window of Opportunity thread, the things he imparted resonated with me as having more than a kernel of truth to them.

I give not a flying rat's ass what other people think of my views here on ATS about things like this. But having 2 grad degrees in areas of Quantum Physics, and thru working with some very smart people I've learned that "reality" as we think we know it, may not be what it seems and further research and discovery in this area is required.

I'll definitely be watching this thread going forward and hoping for some intelligent and thoughtful input form some of the members here. And there are some here that can impart a lot of knowledge to this.

I hope they stop by and contribute.
edit on 11/3/2016 by Riffrafter because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 12:34 AM
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originally posted by: pirhanna

Perhaps as time progresses, the number of possibilities / world deviations decrease, thus collapsing many worlds into a few and eventually one, surviving timeline.

The collapse of multiple timestreams together could account for Mandela Effect, assuming for the moment that it is more than bad memory or mass psychological manipulation.


I said that first paragraph as well. Seems to make sense in just the if that's true, then the effect might be collapsing lines/memories..

psy ops is a possibility as well.

Maybe I can link a thread where that came up..

HERE:

Is an interesting thread


check it out



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 12:42 AM
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a reply to: Riffrafter

I've been working on a lot of stuff related to these topics, and it covers a lot of territory. Not the ME or Titor specifically but moreso the issues that can overlap between these 'types of topics'.

It's a lot of work and I'm still on it, and I don't want to really post about it until I see results in the real world. I'm doing some experiments and looking into developing better methods and gaining more understanding first.

When I nail something I'll post a full in-depth thread on it, and attempt to teach others as best as I can exactly what I am up to.

One of the prime underlying theories I'm testing is "Reality is not what we think it is" for lack of a better phrase, there's way more to it than that but sigh... How I'm testing that is very complex and I'm unsure if I could ever fully explain what I'm doing, but I want and need results so I'll just say it's still a work in progress. I feel like I'm on the verge on a breakthrough but, I don't know yet. I simply don't know.

I totally realize that most people will see my post and think "dude you ARE crazy, and no one cares", I get it, but that's irrelevant. I'm doing it for me, and if it succeeds, I can help others in my own ways. So that's all that matters to me - success/results/progress. It's too big of an opportunity to ignore...



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 12:43 AM
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Who is this guy John Titor?

I keep seeing his name on the board.



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 12:47 AM
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a reply to: muzzleflash

I don't think you're crazy amigo. And I applaud your efforts.

Please keep us posted as to results.

If I come across things at work that pertain to this (and that I can talk about) I'll be certain to share them too.

This is the only way there will be any progress on most of this stuff. Research and academia have their own agendas regarding what they're looking into and why.

Keep putting one foot in front of the other - you may be surprised at the results.

I'm rooting for you.



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 12:49 AM
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originally posted by: Archonic
Who is this guy John Titor?

I keep seeing his name on the board.


Just do a search here on ATS with that name.

What the OP is referring to is an epic thread started by the member John Titor some time ago.

You'll find it easily.
edit on 11/3/2016 by Riffrafter because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 12:52 AM
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a reply to: Archonic

Also Google "John Titor IBM 5100", and for fun "John Titor Mandela Effect" that will lead to some good stuff.
Enjoy the stories!

Oh and check YouTube too, there are tons of videos!



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 12:56 AM
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His patent: www.google.com...


Side note, I can't wait for the next Rick and Morty!



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 01:00 AM
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originally posted by: Reverbs
a reply to: ChaoticOrder

one more point..

I think the reason I remember "other timelines"

I think it's because my memory is not all stored in my brain.



Of course it isn't.

And *mind* is very different than brain.

Memories are not stored in the way people think - like computer or data storage. They are simply pathways in the brain that link certain neurons together. The more that pathway is used - the "stronger" the memory becomes.

2 final notes:

The mind is not a simple neuro-chemical organic thing. The brain is but the mind is a quantum device...totally.

2nd thing is that I believe we have our own personal "clouds" or parts of a cloud if you will, where much of the information re: memories are stored. That is just my belief, based on knowledge and personal experience.

Your mileage may vary, void where prohibited, etc.



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 01:02 AM
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a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Interesting topic....and a pleasant break from politics....look forward to reading more



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 01:07 AM
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a reply to: Reverbs

Yeah the Mirror Mirror one gets me as well... plus a lot of others now. There's JFK with 6 people in the car, monopoly man without a monocle, Pickachu without the stripe thing on the end of its tail, "No, I am your father", "life was like a box of chocolates", we're no longer on the edge of the Sagittarius arm, anatomy of the human body has changed, and many others.


I think the reason I remember "other timelines"

I think it's because my memory is not all stored in my brain.

Titor actually mentioned theories along those lines:


Since the existence of multiple universes is a reality from my viewpoint, please allow me to disclose an idea we toss around a bit in 2036. Since all possibilities, outcomes and events are occurring and exist simultaneously, it would mean there are multiple universes out there where "you" are living a day behind and a day ahead of the "you" on this universe. There are some who believe that memory is some sort of information transfer or communication with the "you's" in the past, across world-lines or universes. Although this is seemingly quite ridiculous, if you think that could be true, than physics tells us that the same information transfer from our future selves on other world-lines is not only possible but certain. Could it be that fantasy or "what if" scenarios are actually future memory from an alternate "us" on a future world-line? According to physics, there is no reason why this cannot be true

edit on 3/11/2016 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)

edit on 3/11/2016 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 01:21 AM
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a reply to: Archonic

This website has a collection of his posts:

John Titor Research Project

And some general info about him:

John Titor's Story

I also found the original thread he made at the start of 2001 on the Art Bell forum:

EDIT: direct link wont work so here's a link to a Reddit thread which has the link:

John Titor's Original Real Life Posts Preserved by the Wayback Machine

And an article containing pictures of the documents Titor shared:

John Titor's Time Machine
edit on 3/11/2016 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 01:22 AM
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Sure, why not.

We shouldn't overlook the effect that Leprechauns and Bigfoot have had.
Also the greys and the reptilians seem to be ignored when they could be crucial to understanding this phenomena.

Some may say that since the only evidence of the Mandela Effect is within people's memories then we should look at how memories actually work first.

Of course people who say that probably don't have the magical ability to remember superfluous information incorrectly, or they are too afraid to realise their superpowers.



posted on Nov, 3 2016 @ 01:25 AM
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a reply to: ChaoticOrder

That's a lot of links to him thanks I'll take a look at those.



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