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Transitional Fossil: Mid-size Mammoth Skull

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posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 08:49 AM
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Tale of the tusks: Discovery of intact mammoth skull raises questions


What's piqued the scientists about the skull unearthed this week is it's not big enough to qualify as a Columbian mammoth and not small enough to be a pygmy.

The pygmy mammoths, just 4 to 6 feet tall, roamed the island's grass lands and forests during the Pleistocene era, according to the National Park Service, which manages the islands.

"This (skull discovery) opens the possibility that this mammoth was intermediate in size between the two species," Bugbee said. "It could represent a transitional animal, somewhere on the way to becoming a completely dwarfed pygmy mammoth."


Interesting very short video accompanies article, but it only mentions that the Oldest Human Remains in North America were found on the same island; so, did the mammoth go extinct before the arrival of humans to the island?; or, were humans the reason for the mammoth's extinction?


"But there's a third possibility that at the end of the last glacial period, mammoths could have been under stress with limited food resources with sea levels rising at the islands. Then the arrival of humans delivered the final blow."


Just a bit more evidence unearthed to contribute to the forum. Make of it what you will, with the exception of claiming it was 'buried by Satan to fool us.'. ... because, well, that's just literally retarded thinking.




posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 08:57 AM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Sadly humans are responsible for the demise of many great creatures and it is not going to stop anytime soon . On a lighter note pygmy mammoth , there is an oxymoron if i have ever heard one .



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 09:26 AM
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I'm not incredibly educated on the subject. I gained my opinion from a historian on the Joe Rogan podcast, Randall Carlson. But it seems absolutely ridiculous that the relatively sparse and not too tech savvy human population hunted these GIANT mammoths to extinction by the millions. It seems much more plausible that an "extinction event" wiped the vast majority of them out, and those that remained couldn't recover.

Your evidence seems to back that up, as it seems humans weren't even around.



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 12:50 PM
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a reply to: hutch622

Right? Like .... "jumbo shrimp".....



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 12:54 PM
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a reply to: ironicinori

Do who in the what, now?

What on earth are you talking about, new person?

It is on an island. Maybe there were people and they hunted them. You've heard of the Buffalos, right? The article ALSO states that it's just as likely that the food supply was drastically reduced, or a local event of some kind led to their decimation. Calm down!!

SHEESH! The remains of a human were, in fact, found on that same island, dated at the same time period. Try reading before blurting.



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 12:59 PM
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a reply to: ironicinori

And also - this was a smaller version of an animal already not as huge as a dinosaur....the pygmy mammoths are only 4 - 6 feet tall. These would have been, then, about the size of a modern elephant.

Being on an island prevented migration - and where did you see that there were "millions" of them?
Don't know why you seem combative. Sorry if I'm misinterpreting.




posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 01:08 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs




so, did the mammoth go extinct before the arrival of humans to the island?; or, were humans the reason for the mammoth's extinction?


Its extinction seems to coincide almost exactly with the onset of the Younger Dryas glacial period, about 13,000 years ago. During that period temperatures changed massively over a period of a few decades.

I am saying this because I want this to be something mankind is NOT responsible for, we seem to be to blame for everything else.

Plus mammoths are incredibly cute. Furry elephants for god's sake!!!

Younger Dryas wiki




posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 01:28 PM
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a reply to: Jonjonj

Thanks for the post. Yes, we are to blame for a whole helluva lot of the mess that is this planet.....

but hopefully not for the annihilation of any more species. Including ourselves.
Seems like a reckless collective consciousness. I hate to think humanity is really as awful as it seems.

The other day I heard a story about how dolphins might actually have a "language"...like sentences.



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 01:40 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Douglas Adams forever put the dolphin question into perspective for me (a joke of course but...maybe not completely).

We are, right now, on the cusp of overwhelming and paradigm changing revelations about the nature of animals and communication.

Expect the next decade to be a game changer, the computing power available now is forcing us to look again at age old ideas regarding intelligence, and we are perhaps not prepared for the things to come.


edit on 23-9-2016 by Jonjonj because: format



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 01:58 PM
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a reply to: Jonjonj

*chuckles in agreement*

You are right. We are barely treading water on "what to do now" as a specie. Yikes.
Our tools have become catastrophic for the entire planet.

They could also heal the entire planet, if we put our minds to it.

And thanks for all the fish.


See you at the restaurant at the end of the universe.





EDIT: and yes, I mean that in both senses....I'll see you at the restaurant located there; and that is the place I will meet you when the universe ends whether it is there or not?????


edit on 9/23/2016 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 02:09 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

The photo caption in the abcnews story says this:


This undated photo, supplied by Channel Islands National Park, shows an exceptionally well preserved fossil of a complete mammoth skull unearthed by a team of scientists from an eroding stream bank on Santa Rosa Island within southern California's Channel Islands National Park. The USGS says the fossil found on Santa Rosa Island was in uplifted marine deposits that date to 80,000 years ago, much farther back in time than the last glacial period 25,000 to 12,000 years ago. (Channel Islands National Park Service via AP)
Photo Caption

Possible that the mammoth skull was already a rather old fossil by the time humans arrived on the island.

ETA

North America is an odd place. We used to have our own horses but they went extinct so we needed imports. Same with elephants, camels, and probably some other things too.
edit on 23-9-2016 by pthena because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 02:54 PM
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a reply to: pthena

It is a great case for Pangea having existed. I live on the edge of the great plains....but in a glacially carved bunch of hills along the river....we are on high ground here. And yet, it's uphill to get across the great plains to the Rockies. If all the glaciers in the rockies melt, we will be at the deep end of an inland sea (depending on the ocean's rising) or a great lake that dwarfs all of the 4 we already have...... but still, we are on the highest ground around.

We are about seven households. We all know each other. Our collective land is definitely "tillable" and fertile....and we have different skills that would prove necessary in case we were the only ones left.

I love elephants. Have you ever read Sarum by Edward Rutherfurd? It's a fascinating look at the human species since the time of mammoths.

The Clan of the Cave Bear (by Jean Auel) is another one that is fantastic. She has since expanded into a franchise, including children's books and off-shoot stories, much like Dune (Frank Herbert).....and probably soon Harry Potter.

But her original book - it was extraordinary. So is Dune.




edit on 9/23/2016 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 02:55 PM
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a reply to: Jonjonj

Oh, and don't forget, Adams talked about everyone having a calculator in their pocket.



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 03:06 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

It's a date!

And yes, we could easily solve all the planets woes. Maybe, once we actually can communicate with them, they will let us know their opinions on the subject.

I am absolutely certain they have opinions.




posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 03:08 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

I only ever have a towel...

Calculators are used to count mostly those green pieces of paper that have value only for those people who value green pieces of paper.

The Golgafrinchams valued leaves, Autumn was of course a period of both financial prosperity and rampant inflation.




posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 03:13 PM
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a reply to: Jonjonj

Oh, they absolutely do. I have been surrounded by animals my entire life. There have been only about 3 weeks in my entire 58 years that I was not living with, and in the same house, with animals.

They know how to communicate with us. And they also know what our language (verbal, tone, body) means. We communicate to them ALL THE TIME, every minute of every day that we are in their presence....and they are paying attention.

The mammals are certainly telepathic (cats, dogs, horses, dolphins, whales, porpoises, elephants, apes). (Not so sure about goats or sheep. Or llamas or zebus.....Chickens, not so much telepathic - but they're all cool in their own way....LOL!!) I can tell you what my dogs and cats are up to (we have a dog who thinks it's her job to keep a chewy "safe" and away from the other dog until his are all gone)...I could tell what my horses were feeling and thinking (I had a mare who knew precisely when an hour was up and would stop 'working' during private lessons I gave)......

The cats all have really intense personalities, too....but that would stray too far off-topic.

Animals understand us FAR BETTER than we understand ourselves, actually. It's just that arrogant humans think they are stupid 'beasts'. I'd far rather live among other beasts than people, to be honest. If I had to choose, and everyone I loved was already dead....I would just slink away with my pack of animals. And we'd be fine.


edit on 9/23/2016 by BuzzyWigs because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 03:16 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Haven't read Sarum, it looks interesting.

I read Clan of the Cave Bear when it was fresh from the publisher to an airport book rack. I loved that book. I remember starting Valley of Horses, but didn't finish, didn't catch me up as much.

I've read 4 Dune books and all Harry Potters, but those didn't have prehistoric Mammoths; plenty of spice and spells and long cons.



posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 03:47 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs



If I had to choose, and everyone I loved was already dead....I would just slink away with my pack of animals. And we'd be fine.


Well, I for one hope that your slinking away is not precipitated by any unfortunate loss.

Stick with us, we may need you when the great human-animal debates begin.




posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 04:00 PM
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a reply to: Jonjonj


Stick with us, we may need you when the great human-animal debates begin.



Done.




posted on Sep, 23 2016 @ 05:33 PM
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a reply to: pthena

Definitely try Sarum. It took me a few tries to get into it....it's a hefty tome indeed ......
but well worth the read.



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