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Europeans & Alcohol Vs. Non Europeans

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posted on Jan, 18 2005 @ 10:48 PM
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My theory is that during the evolution of Europe, parts of Asia & North Africa the human population has adapted to handle alcohol consumption more effectively than human populations from Central Africa / SubSahara & the new world Aboriginal North, Central & South America Indians & Inuit peoples.
Basically what I'm saying is populations exposed to alcohol thousands of years ago have evolved through forced natural selection to withstand the negative effects more so than populations that have been recently exposed to alcohol.
For instance all through out the dark & middle ages of Europe. The Nobility & Aristochracy would give the soldiers / barbarian hordes / warriors large amounts of wine or beer to get the courage, moral, & bravery raised to higher levels. The warriors would rush off to fight still drunk. The men that could hold their alcohol/liquor would survive the battle while the men that became too intoxicated would be slaughtered thus influencing the human population over time to become more resistant to the effects of alcohol.
This can explain why a 90 pound German female can consume more alcohol than say a 220 pound Inuit male. This is why some people who have high blood alcohol levels during a traffic stop can seem fine while others who have consumed less are more intoxicated.
Just a theory.
Please don't turn this thread into a race war and we all know there are exceptions to every rule.
I personally believe that because i'm 1/4 Cree indian, I can't handle as much alcohol as some of my pure White friends and they'll back me up on that one.




posted on Jan, 18 2005 @ 10:55 PM
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I don't know. While it does sound good, I'm pure scottish and by all rights shoud be able to drink anybody under the table. Reality is, two beer and I'm a blithering idiot (yes, moreso than usual
just thought I'd beat you all to it). I could just be the exception, though.



posted on Jan, 18 2005 @ 11:17 PM
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I think there is something to this idea. I have heard that Native Americans are prone to alcoholism because it 'hits them harder'. The theory behind this is that they did not drink before the white man came and their genetic makeup was not adapted to alcohol.

I too do not say this from a 'racist' point, rather genetics and body conditioning. Also, I heard it from my Ex who is a full blooded Chippewa. Lots of his relatives hit the bottle pretty hard (especially the females).

A side note on the the Native Americans: They fared better in Canada, the government treated them much better than the US government.

Another note on drinking- I am 100% Bohemian (Czech) and I can drink beer like Pepsi! I can kill a six pack and still be kind of sober. If I am feeling up to it I can kill a 12er in an evening. I never touch hard liquor (makes me quite ill-even just the smell of it!) and one glass of wine will put me to sleep!
I've always drunk quite alot of beer, from the age of about 16. I am 38 now but look younger and am in good physical shape (booze is supposed to age you, no?) Weird, huh? I think this must be something in my genes.....Bohemians are known for their beer, especially Pilsner. All of my relatives are big beer drinkers and I was allowed to have beer as a child too (but only a small glass).

Now I want a beer! But I am on a diet!
A note to the wise: Stay AWAY from those low carb beers - they are hideously disgusting! These and 'lite' beers are full of chemicals too......that's why they give you a wicked headache. Stick with decent beer---saving 20 calories is not worth the grossness!

[edit on 18-1-2005 by Niki]



posted on Jan, 18 2005 @ 11:25 PM
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Interesting. Maybe the problem is that I am not drinking whiskey, so my genetics aren't kicking in. I will need to experiment further with this


About First Nations, that is pretty scary considering what we've done in the past.

[edit on 18-1-2005 by Duzey]



posted on Jan, 18 2005 @ 11:51 PM
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Aboriginal Australians apparently have the same problem when it comes to alcohol as American Indians due to their isolation from alcoholic cultures. I'm of Irish, Scottish, Jewish and Manx decent (going back as far as grandparents) and can drink beer like water. However my brother can't handle his alcohol too well and my girlfriends brothers who are Japanese can drink him under the table no trouble. Europeans probably have the highest tolerence which comes from their barbarian days but I think it also very much depends on the individual. Diet also plays a role and body mass of course. I look more like a barbarian than my brother and have a very heavy set build so that's probably why.

[edit on 18-1-2005 by Trent]



posted on Jan, 19 2005 @ 12:04 AM
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Niki....

I have heard the same thing about Native American being more prone to Alcoholism. Also I read somewhere but can't remember where that Native Americans as a race had the highest rate of diabetics in the nation. Ill try to find out where.

-Reason



posted on Jan, 19 2005 @ 01:48 AM
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Good theory, except, aww, dam, shoot we Indians invented beer. And Tequila. At least 2000 years ago, maybe more. Other guys invented it elsewhere too, but we had it then. From corn. And Cactus.

Its just we're so dam honest. Preacher says, 'you drink?' and the car salesman says 'occasionaly'. Ask me that and I say 'helyeah!'.

So we get branded. It helps to villify your enemy. If a friend of yours drinks with you, he's a pal. If your enemy drinks- he's a dam alcoholic.

We sure do get diabetes nowadays, from eating junk food. If you keep with mesquite beans and such and stay fit and trim, no problem.

So enjoy in moderation and in private, like you had to brew it yourself. Stay away from machinery. Be nice. And dump the junkfood. If you are on the wagon, great for you.

By the way, take a bunch of grapes from the store. Squish them in a bowl with your fingers. Wait a day or two. Presto, alky. They'll do it right on the vine if you just leave them. No big invention, just natural law.


[edit on 19-1-2005 by Chakotay]



posted on Jan, 19 2005 @ 06:51 AM
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Maybe in South America and parts of the south west in America but in the majority of the midwest, plains, Eastern, Central, Western, & Northern Canada they Native population sought to trade with Europeans for the legendary FIREWATER. If they already knew how to make it for the past 2000 years then why would they initiate trade?????
Simple: they didn't know what it was yet.
Tequilla can only be made in the Mexican town of Tequilla otherwise it's called something else.



posted on Jan, 19 2005 @ 07:11 AM
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This is an old theory I have heard it many, many times on boards and IRL and also has been talked about on TV. .. Native Americans are not known on a whole, for being able to handle our drinking. Alcohol was not introduced to us until a late date...our systems just don't handle it as well.



posted on Jan, 19 2005 @ 07:34 AM
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Well, I must say, my father is from Poland (with German heritage) and he drinks like a fish, but I have not seen him drunk. He was brought up before and during WW2, drinking vodka and other potent spirits and has a very high alcohol tolerance. He is in his mid-80's and still drinks daily and is very healthy for his age.

However, I have noticed that indiginous cultures in Australia cannot handle alcohol at all.

I agree with the theory that cultures can be 'conditioned' to tolerate alcohol. In fact, it is a theory I rely on most weekends and after work on stressfull weekdays!!! LOLOLOLOLOLOL



posted on Jan, 20 2005 @ 04:52 AM
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What indians invented beer? The summerians did it 9000years ago. The egyptians,Romans, Teutons.



posted on Jan, 20 2005 @ 05:29 AM
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I work in the brewing industry, and I can tell you that the suggestion that one race may be more genetically susceptible to alcohol than another is a fallacy.
There are sociological reasons why some races seem to be unable to control alcoholism than others.

Just three that spring to mind:

a) Poverty.
b) Media portrayal.
c) They don't drink often and therefore have not built up an immunity.


The claim that "Central Africa / SubSahara & the new world Aboriginal North, Central & South America Indians & Inuit peoples are prone to alcoholism" is not true. Most of their cultures have been around alcohol for thousands of years and they probably respect it more than the Western cultures do. But put any person in a Western culture with no money, no job and treated like a second class citizen and you will find that they may turn to alcohol as a crutch. This goes for the white man as much as it does for anyone else.

At the moment, alcoholism is just as much a problem in the West as it is anywhere else in the world, if not more - for example, the UK is having to enact laws to control it. When a country has to legislate, you know they're in trouble.



posted on Jan, 20 2005 @ 05:45 AM
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Humm.... a good point well made.

ANd in answer... well.. there must be something to what you are saying... it would make sense.

On the other hand alcohol is soooooo old and is regularly comsumed by animals (with no technology needed to make it either). Whet i am suggesting here is you don't need to "invent" it to have access to it. Redering your "cultures that invented it are more resistant" arg kind of useless.. as you can get drunk without inventing booze.

But more regular drinking could/would/should make you more resistant you are right.

Hmmm... makes you wonder [/



posted on Jan, 24 2005 @ 03:58 AM
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if i dont drink for quite a while and then decide to have a few drinks i can get wasted quite fast. But if i go out during the week and drink and go to the bars on the weekends and get plastered...eventually it continually takes more and more. Sometimes i wont feel anything until about 8th drink. i think it all has to do with do you drink alot? are you on any meds that could weaken your liver ? are you eating the right food ? just my 2 cents

P.S. Im Canadian and drinking US beer takes way too long to get drunk


Tahlen



posted on Jan, 24 2005 @ 05:00 AM
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i dont know if any1 has already said this but here i go anyway in the east they boiled water to get rid of infection in europe we fermented it into wine and other drinks so over the years yes we did get used to it its a small change like us growing taller on average and having straighter spines



posted on Jan, 24 2005 @ 05:17 AM
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This statement i think is partly correct but they are making it out bigger than it is, their is just as much white drunks as african, indians,asians, first off the africans were doing way heavier drugs so i wouldnt give them any slack, indians have been around for a long time and comsumed it thousands of years ago in Persian times. The asians also hadl alcohol, for exaomple japenese sake has been around for along time also.
But yes this cultures especialy Aboringels, Native New Zealanders, Native Americans have not been introduced to alcohole in recent times compared to the other european cultures. So they are more prone to be less tolerant of acohole but this does not neccesary means more addictions. Not all of these native people are drunks at all, its jsut when they do drink they do get more drunk quicker.



posted on Jan, 24 2005 @ 08:05 AM
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Its not a theory its a fact, after the romans system of waterworks went, medieval supplies of water regularly got dirty and full of disease, thus it was used to make beer. If you couldnt handle it, you died from disease, even kids drank it. Im not sure about other races around the world, but i believe the japanese are famously light drinkers.



posted on Jan, 24 2005 @ 08:12 AM
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Originally posted by BattleofBatoche
My theory[/quote[
Infact, this is the theory as to wh europeans and others are able to handle alcohol but native americans just can't. Its got nothing to do with personal fortitude, they lack the physiological ability to process ethanol properly.


For instance all through out the dark & middle ages of Europe.

Infact, alcholoic drinks are one of the oldest beverages, one of the older things, around. The ancient sumerians brewed beer, and wine was famously popular throughout the mediteranean.



I personally believe that because i'm 1/4 Cree indian, I can't handle as much alcohol as some of my pure White friends and they'll back me up on that one.


I don't know the specific genetics involved, but it might be a moderately simple system that is easily inherited; thus a person who is mostly native might have some non native ancestry and just happened to have inherited the gene or genes involved, but your idea seems reasonable.



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