The American Mystery Sub

Originally posted by Cruizer
I don't even know where the original poster is getting 65 MPH. I scanned through the 2 links provided and the one only mentions the standard "25+ knots" speed which doesn't translate to 65 MPH. 65 KILOMETERS per hour is reasonable. 65KPH = 40 MPH

I was going to say exactly what did you did, and you saved me all the typing

I looked thru both links as well and only saw 25+ knots so I have 2 questions:

Why did the thread starter say you will see the published speed? 25+ knots still sounds vauge to me, so who knows what it really is? its all classified.

Where did people get the 65mph or kmp figures from?

Me, My Father and My Brother worked for General Dynamics for a few years.
I'm pretty sure it did not do 65 mph.

However. Those electric motors on the Seawolf are quite as hell.


[edit on 3-11-2006 by sandman658]

Originally posted by sandman658
Me, My Father and My Brother worked for General Dynamics for a few years.
I'm pretty sure it did not do 65 mph.

However. Those electric motors on the Seawolf are quite as hell.


[edit on 3-11-2006 by sandman658]

You , your Father , and Brother worked for Electric Boat?? If so on what project/projects?? Sea Wolf?

Thanks,
Orangetom

The extra length on the Jimmy Carter boat:

Read the description on the link.

www.chinfo.navy.mil...

The design offers flexibility of course, but the principal operation is deployment of underwater NSA signal intelligence devices, including the tapping undersea cables as well as maintaining & enhancing US sensor arrays.

This is the job the SEALS may be doing.

Forget the "new" US Subs. The Germans have the real deal. Their new U-Boat is smokin'. It has a composite hull, with no metal skin to detect, The modern, efficient, and quiet Diesel engine is suspended within the hull (imagine an engine hung on bungies and you get the idea) to minimize sound and it is NOT the main drive engine. It is only used to create fuel. The real fuel source is made from splitting sea water into Hydrogen and Oxygen for use in a fuel cell. When asked why a fuel cell and not Nuclear, the crafty Germans responded.... " Nuclear is so noisy, what with all the pumps and cooling compressor and all. Fuel cells are totally silent. Finding this sub when running in silent mode with the diesels off ... well... Whales make more noise. So do schools of fish.

Originally posted by Terapin
Forget the "new" US Subs. The Germans have the real deal. Their new U-Boat is smokin'. It has a composite hull, with no metal skin to detect, The modern, efficient, and quiet Diesel engine is suspended within the hull (imagine an engine hung on bungies and you get the idea) to minimize sound and it is NOT the main drive engine. It is only used to create fuel. The real fuel source is made from splitting sea water into Hydrogen and Oxygen for use in a fuel cell. When asked why a fuel cell and not Nuclear, the crafty Germans responded.... " Nuclear is so noisy, what with all the pumps and cooling compressor and all. Fuel cells are totally silent. Finding this sub when running in silent mode with the diesels off ... well... Whales make more noise. So do schools of fish.

UR a bit out of date here with the pumps and cooling compressor buisness. The technology has moved on substantially. This information is available on the web.

You have heard a large diesel engine running right...suspended or not???

Orangetom

Fuel cells require pumps and heat exchangers so they are not all that quier either. At least in the automotive arena.

mikell

Originally posted by mikellmikell
Fuel cells require pumps and heat exchangers so they are not all that quier either. At least in the automotive arena.

mikell

Pumps and heat exchangers have taken quantum leaps in design improvements over the years. Specifically quieting features of which I wont go into.

Also both of these types of equipment can be suspension mounted as was described in the post above pertaining to how the diesel engine is mounted..suspended so to speak. This too is not new technology....though there are new designs based on new materials coming out ..but it is still suspension mounting/engineering.

They spend mucho mucho bucks on this type of engineering application. If you ever saw the invoices for what this equipment costs to suspension mount ..your lower jaw would hit the floor.

Automobiles have equipment which is mounted on rubber for mostly vibration...not necessarily sound. Most automobile pumps are hard mounted to the engines. The engines themselves are suspension mounted for vibration not so much for sound. Though I will admit ..many engines today are much better balanced than was so 30 years ago. Much smoother vibration free operation than the olde days.
Most Cooling systems on a automoblie..those not air cooled.. the radiators are hard mounted and isolated from engine vibration by flexable rubber hoses.

Thanks,
Orangetom

Originally posted by mikellmikell
Fuel cells require pumps and heat exchangers so they are not all that quier either. At least in the automotive arena.

Regardless, the U-212/U-214 is the still one the best conventional submarines in the world. If its ASW or ASuW you need a submarine to do near your coast, these are the systems you want.

If it on the other guys coast, and the other guy is far away, you need a nuke. The other part of the U-212/U-214 lacks, and is why neither the Japanese and Aussies use AIP in their current subs, is enough power output to do the leg work of modern submarines during peacetime.

Specifically, spy on the other guy.

Originally posted by mikellmikell
Fuel cells require pumps and heat exchangers so they are not all that quier either. At least in the automotive arena.

mikell

Watch this about the U212. At 3:00 he says no heat, no sound and the only byproduct is water. Later in the movie at about 5:00 the Captain says they have no cooling pumps like a nuclear setup, and no moving parts now obviously screw and shaft have to turn, and there's electric motors driving it , but it sounds like there are very few moving parts in total

www.youtube.com...





[edit on 17-11-2006 by warpboost]

That captain said it's the quietest boat he knew about. A tacit admital that there are quiter boats around. Plus everything he bragged about was old hat in the SUB world.

Originally posted by Terapin
Forget the "new" US Subs. The Germans have the real deal. Their new U-Boat is smokin'. It has a composite hull, with no metal skin to detect, The modern, efficient, and quiet Diesel engine is suspended within the hull (imagine an engine hung on bungies and you get the idea)

to minimize sound and it is NOT the main drive engine. Suspended or not diesel generators stil makea lot of noise.

It is only used to create fuel. The real fuel source is made from splitting sea water into Hydrogen and Oxygen for use in a fuel cell.[/QUOTE] Which alos provides the worst energy density out of all AIP's.

When asked why a fuel cell and not Nuclear, the crafty Germans responded.... " Nuclear is so noisy, what with all the pumps and cooling compressor and all. Fuel cells are totally silent. Finding this sub when running in silent mode with the diesels off ... well... Whales make more noise. So do schools of fish.

Nuclear subamrines use convection/natural circulation for cooling.Pumps we're abandoned long ago. AIP boats are for coastal defense not for power projection,they lack the speed and endurance for it. Not to mention an inferior sensor suite,power for high powered active sonars,less pace for computers/processors,smaller weapons loadout etc. It is said the larger the sub the more quiet it is. This is true even for diesel subs. The collins is significntly quieter than other smaller diesels. Nuke boats are bigger than any diesel which allows for more things like sound absorbing foam.Also another advanatge a nuclear boat has is the option of a pumpjet which quieter than any propellor. Since they're heavy only nuclear subs can carry them.

I don't mean to be rude but a lot of us spent time trying to explain amny misonception regarding nuclear and conventional subs. Posts very much like the one you posted are tiresome.Next time please try to read the rest of the thread before making comments.

Originally posted by Starwars51

Originally posted by groingrinder
We must challenge the Russians to a "SUBMARINE DRAG RACE". That will settle this once and for all.

Firs the Russians will have to scrap up enough money to actually put one of their subs out to sea fully operational. The best sub in the world is useless if you can't afford to get it out of the docks.

I will bet that the money could be raised by broadcasting it on pay per view. Imagine all the sponsors that would get on board. It would be kind of like the X-Games.

[edit on 11-17-2006 by groingrinder]

[edit on 11-17-2006 by groingrinder]

[edit on 11-17-2006 by groingrinder]

A lot of the noise of a diesel could be elliminated by making longer strokes and fewer reps.
How long can the German sub stay submerged?

Originally posted by SenHeathen
A lot of the noise of a diesel could be elliminated by making longer strokes and fewer reps.
How long can the German sub stay submerged?

15 days at no more than 5 knots is the current record.

Originally posted by BASSPLYR
That captain said it's the quietest boat he knew about. A tacit admital that there are quiter boats around. Plus everything he bragged about was old hat in the SUB world.

Yes BASSPLYR,

I understood that immediately when the captain made the statement.

When you have a diesel engine coupled to a generator and this engine is sound mounted ..suspended ..it means the diesel has to be run often...like regularly ..on schedule. This diesel is part of the primary equipment. It is not a backup system.

This is however ..a very good video...very intresting.

THanks,
Orangetom