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Do you support socialism with government or without government?

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posted on Apr, 13 2016 @ 06:19 PM
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originally posted by: John_Rodger_Cornman
But then the QE would be impossible.

Would 1:10 fiat to gold coin ratio would be a good start?

Maybe gold+resource+land to fiat would be more realistic.


Congratulations, you just invented Fractional Reserve Banking. It's the concept that you print currency backed by a smaller amount of actually redeemable physical items. For several centuries the reserve ratio was actually set at 10:1, meaning there would be $1 in actual wealth stored for every $10 in the economy, or to put it another way $1 worth of gold for every $10 in circulation. After going off of the gold standard however that changed to $1 in currency for every $10 in bank liabilities (money in peoples accounts and such). The current leverage rate is 100:1.22 meaning there is $1.22 for every $100 in peoples accounts. When 2008 hit the ratio was 15:1 or 20:1 officially but in practice closer to 33:1 because everyone was skirting the regulations.

10:1 makes for a healthy leverage rate (sidenote, this is where the old concept of a 10% down payment came from, you put up 10%, the bank leveraged that to 100% of the price), but what we have right now is utter insanity, leverage is a good thing as it increases the money supply, but the higher you make the ratio the more instability you add to the system, however even moreso than QE this is what has been required to keep our system afloat.

Lowering the leverage rate is where we need to look to start to get the system healthy again. What actually backs the currency doesn't matter, and if you would like I can show you how even a pure barter system like many predict would happen in a collapse will quickly evolve to an entirely fiat system.




posted on Apr, 13 2016 @ 06:29 PM
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a reply to: Aazadan

How do you back up a currency at 1:1 value when there is trillions of dollars in the world markets?

There is not enough gold/silver in the world to back that up.

Currently they can print billions of dollars per month indefinitely.

Maybe metals+freshwater+land+energy to back it up?
edit on 13-4-2016 by John_Rodger_Cornman because: added content



posted on Apr, 13 2016 @ 09:59 PM
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originally posted by: John_Rodger_Cornman
How do you back up a currency at 1:1 value when there is trillions of dollars in the world markets?

There is not enough gold/silver in the world to back that up.

Currently they can print billions of dollars per month indefinitely.

Maybe metals+freshwater+land+energy to back it up?


You can't. That's why commodity backed currency doesn't work. The only commodity that works is oil, there's just about enough oil reserves on the planet to fully back the dollar, but that implies we don't burn any oil and it somehow maintains it's value despite that. It would also do nothing for every other currency on the planet. Fiat is the way to go, commodities just don't work.

In particular precious metals made into coins are particularly bad due to arbitrage. If the coins are worth more than the metals, coins buy metal, then it's struck into coins for a profit creating massive inflation. If the coins are worth less than the metals they're melted down for profit and the money supply dwindles. In either case the markets are just too efficient at finding/delivering goods these days and that can result in private citizens effectively being able to manipulate currency values.



posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 01:38 PM
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a reply to: Aazadan

You can but the oil companies would not agree to it.

You would need an energy supply that is higher than the total output of the earth(sunlight).
A satellite solar harvesting array that beams energy in the form of microwaves down to reception sites on the earth's surface. Entire countries draw their power from this source and it never goes out. It's immune to EMP.

If you want to purchase power you have to purchase it with dollars(within the United States). If your in Japan you have to purchase power you have to purchase it with yen(from within Japan). If your in Russia you have to purchase power with rubles(from within Russia). If your in China you have to purchase power with yuan(from within China).

Instead of the petro-dollar it would be the solar-dollar,yen,rubble or yuan
edit on 15-4-2016 by John_Rodger_Cornman because: added content

edit on 15-4-2016 by John_Rodger_Cornman because: added content



posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 01:49 PM
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a reply to: John_Rodger_Cornman

That doesn't work, solar energy can't be physically stored. Some limited energy from any source could be stored in batteries but that's all. Gold, silver, oil, and all the rest can physically be placed in a vault forever. That's why people look to them as a store of wealth.

You would have to do it in reverse the way bitcoin does, where the currency itself is created by using energy, but even that is fiat.



posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 02:02 PM
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a reply to: Aazadan

You don't have to physically store it for it to have value. It's valuable because people want it and it is useful.
If the local currency is the only way to buy this resource it becomes more valuable.

The value is what you can do with it(power factories,cars,machines,electronics,hospitals,etc)supply(more than the earth can ever use),demand(VERY high demand),and cost of extraction/processing(very low compared to fossil fuels) and availability of the resource(anywhere on the earth's surface that can build a receiver site).



posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 05:47 PM
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a reply to: John_Rodger_Cornman

I support national socialism, the nation decides on all of the above, The decided Leader enforces their decision with no favouritism. Literally doing whats good for the nation as a whole.



posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 05:51 PM
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None of the above.



posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 06:01 PM
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originally posted by: Acidx
a reply to: John_Rodger_Cornman

I support national socialism, the nation decides on all of the above, The decided Leader enforces their decision with no favouritism. Literally doing whats good for the nation as a whole.


Too much government.

Way too authoritarian.

Centralized power is dangerous.

Personally I really dislike socialism. But I am a pro-capitalist libertarian.
edit on 15-4-2016 by John_Rodger_Cornman because: added content



posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 07:04 PM
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originally posted by: John_Rodger_Cornman
a reply to: Aazadan

You don't have to physically store it for it to have value. It's valuable because people want it and it is useful.
If the local currency is the only way to buy this resource it becomes more valuable.

The value is what you can do with it(power factories,cars,machines,electronics,hospitals,etc)supply(more than the earth can ever use),demand(VERY high demand),and cost of extraction/processing(very low compared to fossil fuels) and availability of the resource(anywhere on the earth's surface that can build a receiver site).


If you can't redeem it for actual goods outside of the market, it's fiat. Part of redeeming it means there needs to be physical stores somewhere. if those stores don't match the amount in circulation on a 1:1 ratio, your currency isn't fully backed, and is therefore fiat.



posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 07:15 PM
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a reply to: Aazadan

Its valuable because its the only currency that you can buy that valuable resource with(legally).

Without that it is just some paper with pictures on it.



posted on Apr, 15 2016 @ 07:49 PM
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posted on Apr, 16 2016 @ 09:53 PM
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a reply to: Aazadan

Why does the US dollar have any purchasing power at all?



posted on Apr, 17 2016 @ 02:01 AM
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originally posted by: John_Rodger_Cornman
a reply to: Aazadan

Why does the US dollar have any purchasing power at all?


Because the government accepts it for the payment of taxes.



posted on Apr, 17 2016 @ 10:30 AM
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a reply to: Aazadan

What is the petro-dollar and how does that effect the dollar's value?



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