After Gender change what new comes in Medicine? Trans Specie Surgery or Hormonal treatment?

originally posted by: The angel of light
a reply to: Annee

I sincerely don't know with whom are you confusing me, or what is your problem to discuss all the theories and just not only the ones you know about Gender dysphoria and support the industry of Gender make up.

Science, doctors, psychologist, who specialize in transgender and actual transgenders (links provided throughout thread).

vs.

Fundamental God Belief.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: Annee

Yep, there are religious zealots in the medical field too - claiming all it takes is a little "meditation" (i.e. prayer) to get rid of the gay or the gender dysphoria. Religious charlatans is all they are.

Not surprising at all.

Oh, I know.

I've been following the LGBT information for over 20 years.

Ya learn. I can pretty much catch the "anti's" in their first sentence phrasing.

Not Paul McHugh again. Ugh! This guy just needs to go away.

Did Angel bring up Regnerus also? I might have missed that.

Unfortunately, it appears that McHugh has decided to ignore the growing body of neurological and genetic research providing evidence of a biological basis for gender dysphoria. A 2009 study found a correlation between an increased number of a certain kind of sequence repeat in the Androgen Receptor gene and gender dysphoria. Another study in 2009 identified significant differences in cerebral grey matter structure in trans women who had yet to start hormone therapy when compared to cis men. In 2011, researchers noted that the structure of a sexually-dimorphic region of the brain, known as the intermediate nucleus, of trans women fell somewhere between cis men and cis women, while a similar difference was not noted castrated cis men. A 2013 functional brain imaging study of adolescents with gender dysphoria demonstrated a tendency for trans teens to perform more similarly to their identified sex (as opposed to their assigned sex) in a verbal fluency assessment, with similar correlation in brain activity during the assessment. Lastly, in 2013, a large study of monozygotic (identical) and dizygotic (fraternal) twins where at least one twin was transgender showed a far higher concordance of a diagnosis of gender dysphoria among monozygotic than dizygotic twins (33% vs 2.6%), which is strong indicator the existence of a biological factor in a trait. While much of the research into the biological aspects of trans people is still very new, Dr McHugh’s assertion that no evidence for a biological basis for trans identities demonstrates a deplorable ignorance of current medical research. - See more at: www.transadvocate.com... kyN.dpuf

a reply to: The angel of light

You've got to be kidding me? Paul McHugh? Pfox.org? Gee, I think you've also forgotten the misinterpretations of the research done by the Karolinska Institute in you anti-transgender crusade as well as that from Zucker and Bradley. You're not really trying hard enough. In case it isn't clear, notice my mocking tone and sarcasm.

Nothing anybody can say is going to change your mind and you can find conservative, right-wing, religious anti-gay and anti-trans propaganda all over the web to support your misguided opinions but it doesn't change the fact that the vast majority, in fact a consensus of the medical and scientific research community disagrees with what you think. As someone well studied in this field for years as well as being an advocate and supporter of transgender and gender non-conforming youth and their families, I can say with wholehearted conviction that your ideas and attitudes are simply wrong and damaging.

Did you know that reparative or "conversion" therapies touted by many of the organizations listed in your linked PDF is illegal in many states and Obama has urged that it be outlawed nationally? If you are genuinely "concerned" as you try to appear to be then you would know this approach is damaging and ineffective. To me personally, it is criminal.

You're really in way over your head on this subject and trying to sound knowledgeable and demonstrate expertise based on faulty or discredited information and it simply doesn't fly for those of us not blinded by close minded conservatism or moralistic religious dogma or those of us actually familiar with the lives and experiences of transgender and transsexual people. The things you believe and promote do nothing but add to the difficulty these people face in life and for someone that thinks they are some sort of "angel of light", you're sure spreading a lot of darkness and negativity that in no way is helpful or does a damn thing to make these peoples lives better.

Face it. You're just a hater and like they say, haters gonna hate. Just come out and say it and stop with all the concern trolling. No one will think any less of you. Personally, it's hard to have a lower opinion than I already have of this thread and of your spreading of junk science, half truths and misinformation. Go for it!

Does she use a litter box?

Have you seen parrot man, Parrot man had his ears removed.

a reply to: Freija
Amen!! Thank you! ^.^

originally posted by: Mousygretchen
a reply to: Freija
Amen!! Thank you! ^.^

DITTO

DITTO

a reply to: Annee

Anne and Freija,

Now I realize what is your problem, you both have a personal fight against people that is in the other side of your extreme position on this topic that happen to be possibly affiliated to religious organizations, while probably you are affiliated to antireligious groups.

The problem here is that it is clear that this is something almost personal for you, and it is exactly that subjectivism what is closing your mind to see all the suffering that the artificial life offered by the medical centers you are defending to the people with these problems is unnecessary and even it carries irreparable personal damages that go far beyond the obvious mutilation of human bodies.

Your position here is pretty passionate, it does not show at all the prudent attitude of who is truly in search for truth, you have launched to me a ton of personal attacks when I have been tried to have a civilized dialog with you on the theme.

I have brought to discussion serious research clinical work carried out by various scientists ( Not only Dr Paul McHugh but also Dr Jon Meyer) working along decades in one of the leading schools of medicine of this country, John Hopkins, but not only there, I have also mentioned professional work done in various of the most prestigious Israelian Universities as well as the work of Dr Eric Fraser,Gender Research and Education Society of London , using this same approach in England too.

This research is showing with data collected along decades in Hospitals from actual patients already treated with surgery and hormones that the physicians that support the transgender making up of Gender treatments are instead of solving the issue messing it even more.

Here a link to the seminal paper published in this topic by Physicians from the Wohl Institute, Bar-llan University, Tel Aviv University and that has been presented in America by the University of Oregon, that has nothing to do with John Hopkins:

www.psy.miami.edu...

At least I feel well that I opened this thread to offer the opportunity to the patients with gender dysphoria to know that the misinformation they are receiving from all those surgeons that are profiting a lot from them actually don't want they know. My motivation is absolutely scientific and humanitarian over any other consideration, to uncover the truth in this subject, not to make politics here.

Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness

originally posted by: The angel of light
a reply to: Annee
Now I realize what is your problem, you have a personal fight against people that is in the other side of your extreme position on this topic that happen to be possibly affiliated to religious organizations, while probably you are affiliated to antireligious groups.

My problem? That you think this is a religious issue.

I've followed/researched LGBT info for 20+ years.

I am well aware of McHuge's nonsense.

What else ya got?

a reply to: The angel of light

You really want to keep this going?

Who are you kidding other than yourself? Your concern for all these poor transgender people being misled by the evil medical industrial complex for the sake of profit is bullsnip and fits the definition of concern trolling to a tee.

How to Spot Anti-Trans Concern Trolls

Now I realize what is your problem, you both have a personal fight against people that is in the other side of your extreme position on this topic that happen to be possibly affiliated to religious organizations, while probably you are affiliated to antireligious groups.

Our position is not extreme. It is actually conventional and standard. I don't have a fight against you, just against the ignorance and misinformation that you are promoting as some kind of fact. I am not affiliated with some kind of anti-religious group - this has nothing to do with religion. Groups I do support and have some involvement with are Gender Spectrum, Camp Aranu'tiq and the Trans Youth Equality Foundation

For a religious perspective:
One Woman's Journey Growing Up Transgender and Mormon

Watch the video to the end and see if this father doesn't choke you up. Also notice how much pain religion is causing in this family's life. If your god is so perfect, why are people born with this condition? I don't want to attack any religion but when it is made political and hateful and tries to force twisted morality on others or determine what is appropriate medical treatment for something they know nothing about, then I must speak out with facts and science and with knowledge of the lives and struggles trans people face. This is not some profiteering plot. For these people, it is hope and salvation and the only known and proven successful course of action for those seriously suffering with gender dysphoria. This is not some new phenomenon just because you've seen it in the media or read something about it on an Xtian blog.

The problem here is that it is clear that this is something almost personal for you, and it is exactly that subjectivism what is closing your mind to see all the suffering that the artificial life offered by the medical centers you are defending to the people with these problems is unnecessary and even it carries irreparable personal damages that go far beyond the obvious mutilation of human bodies.

Maybe your problem because you have no concept of the ruined lives, disenfranchisement, discrimination, suicide, repression, hostility and prejudice these people have to live with at different points in their lives nor of the tens of thousands that have turned things around and been "saved" by transition, medical intervention and therapy.

Your position here is pretty passionate, it does not show at all the prudent attitude of who is truly in search for truth, you have launched to me a ton of personal attacks when I have been tried to have a civilized dialog with you on the theme.

I have been polite and civil. What has been attacked is the ignorance and misinformation you seem to think is helpful somehow. Are you taking it personal?

I have brought to discussion serious research clinical work carried out by various scientists ...Here a link to the seminal paper published in this topic by Physicians from the Wohl Institute, Bar-llan University, Tel Aviv University and that has been presented in America by the University of Oregon, that has nothing to do with John Hopkins:

www.psy.miami.edu...

Oh come on now. That has nothing to do with squat. Doesn't really explain these guys either.





Go back a page and download and read WPATH's Standards of Care and get back to me. Until then I simply cannot take you seriously because you are simply wrong and the misinformation you are spreading is actually misleading and dangerous.

My motivation is absolutely scientific and humanitarian over any other consideration, to uncover the truth in this subject, not to make politics here.

Nothing could be further from the truth. Your motivation is obvious and humanitarianism has diddly squat to do with it.

Jesus christ

I would like to become part bear. Like, keep my gorgeous human face, but just have the body of a bear, anyone gets in my way I smack 'em down

If you want the world to stop laughing at you, don't consistently uphold the popular stereotype that Christians are idiots.

People who need organ transplants have to fight a heavy battle against tissue rejection, and to give someone a blood transfusion without killing them, you need to have the right blood type. Do you think that animals and humans have exactly the same type of blood? It's not going to happen.

But you know, the biggest problem is our culture of being offended, our culture of demanding everything we want and demanding that the world respect our insanity

It's a trend that will hopefully die before too much longer.

What will be new?

Hopefully a cold splash of reality that convinces people to stop pandering to identity delusions.