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Bernie Sanders’s single-payer plan isn’t a plan at all

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posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 05:41 PM
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originally posted by: AlaskanDad
a reply to: DBCowboy



No much room left in our society for cowboys is there???



No.

No there isn't.




posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 05:49 PM
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a reply to: DBCowboy

Corporations are considered people, yet have many more rights than you and I.

I'm not stating that you specifically have supported in that past, but you are now aren't you?

By stating leave it to the free market, you're agreeing that as it stands now, everything is fine, and we should just continue down the same path.

~Tenth



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 05:49 PM
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a reply to: DBCowboy

If the crash comes, it might be a legitimate career choice again.



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 05:54 PM
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originally posted by: tothetenthpower
a reply to: DBCowboy

Corporations are considered people, yet have many more rights than you and I.

I'm not stating that you specifically have supported in that past, but you are now aren't you?

By stating leave it to the free market, you're agreeing that as it stands now, everything is fine, and we should just continue down the same path.

~Tenth


It's not a free market though. It hasn't been since Obamacare, and even before that, if you want to get technical.

Government (under any and every politician) has been trying since forever to get their slimy hands into the free market.

They have succeeded.



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 05:54 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: AlaskanDad

No, many of us never wanted THAT either, but of course, no one listened to us.



If the republicans had not had the idiot Palin flapping on about death panels and such, the people might have listened.

But then again they might not have anyway!

edit on 18-1-2016 by AlaskanDad because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 05:55 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: DBCowboy

If the crash comes, it might be a legitimate career choice again.



Everyone who doesn't know how to ride a horse is going to be hurting! Then again, anyone who doesn't already know how probably should learn.




posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 05:56 PM
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a reply to: tothetenthpower

In order to leave anything to the free market, the market actually has to be free.

Having Medicare, Medicaid and Tricare in the system by themselves, regulatory practice aside, guarantees vast distortion in the market. Then you factor in regulatory practice which further brings government force and distortion into the system.

And then we can talk Obamacare which is really public/private partnership, better known as fascism.



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 05:57 PM
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a reply to: AlaskanDad

Well now Klein is flapping on about Death Panels.

So what are you going to do? Call him an idiot?



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 05:59 PM
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originally posted by: tothetenthpower
a reply to: DBCowboy

Corporations are considered people, yet have many more rights than you and I.

I'm not stating that you specifically have supported in that past, but you are now aren't you?

By stating leave it to the free market, you're agreeing that as it stands now, everything is fine, and we should just continue down the same path.

~Tenth


It deserves to be repeated that our Bill of Rights are negative rights.

They are absolute preclusions to government behavior not permissions.

As such, any group shares their protections no less than any individual.

The only exception is government itself and its representatives which have no rights under the constitution, only responsibilities.



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 06:00 PM
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a reply to: ketsuko

In any society that has government & laws a free market can not exist.

Anything that is on today's black market, would have to be allowed in a true free market.

No holds barred!



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 06:02 PM
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a reply to: ketsuko

OK, he is an idiot!!!

There are other things I would call him, but I will be polite.



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 06:02 PM
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a reply to: AlaskanDad

You understand you are talking to a few libertarians on this thread. Right?



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 06:03 PM
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originally posted by: AlaskanDad
a reply to: ketsuko

OK, he is an idiot!!!

There are other things I would call him, but I will be polite.



So you are all in for rationing? Even if it would deny life-saving treatment for someone you know and love or even yourself?

Even if the system were such that seeking that treatment were more or less illegal for you, so you would have to be doomed to knowing you were dying but didn't have to?
edit on 18-1-2016 by ketsuko because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 06:04 PM
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originally posted by: AlaskanDad
a reply to: ketsuko

In any society that has government & laws a free market can not exist.

Anything that is on today's black market, would have to be allowed in a true free market.

No holds barred!
The free market is anarchy of production in Marxian terms or economic anarchy, not freedom from accountability.



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 06:18 PM
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a reply to: greencmp

So you favor a free market with controls and restrictions???

Where does one draw the line, the fed, banks, transportation, pollution, trade tariffs???

I say no free market can exist with a modern government and it's laws in place.



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 06:22 PM
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God you Americans are so ignorant it's almost cute (well, just sad and pathetic if your a bloke, tbh).

Why do you think Obama did what he did and called it Obamacare? It was a deliberate tactic, since congress wouldn't allow him to create universal healthcare, so he created a system which the republicans wouldn't be suicidal enough to touch, unless it was to make the system more efficient. Its a long term plan to direct the republicans hand and force them into doing the right thing for the American people by creating a universal healthcare system.

He's a much more intelligent bloke than what you bunch of capitalist groupies give him credit for... lol.



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 06:28 PM
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a reply to: AlaskanDad

If you want to talk about pure stateless anarcho-capitalism, Murray Rothbard is the most thorough theorist.

No central authority and property rights based systems of justice with extensive appeals agreements seems to be a viable solution. I don't necessarily find that completely realistic but, it is hardly impossible.

I am just saying that hurting people is always going to be addressed whether there is authoritarian government or not. That means that if you cook up a poisonous batch of goof balls, you're not likely to avoid justice.



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 06:29 PM
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a reply to: Subaeruginosa

I'm not sure which of us you are addressing. Most of us are well aware Obamacare was designed to be a Trojan Horse.

It's designed to overload and collapse the system and thus create problems people will beg government to "save" us from, and then government is supposed to offer us single payer as our "only hope."

We preach this daily to people in the hopes no one forgets it was government who screwed us in the first place. Hence Obamacare.


edit on 18-1-2016 by ketsuko because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 06:32 PM
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a reply to: Subaeruginosa

But Obama wanted the Public Option.

But enough Democrats in Congress killed it.

And the ACA had (still has) coercive language written in to it for a purpose.

You keep blaming Americans, while cleverly "forgetting" it was a Democrat plan 100%.

No Republicans in Congress voted in favor.

100% Democrat and it still failed.

And many Democrat people don't like it either.




posted on Jan, 18 2016 @ 06:47 PM
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a reply to: xuenchen




100% Democrat and it still failed.


Which were 99.5% corporately owned politicians, I know D and R makes everything right or wrong in the eyes of the masses...

...but their all drinking the lobbyists koolaid!

Sanders was the .5% that did not sale himself to the corporates. lol's




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