The ark it's possible…

I believe Noah ark was possible. You have look and understand however what the bible is saying about it. So let’s look at few things…

---Noah was to take the animals that came to him. He didn’t round-up a bunch of animals they came to him.

---If Noah was smart he also would have baby animals instead of full grown animals

---The Bible also say take pairs of animals per there KIND so that they may bring forth after the KIND. The word “kind” is the key. Noah didn’t have to bring very type of Dog he only had to have one a pair of Dogs. Any little kid can look at a wolf and mutt and tell you they’re both Dogs. A lion, cheetah, and a cat are all cats. So he didn’t have to bring all three types of cats. When looking at like this, if I’m remember right there are only about 8,000 different KINDs of animals from some Christian papers I’ve read. 8,000 baby animals could fit in the ark.

---Noah didn’t bring bugs or fish.

---The ark story is not just in the bible it as appears in many other religions.

---Also there is evidence all over the world that a great flood happened.

When looking at this way it seems hard to believe yet possible.


[edit on 2-8-2007 by ebe51]

[edit on 2-8-2007 by ebe51]

Originally posted by ebe51
The ark it's possible…

I believe Noah ark was possible. You have look and understand however what the bible is saying about it. So let’s look at few things…

---Noah was to take the animals that came to him. He didn’t round-up a bunch of animals they came to him.

so the kangaroos swam all the way from australia? the capyberas swam from brazil alongside the anacondas?

---If Noah was smart he also would have baby animals instead of full grown animals

they wouldn't have been able to learn proper behavior for their species without at least their mother or, in some cases, a community.

---The Bible also say take pairs of animals per there KIND so that they may bring forth after the KIND. The word “kind” is the key. Noah didn’t have to bring very type of Dog he only had to have one a pair of Dogs. Any little kid can look at a wolf and mutt and tell you they’re both Dogs. A lion, cheetah, and a cat are all cats. So he didn’t have to bring all three types of cats. When looking at like this, if I’m remember right there are only about 8,000 different KINDs of animals from some Christian papers I’ve read. 8,000 baby animals could fit in the ark.

so how do we have cheetahs AND lions today if he only took one type of cat? for that matter how do we have ANY species diversity with noah only taking two of each "kind"

hell, how the hell do you define "kind"?
dogs and wolves are the same species, but lions and house cats are all in the same FAMILY.

---Noah didn’t bring bugs or fish.

then why didn't the fish go extinct when the salinity levels changed in their habitats?
and why didn't the bugs die out without an environment?

---The ark story is not just in the bible it as appears in many other religions.

but noah and the animals aren't mentioned in the others.

---Also there is evidence all over the world that a great flood happened.

such as? if you're going to say sea shells on mountains, you're wrong. geology shows that it's from a change in the elevation of the land, not from water sweeping it up. a seashell on a mountain proves that the mountain used to be at/below sea level

When looking at this way it seems hard to believe yet possible.

no, it still seems impossible and it shows a clear misunderstanding of biological science

Hey yall. New to the board. Figured this would be as good a topic to break ground as any.

Originally posted by Leveller
As somebody has already stated: go read the Epic of Gilgamesh.
It's an older Babylonian text that contains all of the fundamentals for the Bible story of Noah.

The dove is there, the animals, the mountain, the olive branch, and the rainbow - all and more are present in this older story.
It is probable that part of the Old Testament was compiled whilst it's Hebrew authors were exiled in Babylon. Here they would have been surrounded by Babylonian religion and legend.

Here's the thing about Noah versus Gilgamesh. Whether or not the epic was written before Noah is entirely beside the point from a technological perspective. For all you know, Noah's ark happened as laid out in the Bible, but the story was passed down orally, where the Babylonians were just the first to write it down. Age of the documentation is completely pointless, and applicability can be debated. The ability of the ark to sustain the lives of so many animals can be debated. The possibility of embellishment can be debated. What CANNOT be debated, however, is the technical side of the debate---the seaworthiness of the craft itself.

Consider this. Gilgamesh's "ark" was a cube. Length, width, and height were all the same dimension. And while the cube would quite likely have floated, it would have had ZERO stability! It would have bucked and rolled and tossed this way and that, capsizing with every wave.

Noah's ark, on the other hand, was built with dimensions rivaling the stability of an air craft carrier. In test tanks, the US Navy determined that the craft---while little more than a long, watertight box---would have been EXTREMELY seaworthy, practically impossible to capsize.

One other point of order. Both Gilgamesh and Noah were written before any culture had any sort of advanced seafaring technology beyond river-running boats or, at best, seagoing skiffs---certainly nothing coming close to the dimensions of either craft! As such, it is perfectly reasonable that Gilgamesh's craft would be deemed unseaworthy. What is incredible is that, in such a technologically inferior culture, an ark of Noah's description could indeed be built and survive the rigors of seatravel.

How could such a primative culture have gotten that one right? It would be like the Wright Brothers designing a 747

Doesn't anybody already know how this happened? Noah took every species of animal because God shrunk them down with his powers so they could all fit duhhh... The story of Noah doesn't have to be logical at all really but how many parts of the bible really are after all? I'm telling you it's all magic! That's how it happened!

A few problems I have with the Noah story.

1) Why did god bother at all making Noah build an ark etc, after all only about a 1000-ish years earlier (or 1 god day according to some) god created everything (or he got the Earth to do it). So why didn't he just start again and make better animals etc? Was god still on his rest day?

2) Doesn't anyone seem to realize that the reason there are flood stories globally is that the sea level has risen around 400 feet since the last ice age so yes virtually everywhere has been flooded at some point. Also the fact that most peoples lived by the sea would tend to give rise to a few tales of flooding.

3) While everyone battles on about the number of beasts noah had - I am more interested in why Noah's sons and wives children decided that they would only interbreed with their siblings, and not their cousins etc, so that they could create the different races.

That'll do for now


G

Originally posted by shihulud
A few problems I have with the Noah story.

1) Why did god bother at all making Noah build an ark etc, after all only about a 1000-ish years earlier (or 1 god day according to some) god created everything (or he got the Earth to do it). So why didn't he just start again and make better animals etc? Was god still on his rest day?

His creation wasn't faulty, but what had become of it necessarily... due to free will. If He had restarted from scratch, then the whole purpose of free will---to produce within man the ability to "exceed his programming" and LOVE God---would have been made null and void.

2) Doesn't anyone seem to realize that the reason there are flood stories globally is that the sea level has risen around 400 feet since the last ice age so yes virtually everywhere has been flooded at some point. Also the fact that most peoples lived by the sea would tend to give rise to a few tales of flooding.

That would explain the Ark settling on a plain or something... not on top of a mountain that still exists.

3) While everyone battles on about the number of beasts noah had - I am more interested in why Noah's sons and wives children decided that they would only interbreed with their siblings, and not their cousins etc, so that they could create the different races.

Good question. I'll research it, but I think it might have something to do with sibling rivalry.

Originally posted by nashdude

Originally posted by shihulud
A few problems I have with the Noah story.

1) Why did god bother at all making Noah build an ark etc, after all only about a 1000-ish years earlier (or 1 god day according to some) god created everything (or he got the Earth to do it). So why didn't he just start again and make better animals etc? Was god still on his rest day?

His creation wasn't faulty, but what had become of it necessarily... due to free will. If He had restarted from scratch, then the whole purpose of free will---to produce within man the ability to "exceed his programming" and LOVE God---would have been made null and void.

Makes no sense - who would have known???? And why would the whole purpose of free will be null and void? - Just make more humans with free will.

2) Doesn't anyone seem to realize that the reason there are flood stories globally is that the sea level has risen around 400 feet since the last ice age so yes virtually everywhere has been flooded at some point. Also the fact that most peoples lived by the sea would tend to give rise to a few tales of flooding.

That would explain the Ark settling on a plain or something... not on top of a mountain that still exists.

There's no evidence that Noah's ark rests anywhere. All supposed evidence has been refuted as far as I'm aware or been a lie.

Originally posted by shihulud

Originally posted by nashdude

Originally posted by shihulud
A few problems I have with the Noah story.

1) Why did god bother at all making Noah build an ark etc, after all only about a 1000-ish years earlier (or 1 god day according to some) god created everything (or he got the Earth to do it). So why didn't he just start again and make better animals etc? Was god still on his rest day?

His creation wasn't faulty, but what had become of it necessarily... due to free will. If He had restarted from scratch, then the whole purpose of free will---to produce within man the ability to "exceed his programming" and LOVE God---would have been made null and void.

Makes no sense - who would have known???? And why would the whole purpose of free will be null and void? - Just make more humans with free will.

You're either completely missing the point, or avoiding it intentionally. Free will had nothing to do with anybody "knowing" about it. Free will must exist out of necessity for there to be choice. Whether or not anybody "knew" about it, it had to be in place for us to either choose FOR God or choose AGAINST God. If He had "hit reset", He still would have had to eventually deal with the same situation all over again, because free will demands the choice. In fact, if He had started creation all over from scratch, He would have lost ground with mankind that had been gained in the Flood! I mean, how would mankind have learned anything from the destruction of the world if they had all been destroyed with it?!?

God doesn't want pets---He wants PEOPLE. Without free will, He doesn't get what He wants. So yes---if He circumvented free will, "hit reset", or anything along those lines, He would have voided the entire purpose of creating man.

2) Doesn't anyone seem to realize that the reason there are flood stories globally is that the sea level has risen around 400 feet since the last ice age so yes virtually everywhere has been flooded at some point. Also the fact that most peoples lived by the sea would tend to give rise to a few tales of flooding.

That would explain the Ark settling on a plain or something... not on top of a mountain that still exists.

There's no evidence that Noah's ark rests anywhere. All supposed evidence has been refuted as far as I'm aware or been a lie.


How so? Have we been able to explore Mt Ararat? Have we been able to determine once and for all what that rectangular shape sticking out of the glacier is? Or what it is NOT?

You're right. There is no evidence (of yet) that supports the Bible in this. There is also no evidence that refutes it either. And until we can get on the mountain and do an extensive search, we can go neither way on this scientifically. Assumption is not proof.