Creepy Consumer electronic device released which alters thought patterns with electric shock

originally posted by: WhiteHat
a reply to: Bedlam

What are Monroe discs? Did a search on google and nothing came up.

check The Monroe Institute's CD catalog, or google for hemi-sync.

a reply to: jedi_hamster

oh, I see now.
thank you.

edit: I tried their demo once and since it did nothing except a mild headache I always presumed they are hoax.
(sorry if I derailed the thread)

originally posted by: WhiteHat
a reply to: jedi_hamster

oh, I see now.
thank you.

edit: I tried their demo once and since it did nothing except a mild headache I always believed they are hoax.
(sorry if I derailed the thread)

you have to be calm, eyes preferably closed, and listening using headphones, with absolutely no 3D effects/5.1 spatialization active in soundcard panel (in-ears are probably preferable, but over-the-ear/on-ear headphones will do just fine).

also, listen to the whole recording without skipping or anything like it.

it works, just like any other binaural sounds do - but compared to most other solutions, hemi-sync discs are like a brand new rolls royce compared to some ford from a junkyard.

Thank you OP for posting this.
Just purchased 1 for the fun of it, had to get it sent to the Minnesota boarder, due to only shipping in the US.
Will post a thorough review once I receive it!

a reply to: WhiteHat

Yeah hemi-sync is indeed a real thing.

It is a binaural induction system; the theory is that our brains have trouble registering pitches on the low end of the spectrum- the ones from 3-40 hz range that correspond to brain state rates- so what they do is play 2 pitches in either ear, one such as 140 hz, and another such as 120 hz, and our brains can hear the "wobble" between the two, and registers a new pitch of 20 hz as the dominant sound. There is strong experimental evidence to show that an individual can use this system to induce alpha, theta, and delta brain states, although those claims are not fully mainstream yet.

a reply to: Bedlam

I hope you don't mind if I ask you some questions, as I've read a lot of your posts on ATS and feel very confidant in your opinion on this sort of thing...

Could this be helpful to someone suffering treatment resistant clinical depression (or at least it's side effects of chronic fatigue, anxiety, irritability etc.)

Do you think there's any possibility of people getting addicted to wearing the device?

Could a person end up wanting to wear it all the time?


Would you be willing to do a thread on ATS to share your experiences with the device after you've used it a while?

(Or if not a thread, would you PM me about your experience?)

Thank you

I'll wait until you can get $20 throwaways from your local convenient store next to eciggs.

Maybe a few more years.

a reply to: BrianFlanders

That Jerry Springer line was great!

a reply to: Bedlam

They say they have many other "vibes" besides calm and energy but they're not ready for deployment yet.

Thats scary… murderous rage?

…the puck uses your iPhone to log the number of uses for each vibe type, it "phones home" to get an ok to run, more than likely.

Two way? Thats even scarier.

"The woods are lovely, dark and deep and I have many miles to go before I sleep. Many miles, before I sleep."

"The rain in Spain falls mainly on the Plain."

ETA: Thanks for the rundown, always interesting.

originally posted by: joeraynor
a reply to: WhiteHat

Yeah hemi-sync is indeed a real thing.

It is a binaural induction system; the theory is that our brains have trouble registering pitches on the low end of the spectrum- the ones from 3-40 hz range that correspond to brain state rates- so what they do is play 2 pitches in either ear, one such as 140 hz, and another such as 120 hz, and our brains can hear the "wobble" between the two, and registers a new pitch of 20 hz as the dominant sound. There is strong experimental evidence to show that an individual can use this system to induce alpha, theta, and delta brain states, although those claims are not fully mainstream yet.

well, it's slightly different as i understand it. it's not our brain that has trouble registering such low frequencies, it's just that those frequencies are too low for our hearing to be registered.

but the most important thing is, it's not about direct difference between frequencies in each ear - it's about, as i like to call it, frequency distortion. when you have 1khz tone playing in both ears, but it's slightly distorted for each ear so that the interaural time difference forms a wave with a frequency of 5hz for example, then your brain will sync to that frequency.

simply speaking, the sound in both channels is being delayed a little bit, following a frequency you want your brain to sync to - imagine a graph of a sinusoid with that 5hz frequency, the middle is 'no distortion', the top is 'left channel delayed', the bottom is 'right channel delayed' - that's how it works.

the amount of delay doesn't influence the frequency (the one our brain is supposed to sync to - 5hz in our example) - it affects the audible distortion of the sound though. it may be so small it's hard to notice, the amount of distortion needed for the brain to 'register' such binaural beat varies with the frequency at hand.

some old sound editing software (cool edit 2000) had a function that could change any recording (including any song stored in .mp3 format) into binaural beat sound. it's currently sold as adobe audition, no idea if it still has that function or if it was removed.

en.wikipedia.org...

Seriously, that's it! So many would need a device to make them feel good! Especially with the idea of sending signals to your brain.

Come on, why need an aid when, one can just smile and be happy! This is sad! It be really funny to see people wearing devices on their foreheads...kind of reminds me of the biblical end times "Mark of the Beast"...

Peace

The perfect fertilizer for the future Manchurian candidates......

But on a serious note, you can buy yourself a low voltage transformer, copper wire, and some electrical tape for under $30.

originally posted by: lostgirl

Could this be helpful to someone suffering treatment resistant clinical depression (or at least it's side effects of chronic fatigue, anxiety, irritability etc.)

I've read a number of blogs from people who got the alpha and beta testers, and for about 20%, there were no detectable effects at all. About 20% reported very intense effects, and the middle reported that it was very noticeable. In a lot of cases, other observers reported the person seemed more affected than the person reported.

The "energy" vibe seems to produce a sort of mild manic state if turned up and run for full duration. So maybe it would be effective against depression.

I'm interested in the thing technically - what waveforms and how much current are they using - but once I've fiddled with it I plan to give it a run to see how effective it is with combating shift work fatigue. Working nights all the time is turning me into a fat tired cave dweller.

Do you think there's any possibility of people getting addicted to wearing the device?

I never did with TDCS, although if this thing works as some of the beta testers described, it will be very cool, and you might end up less addicted than dependent, if that makes sense. If you study like a banshee with it, you might find it hard to go back to slogging with flash cards.

Would you be willing to do a thread on ATS to share your experiences with the device after you've used it a while?

Sure. We ordered these back at the first of June when the first production run was being built, I had hoped to have them before now. Hopefully it's not an elaborate Banksy Dismaland scam.

originally posted by: intrptr
Two way? Thats even scarier.

Yeah, I don't have mine yet, but when I log into my account, it not only knows how many strips I've purchased, but how many times and for how long I've used each type of vibe. And when. At the moment, of course, that's empty. But it seemed a bit off-putting that they were keeping such detailed track of it.

Of course, that leads you to the speculation that:

1) they seem to have an unnecessarily detailed interest in that
2) they're able to see if you're cheating on buying strips
3) they can cut it off if you don't buy enough of them
4) they can build up quite a bit of metadata on what sort of vibe you use, when you do, how long you do, and where you were at the time
5) maybe you could receive some new 'vibe' by network that you weren't expecting, if they had a mind to do so

Of course, I think the immediate thing to do would be to figure out their puck protocol, write new control software and adios muchacho to the Thync corporation. Which is sort of what I'm interested in at a personal level, once we're done with it.

a reply to: joeraynor

Perfect. I didn't even have to see the picture, it didn't code up.
BUT...
As a shirt-tail descendant of the inventor of the lobotomy
and an avid reader, I approve of this device. It should be
modified and used as a pain amplifier for misbehaving public
servants. Often. Twice. Headbands for Haughty Hippies.
Give the citizenry all the red buttons, and no others.

The answer to 1984 is 220 single phase. "Burn 'im Danno."

a reply to: Bedlam

but when I log into my account, it not only knows how many strips I've purchased, but how many times and for how long I've used each type of vibe. And when.

Meta data monitoring of 'mood juice'. Hmmm, like smart meters relaying information to a central computer on home electricity consumption, how much and when. Benign, generally I guess, until its abused.

4) they can build up quite a bit of metadata on what sort of vibe you use, when you do, how long you do, and where you were at the time

I was thinking about this last night. First off, it isn't mind control per se, they don't control your thoughts with this type of technology, just 'inject' mood altering waves akin to the stimulus provided by the bodies natural endocrine system (Adrenalin and Dopamine, for instance). Refinements would continue of course, making electronic packaging ever smaller, placing them (like RFID chips) in clothing like shoes, belts, hats and sunglasses. Include GPS and active monitoring, and a mass mind of behavior and mood altering stimulus becomes possible , making people sleep more comfortably, work more diligently, play more happily.

In an emergency, the alarm bells could sound, warning 'central control' and generating an instant computer response. Say another 911 occurs, hit the calm switch.

Gives a whole new meaning to Nielsen Ratings too, monitoring ad campaigns during television events like the Superbowl or inducing happy vibes during News broadcasts that seek to provide good feelings associated with certain programming. Think "Happy Meal". People could be programmed to remain subdued or even sleep during long airline flights.

The super computers that monitor trading on the stock market closely regulate the ebb and flow, preventing runs and crashes, they would be capable of monitoring and programming millions of minds to behave 'properly', too.

5) maybe you could receive some new 'vibe' by network that you weren't expecting, if they had a mind to do so.

If they have the capability they have programmed it on purpose. My cable box is two way, I awoke one night after leaving my set on and the message displayed on my screen informed me to please be patient, "we are downloading a software update to your cable box".

Ever see Halloween Three, Season of the Witch? The kids all wore masks with chips in them and tuned in on Halloween Eve to a TV commercial that ate their brains.

Hurry up with Halloween, Halloween… gather round kids and watch…waaatch…

Anyone here ever read the science fiction 'Ringworld' trilogy, by Larry Niven?

This is the first step in creating a 'tasp'

Reply to Bedlam -
Thank you for answering the questions in my previous post!

originally posted by: Bedlam
Of course, I think the immediate thing to do would be to figure out their puck protocol, write new control software and adios muchacho to the Thync corporation. Which is sort of what I'm interested in at a personal level, once we're done with it.

As far as the above, just out of curiosity -
- would you be limited to doing that with only your own personal devices, or could you patent your "new control software" and offer it for sale to the public? (I can imagine a lot of people being interested in utilizing the device without the company being able to track usage).

Do you know if there are companies gearing up with 'competing' devices?

Anyone read the Ringworld books? Recommended if not. But from the book..

In Larry Niven's Known Space stories, a wirehead is someone who has been fitted with an electronic brain implant (called a "droud" in the stories) to stimulate the pleasure centres of their brain. In the Known Space universe, wireheading is the most addictive habit known (Louis Wu is the only given example of a recovered addict), and wireheads usually die from neglecting themselves in favour of the ceaseless pleasure. Wireheading is so powerful and easy that it becomes an evolutionary pressure, selecting against that portion of Known Space humanity without self-control.

I can see it going there.