Unbelievable! Ukraine Shows USA What Democracy Is

I thought I'd never see the day when any country in the Old Soviet Union's orbit would show the USA true Democracy in action. Their presidential vote was stolen and they rose up to demand the government get it straight. Incredible.. Are we in this country so fat 'n happy, drugged out, spoiled rotten and lazy, that we just roll over and allow this (or any administration) to just steal and walk away with the most important election in our nation?

One thing is for certain.. if we are not willing to stand up to the corrupt establishment and demand truth and accountability in governance, we the people will get what we deserve.

You gotta love it. In Ukraine, they have been relying heavily on EXIT POLL DATA. Our media has been reporting that.. as if the practice is thoroughly reliable.. Hmmm... Why then, here in the good ol USA was it not reliable on the early evening of Nov. 2? Gee, I wonder if that's because most of the exit polls had Kerry clearly in the lead? Even Zogby called it for Kerry around 5 p.m.

I keep reading that the US exit polls were fine.....

.....everywhere except where the electronic voting took place.

(and it even appears the cheat wasn't done with enough care with those, afterall if Bush and Co. got their people out and polled so well in the Presidential vote how come a 'republican line' wasn't followed through on the various other concurrent votes as one would reasonably expect?)

Bush and Co stole 2000 & 2004 IMHO.
I cannot see any other reasonable conclusion.

Sorry but that being the case the USA is just not a democracy anymore.....and sadly that seems to suit many Americans just fine.

Commiserations to the rest of America and God help the rest of us.

[edit on 28-12-2004 by sminkeypinkey]

I'm withya SP. Unfortunately, if the boob toob tells us something, at least half the braindead folks here take it as the gospel truth. The idea that they would actually lie is beyond their feeble mentalities.

The Democracy I grew up believing in and fought for, is in fact, dead as a door nail.

Incredible.. Are we in this country so fat 'n happy, drugged out, spoiled rotten and lazy, that we just roll over and allow this (or any administration) to just steal and walk away with the most important election in our nation?

You know we on the right, prefer you to believe this silly theory of yours. The way we see it; as long as the left focus on this "theory" you will never figure out what you really need to do to win another election.

So...Yeah Bush and CO. stole the election. Electronic voting is a tool of the bourgeoisie capitalist pig-dogs!!!!

Originally posted by EastCoastKid
I thought I'd never see the day when any country in the Old Soviet Union's orbit would show the USA true Democracy in action. Their presidential vote was stolen and they rose up to demand the government get it straight. Incredible.. Are we in this country so fat 'n happy, drugged out, spoiled rotten and lazy, that we just roll over and allow this (or any administration) to just steal and walk away with the most important election in our nation?

One thing is for certain.. if we are not willing to stand up to the corrupt establishment and demand truth and accountability in governance, we the people will get what we deserve.

The Ukraine and other former USSR countries have democracy ONLY because of America.

You describe the liberal left very well in your post----and that is why America is not at peak performance----lazy, fat, spoiled lefties hold it down.

You lefties are mad because you can�t steal the election in America, and turn this great country into a leftist hellhole.

Sleeper i find your, comment and retreat tactics to be rather anoying and frankly cowardly.
If you have nethier the firepower or the strength to support your views then leave!

Originally posted by Imperium Americana

You know we on the right, prefer you to believe this silly theory of yours. The way we see it; as long as the left focus on this "theory" you will never figure out what you really need to do to win another election.

Your condescension is amusing. And for the record, since you're new, I'm a Republican.

Sorry if i'm hijacking this thread but it's too juicy to let go regarding the Ohio votergate scandle.





Looks like Triad had remote access to everything with the ability to change anything! Something stinks and it wasnt the burrito i just ate while watching my boob tube!

Im ready to bend over America and accept CNN's explination!


[edit on 28-12-2004 by syntaxer]

Originally posted by EastCoastKid

Originally posted by Imperium Americana

You know we on the right, prefer you to believe this silly theory of yours. The way we see it; as long as the left focus on this "theory" you will never figure out what you really need to do to win another election.

Your condescension is amusing. And for the record, since you're new, I'm a Republican.

I am glad my condescension brought you a bit of holiday cheer.

As a fellow member of the right, I offer my apologies for slandering and defaming you with the term "left".
Do you really think the election here was stolen or is this a bit of tongue in cheek?

Thanks for sharin those docs, Syntaxer. I'm glad someone has the cojones to probe this matter.

Imperium Americana,
No worries. I sincerely do believe there was foul play in this election. People from all over the political spectrum should be alarmed over any voting corruption or possibility of. If one administration can manipulate the vote towards their end, so too can another. This is the democratic process we are trying to protect. That is far more important than any party.

Originally posted by EastCoastKid
Thanks for sharin those docs, Syntaxer. I'm glad someone has the cojones to probe this matter.

Imperium Americana,
No worries.

I sincerely do believe there was foul play in this election. People from all over the political spectrum should be alarmed over any voting corruption or possibility of. If one administration can manipulate the vote towards their end, so too can. another. This is the democratic process we are trying to protect. That is far more important than any party.

You make a good statement there E.C.K

When the Ukraine election scandle broke out i began to believe in thoughts of "If one administration can manipulate the vote towards their end, so too can. another" theory.

Hopefully the better man won.. who knows, perhaps Yushchenko is the true corrupted politican with a spy for a wife, ready to exploit Ukraine's best interests in order to benefit the enemy?

Originally posted by syntaxer
You make a good statement there E.C.K

Thanks.

Hopefully the better man won.. who knows, perhaps Yushchenko is the true corrupted politican with a spy for a wife, ready to exploit Ukraine's best interests in order to benefit the enemy?

Who knows. It was just nice to see the people rise up and give the corrupt officials the BIG finger. I wish our people had that kind of fire in them.

Originally posted by EastCoastKid


Who knows. It was just nice to see the people rise up and give the corrupt officials the BIG finger. I wish our people had that kind of fire in them.

I think our government has stamped out, or attempted to, any fire that remained in the people. They did this with false terrorist warnings, and the constant barrage of the idea of haveing to have an enemy at all times. Not to mention the repeal of our since of security.

In the Ukrain, they are not deluged with these false terrorist warnings and restrictive governments. Not like ours anyway. They still have people who believe in thier government. I think that is the deciding factor here.

The funniest quote to come out of this was from Colin Powell.

"We cannot accept the results of this election."

Or something along those lines...

Originally posted by OXmanK
The funniest quote to come out of this was from Colin Powell.

"We cannot accept the results of this election."

Yes. Talk about the height of hypocrisy.

: KIDFINGER:
I think our government has stamped out, or attempted to, any fire that remained in the people.

At the risk of pissing off my friends on the left, it was actually Bill Clinton who went far into intimidating citizens and demonizing (militia) groups through the '90's. We saw at WACO and Ruby Ridge the extent to which our government will go to to crush those individuals and groups they deem to be terrorists or subversive. Subversive... if they like you.. you're labled subversive or terrorist. It's as simple as that. Try stopping the jackboots with your little personal firearm. It's impossible.

[edit on 19-09-2003 by EastCoastKid]

Before Bush won the last two elections, we had Bill Clinton for two terms. That enough, puts Republicans in power for years to come. It's known as cause and effect.

For your conspiracys to be true, you have to believe that Republicans are alot more smarter than democrats. George Bush is the Republican leader, so he must be the smartest man in America.

Also why would democrats just sit back and let elections be "stolen"?

But please keep up the whining, after all thats what democrats do best!

One last thing, without the USA their would be no democratic Ukraine today.

Originally posted by EastCoastKid

At the risk of pissing off my friends on the left, it was actually Bill Clinton who went far into intimidating citizens and demonizing (militia) groups through the '90's. We saw at WACO and Ruby Ridge the extent to which our government will go to to crush those individuals and groups they deem to be terrorists or subversive. Subversive... if they like you.. you're labled subversive or terrorist. It's as simple as that. Try stopping the jackboots with your little personal firearm. It's impossible.

[edit on 19-09-2003 by EastCoastKid]

You wont piss me off. I think Clinton was one of the greatest presidents of our time. However, he did engage in the activities you are talking about, so I will not say its not true. Truth is truth. I guess Im a terrorist, because I sure as hell am not subversive.

Lets see if the neocons can admit the same about thier beloved dicta...I mean, president.

Carseller4,

For your conspiracys to be true, you have to believe that Republicans are alot more smarter than democrats. George Bush is the Republican leader, so he must be the smartest man in America.

Umm...No. Bush is a schmuck. His handlers are the intelligent ones. The puppet is wood, its the people pulling th puppets strings that you must be wary of.

Also why would democrats just sit back and let elections be "stolen"?

Why did you sit back and let Clinton get elected for 2 terms? Its the same answer as the answer to your question above.

But please keep up the whining, after all thats what democrats do best!

I will never understand for the life of me why you neocons feel you must berate people who hold a different opinion than you. Typical conservative defensive dribble. Please post something with some intelligence next time.

Kidfinger
I will never understand for the life of me why you neocons feel you must berate people who hold a different opinion than you. Typical conservative defensive dribble. Please post something with some intelligence next time.

It's because they have no intellectual arguments to offer. Unlike true conservatives and true liberals, NeoCons have only one core belief: world domination.

There is a difference between true conservatives and Neo Conservatives. NeoCons are angry Straussian liberals who got run outta their party for being psychos. They somehow got a foothold into the GOP through crazy, right-wing fundamentalists.

Neo Cons aren't even conservative. Folks like Carseller don't seem to have the ability to understand that. They're either racist or too young or dumb to remember what real Republicans stand for (strong national DEFENSE, Fiscal sanity, law & order, etc. etc.). That's why they so blindely follow these idiots. No real Republican (with the slightest bit of knowledge of history and foreign policy could or would support these jackazzes).

I'd answer Carseller.. yawn.. but I think you pretty much summed it up.

[edit on 19-09-2003 by EastCoastKid]

[edit on 19-09-2003 by EastCoastKid]

Originally posted by EastCoastKid

I'd answer Carseller.. yawn.. but I think you pretty much summed it up.

But you did answe... I mean I did answ... I mean we.. oh hell, you know what Im getting at

Just couldnt resist