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New Viking Sword Discovered in Southern Norway

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posted on Jul, 15 2015 @ 08:11 AM
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Sigh... It might just be my age, but I'm having a terrible time locating the cross on this sword. I scanned the link quickly, perhaps I missed it? If someone would please be so kind to point out any christian symbology, they would surely garner my appreciation.

The Vikings were fascinating!

ETA: I'm fairly certain that is a wheatsheaf in the center of the pommel.


edit on 7 15 2015 by JohnTheSmith because: ETA


ETA II: Hmmm perhaps it's not a wheatsheaf, as there are two spirals on either end of the guard, as well. I could stare at this sword all day

edit on 7 15 2015 by JohnTheSmith because: ETA II




posted on Jul, 15 2015 @ 08:47 AM
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a reply to: JohnTheSmith

There are images of spirals, latin letters, Christian symbols and a hand holding a cross.




posted on Jul, 15 2015 @ 09:21 AM
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a reply to: theabsolutetruth
a reply to: Kapusta


originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
a reply to: JohnTheSmith

There are images of spirals, latin letters, Christian symbols and a hand holding a cross.



I guess that's open to interpretation, considering there is a character to the right of the hand, corresponding to the middle letters on the guard. I've taken the liberty to point out the corresponding symbols.



There is no hand holding a cross. (IMHO)

ETA: IMHO it's a hand, with two sybols on either side of it. If it's holding a cross, then it's dropping a z.
edit on 7 15 2015 by JohnTheSmith because: ETA clarification.

edit on 7 15 2015 by JohnTheSmith because: ETA reply tag
edit on 7 15 2015 by JohnTheSmith because: (no reason given)
extra DIV



posted on Jul, 15 2015 @ 11:32 AM
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a reply to: JohnTheSmith

I think it shows a hand and a cross and so do the archaeologists researching it.



Dr Wenn said: 'At the top of the pommel, we can also clearly see a picture of a hand holding a cross.

'That's unique and we don't know of any similar findings on other swords from the Viking Age.

'Both the hand and the letters indicate that the sword was deliberately decorated with Christian symbolism.'



posted on Jul, 15 2015 @ 01:06 PM
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Amazing discovery from such a long time ago. The pommel is is pretty good nick as well. The markings are also done with great precision.

I always wonder when they say they dug up a grave or found a sword in a grave or burial. It's still a grave after all.
Fantastic find.



posted on Jul, 15 2015 @ 07:15 PM
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As far as the "Christian Connection":
1)This could be the grave of a viking who was converted to Christianity, and his family gave him the only burial they knew.
2)This could be the sword of a viking who killed Christians.
3)This could be a viking who just really dug on Christian symbols.
4)This could be just a regular viking, whose sword was made in England by a Christian blacksmith.
5) More abstractly, this could be the grave of a Christian captured by vikings, assimilated into their culture, and earned their respect in battle alongside them (movie script material?).

That's all I can come up with at the moment.



posted on Jul, 16 2015 @ 03:36 PM
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Fascinating. How I would love to be able to time travel around and experience all the ages of the world. Except for the black plague...



originally posted by: ProfessorChaos
As far as the "Christian Connection":
1)This could be the grave of a viking who was converted to Christianity, and his family gave him the only burial they knew.
2)This could be the sword of a viking who killed Christians.
3)This could be a viking who just really dug on Christian symbols.
4)This could be just a regular viking, whose sword was made in England by a Christian blacksmith.
5) More abstractly, this could be the grave of a Christian captured by vikings, assimilated into their culture, and earned their respect in battle alongside them (movie script material?).

That's all I can come up with at the moment.
You mean like Vikings the tv show?
edit on 16-7-2015 by Voldster because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 16 2015 @ 06:46 PM
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a reply to: Voldster

I've never seen the Vikings tv show, though if it's historical in nature, and not overly fictional, I'd probably enjoy it; I was just sort of floating ideas on the story behind this viking and his interesting sword.



posted on Jul, 16 2015 @ 07:04 PM
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a reply to: ProfessorChaos

Some pagans used the cross as a symbol too- it's the 4 directions coming together.



posted on Jul, 16 2015 @ 07:28 PM
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a reply to: Phage
Viking burials of prominent people, leaders and kings are huge mounds. Often stone. No cross on the burial sites and no holy ground. They were burried with weapons to take to the other side, Valhall.
The modern names of canut and sweyn are Knut and Svein btw.
Also there were gingers as well as blonds, a few of them actually got "red" in their name because of their haircolour.
Norrøn Mythology is pretty cool. They were most likely some of the first to visit the west (USA) by sea and return, and their whole upbringing had elements of becoming great warriors. The end goal of reaching Vallhall was achieved by dying in battle and joining their deceased warrior kind in the gerat halls of Vallhall.

Drinking (mjød - beer with unstopped geast), fighting, hunting, building, some farming, and pillaging - seem to have been important cornerstones of society.

As to the sword, the Cross might give us an indication of the period it's from.
Might very well be from a time of English holy crusade as well, but looks like it might be a viking type of sword though, so the cross took me a bit by surprise. I'm guessing gift, either for services rendered or the timeframe after Christianity replaced Norrønsk Mythology.

My two cents..

edit on 16-7-2015 by br0ker because: spelling



posted on Jul, 16 2015 @ 07:32 PM
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originally posted by: hadriana
a reply to: ProfessorChaos

Some pagans used the cross as a symbol too- it's the 4 directions coming together.


Granted, but I'm working off of the assumptions of those that have studied the sword.



posted on Jul, 16 2015 @ 07:51 PM
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a reply to: Phage

Our first church (Urnes) is said to have been built around 1130. So no cemeteries before that.
whc.unesco.org...
Most likely by the second wave of missionaries.

Don't know what year we phased from believing in our own gods to christianity. Might have been gradually from as early as 800-1200. Now we Norwegians are mainly still christians. We have stopped believing that Thor with the hammer is making the thunder and lightning. Avengers Thor is based upon Norrøn Mythology.

I'm up to 4 cents now...
edit on 16-7-2015 by br0ker because: link

edit on 16-7-2015 by br0ker because: spelling



posted on Jul, 17 2015 @ 05:58 PM
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a reply to: ProfessorChaos

It could also be a sword of a wealthy Norse. It doesnt need to be a sword used by a Norse that was going viking. I think that because only such a few number of the Norse people was viking, it is actually a greater chanse it belonged to a Norse NOT going viking.

It could also beva gift from a Christian to a Norse, since they got along pretty well. The Norse even had a church built in the largest city of Sweden, Birka, as a token of good will for the christian traders living in that city during the 800s.

Hasnt there been more findings of christian symbols in Norse graves during the time christianity gained momentum? My memory recalls from school we learned that some graves had the regular symbols, like Mjölner, but some also had the christian cross, like they though: "just in case.."

Isnt there also some theories that the Wolf Cross is some sort of hybrid-symbol?

People seem to think the norse got christians over night but you need to remember it was a process taking place for hundreds of years.



posted on Jul, 17 2015 @ 09:41 PM
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originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
There are images of spirals, latin letters, Christian symbols and a hand holding a cross.


Hmm ok I can see it now too...one possible explanation would be a sort of pagan approach to Christianity. It's not the only possible explanation, but it'd go something like this:

An individual Viking of significant wealth and status approached Christianity in their own way. It'd be something like they had come to a respect for the power of the Christian God somehow in the progression of their life, and so started worshiping the most powerful God they knew of. It'd be "paganism" with a Christian flavor, symbols, etc.

There's this general phenomenon in religion where the religion spreads to new believers, but the new believers do it in their own way rather than 'by the book.'

There are some easy to see examples where Christianity combines with East Asia for 'unusual' results. For a historical example, you have the Tai Ping Rebellion in China, where "God's Chinese Son" leads a revolution from, iirc, ~1850ish to ~1865ish. It was basically one charismatic man's mash-up of western Christianity and traditional Chinese culture into a movement that resulted in a devastating civil war.

For contemporary examples, you can see "weird versions" or unusual practices of Christianity in Africa and Asia. Is it really "weird" or what then? It's the cultural contrast that makes it stand out as being so obviously "weird" and "not really Christian" to a westerner. Religion is inevitably "weird" wherever you find it when you get down to the detailed level of practices etc.

So of course the same thing happened in the west, and plenty of "paganism" got incorporated into Christian practices as it spread, even in the west. Assuming for the moment this guy was a pagan Christian, he'd be an example of why it happened and why it happens with the spread of religion in general.

You can just imagine a junior priest asking a monsignor about it and getting an answer something like "Olaf the Christian may not really be a christian as far as you and I are concerned, but at least he's on our side, instead of raiding us, and he's really serious about God, so things will hopefully work out in the long run. God works in mysterious ways. I mean really, do you really want to be the one to tell him he's doing it all wrong? Maybe he'll be drinking your blood next Sunday instead of some conquered warrior's."

And no, I'm not saying this guy drank blood or whatever or whether that happened at all. I mean who knows. It's just meant to be an example of something shocking and ghastly and "not really Christian" yet it seems recognizably connected to Christian practices and it gets tolerated. A modern example, and a real one, is how in the Philippines they actually do really crucify people at Easter. They're all volunteers and they usually don't let it go on for so long that they die, but the nails are real etc.



posted on Jul, 18 2015 @ 06:55 AM
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a reply to: 11andrew34

There are historical references that are sourced by historians and archaeologists that are used in painting a picture of ancient realities.

The facts are that Christianity absorbed other pagan traditions as a means of assimilation, hence Christianity is steeped in paganism, for example Christmas, Easter.

The transition for many would have been natural and gradual.

www.vikingeskibsmuseet.dk...


The first monks came to Denmark in the 8th and 9th centuries. Ansgar is the most well known of these. At first the missionaries had no great success, but they did contribute to spreading knowledge of Christianity. As a consequence, it was easier for later missionaries to convince the Vikings that the Christian God, The White Christ, was the strongest.

Many Vikings encountered Christianity abroad. They saw that the Christian countries were large and strong and had many riches in their stone churches.

It was often a requirement at foreign trading places that merchants was Christian. Otherwise they couldn't trade there. Consequently, some Viking merchants let themselves be baptised. Christianity was permitted at the Danish trading places, as perhaps was the building of churches which made it was easier to attract Christian merchants to Denmark from abroad.

Whether the Vikings became Christians at once, just because they had been baptised abroad, seems doubtful. Many were probably persuaded because fine white cloth was given as a gift at the baptism.

There is a story concerning a Viking representative to the Frankish court who let himself be baptised. Many people were to be baptised that day and when it came to his turn there was no more white cloth. He was, therefore, given something much poorer and coarser. He protested vociferously – he had now been baptised 20 times, and each time he had been given a fine set of white clothes!
Who were these misers who baptised him now?

The Christian Harald Bluetooth

The first Danish king to convert to Christianity was Harold Bluetooth. The monk Widukind writes in his Saxon Chronicle that Harold was baptised around AD 965. In order to convert him, it was necessary for a monk called Poppo to endure an ordeal by fire. That is, Poppo had to carry a piece of red-hot iron in his hands. If he was then able to show that he had not suffered burns, this was an indication that the Christian God was the strongest.

By the end of the Viking Age, around AD 1050, most Danes had become Christians. Stone churches was constructed and there were bishops and priests in many towns. Many of the priests came from England as did many of the builders brought to Denmark to build the churches. Some of the important church towns at that time were Ribe, Odense, Roskilde and Lund.Even though Denmark was then a Christian country, many people also continued to worship the Nordic gods.



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