UFOs Confront Soldiers During War, Says Ex-Air Force Intelligence Officer

originally posted by: AdmireTheDistance

originally posted by: Scdfa

If there was genuine photographic evidence of a flying saucer that had traveled light years though the universe, then rocked up to Vietnam purely to destroy some patrol boat, I would be very impressed to say the least.

a reply to: Subaeruginosa

Who said they travel light years through the universe? Do you think they are no more advanced than we are? That would be a foolish assumption.

And what makes you think they arrived moments before this action and left immediately afterwards? No evidence to indicate that.

No evidence to indicate they were ever here to begin with, either...

As for your light years comment, you do realize light years are a measure of distance, not time, right?

I believe Scdfa was trying to say that if spacecraft from light years away did come to Earth they would not actually travel via conventional means used by us.

This is a bit off topic, but there is a theory that if we are able to warp space we could actually achieve interstellar travel. The spacecraft would not actually physically travel light years because it would be bending the fabric of space in order to get to its destination.

A science adjunct instructor reportedly proved that he is able to bend space with only 100 watts of power..

www.paresspacewarpresearch.org...

a reply to: AdmireTheDistance

As for your light years comment, you do realize light years are a measure of distance, not time, right?

Why, yes, li'l fella, I do realize that.

And it was subaeruginosa's comment, I responded to it.

originally posted by: Aquariusdude

originally posted by: AdmireTheDistance

originally posted by: Scdfa

If there was genuine photographic evidence of a flying saucer that had traveled light years though the universe, then rocked up to Vietnam purely to destroy some patrol boat, I would be very impressed to say the least.

a reply to: Subaeruginosa

Who said they travel light years through the universe? Do you think they are no more advanced than we are? That would be a foolish assumption.

And what makes you think they arrived moments before this action and left immediately afterwards? No evidence to indicate that.

No evidence to indicate they were ever here to begin with, either...

As for your light years comment, you do realize light years are a measure of distance, not time, right?

I believe Scdfa was trying to say that if spacecraft from light years away did come to Earth they would not actually travel via conventional means used by us.

This is a bit off topic, but there is a theory that if we are able to warp space we could actually achieve interstellar travel. The spacecraft would not actually physically travel light years because it would be bending the fabric of space in order to get to its destination.

A science adjunct instructor reportedly proved that he is able to bend space with only 100 watts of power..

www.paresspacewarpresearch.org...

Exactly correct, thank you. Good point you raise.

originally posted by: TrueMessiah

originally posted by: JadeStar
Didn't a lot of VIetnam vets do psychedelic and other mind altering drugs? Didn't a lot of them end up in mental institutions?

I was wondering how long it would be before I saw that rebuttal.

Now I don't want to accuse anyone of disinformation but I see a couple of posts that fit certain criteria of disinformation tactics. Everyone should be made aware of what they are portraying whether they know it or not. There are 25 Main Ways To Suppress Truth. Be careful, don't let yourself and your responses serve as a reflection of this deception. The above is a variant of #20, False Evidence.

20. FALSE EVIDENCE Whenever possible, introduce new facts or clues designed and manufactured to conflict with opponent presentations as useful tools to neutralize sensitive issues or impede resolution

.

Jade what you are doing here is a variation of the above. It can be categorized as "impeding resolution". In this case, a random solution gets thrown out with no real basis in validity, specifically speaking. While vets have been known to indulge during this period, you are assuming the specific witnesses in question (Air Force Intelligence Personnel) where under the influence of mind altering drugs during the time of the sightings. There is no evidence of intoxication among these officers available so it falls under "False Evidence".

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
It's on the same tv series. Clearly there scraping the bottom of the barrel now, not that it was ever really a very credible or interesting show.

Personally, I don't know why people even pay any attention to these witness reports of UFO's anymore. People lie, sometimes very convincingly. Show me photo evidence or I'm not interested.

This type of refute is very common and also very flimsy. It falls under #19.

19. Ignore proof presented, demand impossible proofs. This is perhaps a variant of the "play dumb" rule. Regardless of what material may be presented by an opponent in public forums, claim the material irrelevant and demand proof that is impossible for the opponent to come by (it may exist, but not be at his disposal, or it may be something which is known to be safely destroyed or withheld, such as a murder weapon). In order to completely avoid discussing issues may require you to categorically deny and be critical of media or books as valid sources, deny that witnesses are acceptable, or even deny that statements made by government or other authorities have any meaning or relevance.

The witness' observations are being intentionally ignored. A generalization is being made that these witnesses lied due to a general consensus of lying being common amongst people overall. If that's the case, then why do we believe anything at all. Moreover, you are asking for photo evidence. That falls under "demanding impossible proofs". How is photo evidence going to be of any value in determining the superior velocity that these crafts are said to be operating? Asking him to produce evidence of that nature is a hard task. We know for a fact that suspicious videos and photos are prone to quick confiscation and not meant for public domain. The very same thing happened at Vandenburg Airforce Base back in the 60's. An inability to produce evidence of this capacity, due to the above restrictions, in no way helps a argument centered on outright denying multiple cases of detailed eyewitness accounts and statements.

I encourage everyone to click the link. You may be unintentionally suppressing truth and not even know it.



What a brilliant and insightful post, thank you for this. I, too, am reluctant to label anyone's posts as disinformation, but there are a few posters here who engage in that sort of activity on a very steady basis. At any rate, your response to jadestar was highly appropriate.

originally posted by: Scdfa
What a brilliant and insightful post, thank you for this. I, too, am reluctant to label anyone's posts as disinformation, but there are a few posters here who engage in that sort of activity on a very steady basis. At any rate, your response to jadestar was highly appropriate.

You know I always do what I can to help out.
Members need to be aware of how their counter arguments can be seen as counterintuitive with a penchant for being disinformation, even if unintentional.

a reply to: Aquariusdude

Thank you. After reading the details of the incident it sounds suspiciously like these "enemy helicopters" might actually have been enemy helicopters. They may well have been crewed by Russians, so recovering any wreckage would be a priority to keep their involvement secret.

The bottom line is that this man's story cannot really be corroborated.

People can make things up, either by consciously lying or through subconscious fabrications. Stories of aliens are not immune to be made up, just like any other made up story -- even if people really really want eyewitness accounts of alien visitation to be real.

People from all walks of life can fabricate stories, either consciously or subconsciously. The fact that this story came from an ex-army intelligence officer does not in itself make it immune to being fabricated.

So for now this simply remains one of those unsubstantiated claims, just like any other. It could be real, but then again I have no reason to believe that it necessarily is real.

Best thing to do is just see them for yourself.

But, as always, be careful what you wish for.

👣

I have noted that many people cannot resist making a decision when the information presented is insufficient for such. This is especially true of phenomena like UFO's and LENR. Rather than two boxes labeled 'true' and 'false,' try five boxes. Include 'probably true,' 'probably false,' and 'maybe either.' There is no need to decide without information and things can be moved from one box to another as information becomes available or merely stay where they are until that happens. In the case of the PC, it is unlikely that any more information will be forthcoming until the government discloses it.
As to the USAF Intel officer comments, the phenomena is well known in military circles. Foo fighters [not the band] and other such events in peacetime exercises and hot wars were reported and still happen. The truth is hidden from the general public but there does seem to be something other than swamp gas and Venus. Venus is rarely seen as a silvery disc travelling beneath aircraft at multiple Mach numbers. The question is, who is flying these craft? Are they manned or remote? Man-made or other? If man-made, are they reverse engineered from other technology?
I expect that if things come to a head, a disc will slowly circle DC in broad daylight and hover over the Whitehouse. When sufficient press has gathered for the big event, it will land on the lawn, the hatch will open and a humanoid figure will step out and walk toward a waiting President, remove his or her helmet, salute, and announce to all present name, rank and US service.

--- Crazed, dope smoking, slick riding veteran.

Sounds like UFO's come in handy for many things, possibly to cover up a friendly fire incident or onboard accident in this case.

Only verifiable facts, the boat was destroyed and people died.

a reply to: JadeStar

Tell me WHAT do you think hallucenogenics do to a person, anyway?
Heroin?
Do you think it permanently skews reality?
Without prior mental illness you would be incorrect .
NOT to mention AFOSI had a REALLY tight control of intelligence people or they would loose their carreers.

So since I've been accused of being an evil, mean "disinformation" agent let me get this straight:

If a person was part of military intelligence and says they saw UFOs & Aliens they're credible and should be believed regardless of lack of evidence.

and....

If a person was part of military intelligence and says that UFO reports were due to misidentifications of secret aircraft or the result of psychological operations complete with paperwork, names and dates they're not credible and should be ignored.


Lol, ok.


Either you trust the military or you don't.

Either you trust the government or you don't.

Believers like to cherry pick who they believe and who they trust but their cherry picking doesn't seem to follow logic.

In a war which has produced more instances of PTSD than any before it or since, which is known for the rampant drug use, disinformation and outright lying on the part of the military, we're supposed to believe a military INTELLIGENCE person (the very type of people who often ARE disinformation agents ie: Richard Doty - Mirage Men) when they give an extraordinary story which is absent of extraordinary evidence......

Lol, ok....

Drug use and disinformation are a verified fact of the Vietnam war. Space travelling aliens coming to a theater of combat, not so much.

Occam's Razor ya'll....

originally posted by: TinfoilTP
Sounds like UFO's come in handy for many things, possibly to cover up a friendly fire incident or onboard accident in this case.

Only verifiable facts, the boat was destroyed and people died.

Exactly. Star for you.

a reply to: JadeStar

I for one don't think you are a disinformation agent. I just think you have a narrow mind and a lot of personal ambition. You want to be the Jodie Foster who not only makes 'Contact', but who puts the lie to the crazy ufo cults and mainstream religions at the same time. One swift stroke.

Maybe I'm way, way off. After all, I don't know you. But if I wasn't, it's not likely you would admit it. Human nature and all.

👣

a reply to: pteridine

I expect that if things come to a head, a disc will slowly circle DC in broad daylight and hover over the Whitehouse.

I expect you're right, but you're a little late.

A fleet of flying saucers hovered over the whitehouse for two entire weekends in July, 1952.

It was banner headlines in the newspapers, we scrambled our jets but couldn't get close to them. Thousands of witnesses.

I don't for the life of me understand how anyone can still convince themselves that we are not in the presence of a more advanced culture.

a reply to: JadeStar

So since I've been accused of being an evil, mean "disinformation" agent let me get this straight:

Jade, when a person realizes they are in a hole, the first rule is; stop digging.

What about the reported sighting of "Foo" during WW2?

My grandfather was a stateside USAF test pilot and confessed to a family member after this retirement about having seen a few "unidentified lights" while in the skies during that time frame. He was straight as an arrow and never touched drugs.

a reply to: Scdfa

Can you link us to the headlines?

👣

a reply to: Scdfa

Jade, when a person realizes they are in a hole, the first rule is; stop digging.

Ha ha! I haven't seen you stop digging since you have been here!

originally posted by: Scdfa
a reply to: pteridine

I expect that if things come to a head, a disc will slowly circle DC in broad daylight and hover over the Whitehouse.

I expect you're right, but you're a little late.

A fleet of flying saucers hovered over the whitehouse for two entire weekends in July, 1952.

It was banner headlines in the newspapers, we scrambled our jets but couldn't get close to them. Thousands of witnesses.

I don't for the life of me understand how anyone can still convince themselves that we are not in the presence of a more advanced culture.

I know that case very well..There were also multiple radar contacts.

t 11:40 p.m. on Saturday, July 19, 1952, Edward Nugent, an air traffic controller at Washington National Airport (today Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport), spotted seven objects on his radar. The objects were located 15 miles (24 km) south-southwest of the city; no known aircraft were in the area and the objects were not following any established flight paths. Nugent's superior, Harry Barnes, a senior air-traffic controller at the airport, watched the objects on Nugent's radarscope. He later wrote:

We knew immediately that a very strange situation existed . . . their movements were completely radical compared to those of ordinary aircraft.[1]
At 8:15 p.m. on Saturday, July 26, 1952, a pilot and stewardess on a National Airlines flight into Washington observed some strange lights above their plane. Within minutes, both radar centers at National Airport, and the radar at Andrews AFB, were tracking more unknown objects. A master sergeant at Andrews visually observed the objects; he later said that "these lights did not have the characteristics of shooting stars. There was [sic] no trails . . . they traveled faster than any shooting star I have ever seen." [