Today is the Israeli election day. Your opinion?

originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: DeadSeraph

They will come claiming they don't hate Jews, just "zionists".

That's because Zionist aren't Jews they are atheist who claim to be Jews so they can steal the Jewish identity and everything that goes with it.

That's your opinion, but I guess you are doing what many on ATS and other sites do and define Zionism to suit your needs. The actual term was coined in the 19th century to define a movement to establish a Jewish homeland. Anything other than that is just opinion.

ETA: Rastafarians also believe land promised to them by Jah, their Zion is what we think of as Ethiopa and many traditions talk about returning to Zion - does that also make them Zionists?

a reply to: uncommitted

Be careful... It's not popular to say anything that's in support of Netanyahu or Israel on ATS. You'll be flamed out of existence by those who's pure hate supersede all objectivity.

originally posted by: EternalSolace
a reply to: uncommitted

Be careful... It's not popular to say anything that's in support of Netanyahu or Israel on ATS. You'll be flamed out of existence by those who's pure hate supersede all objectivity.

Thanks for the heads up, but I've not said anything to support Netanyahu, I can't say I agree one bit with his politics, but to use the term Zionist exclusively for a right wing Israeli government is missing the point.

It may be that Bibi will lose. It could not be due to this current administration's pumping of money into Israel to severely alter the election . Based on the way our President has treated him and the nation of Israel over the 6 years .
Could it?

As long as it's not a Bush, Clinton or Obama, I don't care wins!

I know we're talking about another Country, I was just sayin'

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: buster2010
That's because Zionist aren't Jews they are atheist who claim to be Jews so they can steal the Jewish identity and everything that goes with it.

That's your opinion, but I guess you are doing what many on ATS and other sites do and define Zionism to suit your needs.

Actually he is correct.
David Ben-Gurion was "a major Zionist leader and Executive Head of the World Zionist Organization in 1946" and he was a Jewish atheist

Jewish atheism refers to atheism as practiced by people who are ethnically and (at least to some extent) culturally Jewish. Because Jewishness encompasses ethnic as well as religious components, the term "Jewish atheism" does not necessarily imply a contradiction. [..] One recent study found that half of all American Jews have doubts about the existence of God [..]

About the Zionist Agenda, lets revisit the Biltmore Conference known by its resolution as the Biltmore Program, a fundamental departure from traditional Zionist policy. The meeting was held in New York City at the prestigious Biltmore Hotel from May 6 to May 11, 1942 with 600 delegates and Zionist leaders from 18 countries attending.

The Declaration of the Baltimore Program, stated 8 resolutions, here's the last one:

The Conference declares that the new world order that will follow victory cannot be established on foundations of peace, justice and equality, unless the problem of Jewish homelessness is finally solved.

The Conference urges that the gates of Palestine be opened; that the Jewish Agency be vested with control of immigration into Palestine and with the necessary authority for upbuilding the country, including the development of its unoccupied and uncultivated lands; and that Palestine be established as a Jewish Commonwealth integrated in the structure of the new democratic world.

Then and only then will the age old wrong to the Jewish people be righted

it was a "radical" (now days it would be called terrorist) movement to establish by force (if necessary) a new nation on a foreign land without the agreement / consent from the native land owners.

originally posted by: DeadSeraph
a reply to: vArchon

My opinion is that all the anti-semites about to come out and beak off can stfu.

They will come claiming they don't hate Jews, just "zionists". They will come claiming that nobody had the right to be in that land but the muslims.

They will come making claims of genocide while being hypocrites. I am not Israeli, and that is why it's not up to me (but I bet you think it's up to you?)

You appear to think that if someone criticisms the Israeli government that they are anti-Semites? That is certainly not the case.

images1.ynet.co.il...

CNN is reporting that the election is 'too close to call'.

a reply to: crazyewok

I don't like to wish harm on others even ones I think are evil such as Bibi. An assassination would only tar the people that need to be elected over there anyway.

originally posted by: voyger2

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: buster2010
That's because Zionist aren't Jews they are atheist who claim to be Jews so they can steal the Jewish identity and everything that goes with it.

That's your opinion, but I guess you are doing what many on ATS and other sites do and define Zionism to suit your needs.

Actually he is correct.
David Ben-Gurion was "a major Zionist leader and Executive Head of the World Zionist Organization in 1946" and he was a Jewish atheist

I made no mention of individuals, the term Zionism in and of itself does not imply it is an atheist organisation. Seeing as the word was defined in the 19th century, the faith (or non faith) of someone in mid 20th century doesn't alter the original definition.

It's interesting that the current main left wing party is the Zionist union isn't it?

Bibi won BIG time.
I'm really sick of this BS already...



Religious idiots are always the instigators of war. They are voting in the right winged parties in Israel (and Hamas in Gaza).

a reply to: uncommitted

That's your point of view. Interestingly you just missed the Baltimore program. Indeed, i'm not surprised.

Edit: In a few seconds I just found another one (atheist) for you Theodor Herzl May 2, 1860 – July 3, 1904 - "He was one of the fathers of modern political Zionism."

originally posted by: voyger2
a reply to: uncommitted

That's your point of view. Interestingly you just missed the Baltimore program. Indeed, i'm not surprised.

Edit: In a few seconds I just found another one (atheist) for you Theodor Herzl May 2, 1860 – July 3, 1904 - "He was one of the fathers of modern political Zionism."

It doesn't matter - I repeat - it doesn't matter. Can you show me in any of the work built in defining the term where the agreement was that the concept was atheist? Sheesh, I feel like this is a bit of a dead horse, Zionism (in this context, as the word is used by other groups also) = foundation of Jewish state. Not 'Jewish state but only atheist', not to best of my knowledge 'Jewish state but you need to be a practicing member of the Judaic faith' - it means foundation of a state for Jewish people. Anything added on top is not what the actual definition implied.

ETA - I'm not using opinion, that's the point. I'm using black and white facts devoid of opinion to counter those that dress up opinion as fact.

a reply to: uncommitted

originally posted by: uncommitted
Buster comment:
« [..] Zionist aren't Jews they are atheist [..]»

your first reaction:
That's your opinion, [..]

Just shown to you that the founding fathers of Zionism, were actually atheist. Like i said before he was correct about that.

Of course you use opinion (check your post above)... such as I used it, and yet, I was the only one providing evidence.

About the other part of Buster "opinion", I, brought to you again, "facts?" of the «Zionist "radical" (now days it would be called terrorist) movement to establish by force (if necessary) a new nation on a foreign land without the agreement / consent from the native land owners» as mentioned on the Baltimore Program, that you conveniently keep ignoring.

originally posted by: voyger2
a reply to: uncommitted

originally posted by: uncommitted
Buster comment:
« [..] Zionist aren't Jews they are atheist [..]»

your first reaction:
That's your opinion, [..]

Just shown to you that the founding fathers of Zionism, were actually atheist. Like i said before he was correct about that.

Of course you use opinion (check your post above)... such as I used it, and yet, I was the only one providing evidence.

About the other part of Buster "opinion", I, brought to you again, "facts?" of the «Zionist "radical" (now days it would be called terrorist) movement to establish by force (if necessary) a new nation on a foreign land without the agreement / consent from the native land owners» as mentioned on the Baltimore Program, that you conveniently keep ignoring.

No, you are putting words in mouth. Is the Zionist Union (Israeli left wing party) terrorist? No. But they call themselves Zionist so how can they not be? Because you and others are bending the definition of the word. As for the 'owners', that is for a different topic is there are multiple opinions you can find anywhere on the web.

The Baltimore program didn't exist when the term Zionist was coined, so I'm not sure what you are trying to prove, but please, let's stop this to-ing and fro-ing which isn't going to resolve anything. I'm using the term how it was defined, you are using it as you see fit. That is your right, but it doesn't actually make it factually correct.

a reply to: uncommitted

I'm not even going to reply to your arguments, because I consider them: opinion, lies and/or false accusations, they lack again and again, of:evidence/sources.

It will be better to finish this "debate" to prevent thread drift. thank you.

originally posted by: voyger2
a reply to: uncommitted

I'm not even going to reply to your arguments, because I consider them: opinion, lies and/or false accusations, they lack again and again, of:evidence/sources.

It will be better to finish this "debate" to prevent thread drift. thank you.

lol, ok. Weird how ATS works and the mantra of deny ignorance only seems to work when it doesn't affect what someone states without looking at facts.

Ciao

a reply to: uncommitted
a reply to: voyger2

From it's foundation by Ben Gurion, Israel has been a theocracy, the jewish-one-state proposal is just another step (too far ?) to enforce this.

And Netanyahu promised no Palestinian state if he's re-elected. This sucks. Though it's not nearly as bad as I felt when Bush won his 2nd term because I was sure we (the US) were going to war w/Iran if he was re-elected in 2004. So who knows, maybe there's still hope for peace.