Ohio shopper shoots teen dead outside mall for trying to steal newly bought Nike Air Jordans

originally posted by: Skid Mark
a reply to: ForteanOrg

Why risk your life trying to steal a pair of shoes? That's the real question.

I found this intriguing. The would be thief obviously did not think his life was in any way at risk. More occurrences like this is a good deterrent against crime.

I say kill a few more villains & there will be less villains.

a reply to: Shamrock6

We don't know any of the details of what exactly person b did with said gun.
Just that he had one and 'showed' or 'brandished' it.

originally posted by: Jamie1
Yes, this is why the founding father's in America decided it was a God given right to protect yourself how you see fit rather than allow some ninny bureaucrat decide how you can protect yourself.

If this had happened in the time of our forefathers, a white man would be getting compensated for the loss of property.

originally posted by: ForteanOrg
It's a cultural thing too, my friend. Dutch people are mostly very happy to entertain guests. If I find strangers in my house, I don't shoot them. I'll probably ask them how I may help them - if strangers enter my house, that's almost always because they lost their way...

Frankly people do not ever just 'wander into strangers homes' and to posit such a moronic and rather obnoxious scenario is childish at best.

originally posted by: DrJunk

The likelihood that you will shoot yourself or a member of your family with a gun is greater than the likelihood of your saving them from a criminal.

Since I have no intention of committing suicide, a criminal act or cleaning my firearms while loaded (the leading causes in your link) I think the likelihood is that I will not be injured by my own weapons.

a reply to: Sremmos80

That's why I said "introduced a gun to the situation." I didn't say pointed, brandished, possessed, or anything else.

The initial article I saw stated that "police say" he pointed the gun. Since then, articles I've seen have either parroted that statement or have said "brandished" or "displayed" or "showed." Since there hasn't been a definitive answer, I said "introduced."

a reply to: Krakatoa

"either?" What else did I not understand?

When you create a thread with that title it will sure as gold result in folks discussing shoes, guns and robbery. Which we did. Do even.

Now, were I a detective or a judge I'd look for motivation. What motivated the juvenile to pull a gun? He wanted the shoes. He probably thought that the movies he'd seen were correct: that if a guy points a gun at someone that someone will freeze in his boots (or other footwear, might even be Jordans). So, he pulled a gun and the motivation was: want of a pair of shoes.

So, to him, a life was more worth than a pair of shoes, as he fully expected the robbed person to hand them over.

The robbed person was fully aware that the juvenile wanted the shoes (according to the reports we read). But instead of deciding that his life, that of his wife (whom was threatened too) and that of the juvenile was worth more than the value of that pair of shoes, he pulled a gun and shot the robber dead. Bang.

To me that's just the same as saying "the life of that guy that tried to rob me is not worth the value of my shoes". You can go on all night long (but I won't be listening for a while, off to celebrate New Years Eve here :cheers but I won't budge: that's what this type of behaviour means to me. I have an opinion. You have yours. But don't try to hide the fact that this was all about ownership of a pair of stupid shoes.

He should have handed them over.

Now, sorry if I don't answer for a while - off to the party !

Happy New Year!

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: DrJunk

The likelihood that you will shoot yourself or a member of your family with a gun is greater than the likelihood of your saving them from a criminal.

Since I have no intention of committing suicide, a criminal act or cleaning my firearms while loaded (the leading causes in your link) I think the likelihood is that I will not be injured by my own weapons.

And yet, the likelihood that you will is still greater than the likelihood that you will save your family from a criminal.

a reply to: ForteanOrg

The delusional value you attach to human life is pathetic.

originally posted by: ForteanOrg
a reply to: Krakatoa

To me that's just the same as saying "the life of that guy that tried to rob me is not worth the value of my shoes".

Newsflash, It wasn't.

a reply to: ForteanOrg

You can choose to see it that way. Just as others can choose to see it as the guy with the shoes wasn't willing to roll the dice that the other fella, who by this point in the story had already introduced a gun, was simply going to say "cool man, thanks" and walk away after being given the shoes.

Since the shooter hasn't come out and said "here's why I shot this dude" neither side holds any more water than the other, and is purely an attempt to project your own views into the mind of the shooter.

a reply to: Shamrock6

Well you did say flashed but that still isn't saying much.

Ahhh. So we accept reports that person A shot person B but don't accept reports that person A shot person B after person B flashed a gun at him?

This was what I was replying to.

originally posted by: DrJunk

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: DrJunk

The likelihood that you will shoot yourself or a member of your family with a gun is greater than the likelihood of your saving them from a criminal.

Since I have no intention of committing suicide, a criminal act or cleaning my firearms while loaded (the leading causes in your link) I think the likelihood is that I will not be injured by my own weapons.

And yet, the likelihood that you will is still greater than the likelihood that you will save your family from a criminal.

Spoken like a true sheep. This is a very stupid statistic to argue about.

a reply to: Sremmos80

I haven't seen a single article that says a gun wasn't displayed. The manner of that display is what is open for debate. Whether one lifts one's shirt, waves a gun around, points it, throws it up in the air and catches it, or does some Doc Holiday trickery with it, I think "flashing" covers it.

a reply to: Eunuchorn

It would be a lot more stupid to ignore it if you value your own and/or other people's lives.

originally posted by: DrJunk

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: DrJunk

The likelihood that you will shoot yourself or a member of your family with a gun is greater than the likelihood of your saving them from a criminal.

Since I have no intention of committing suicide, a criminal act or cleaning my firearms while loaded (the leading causes in your link) I think the likelihood is that I will not be injured by my own weapons.

And yet, the likelihood that you will is still greater than the likelihood that you will save your family from a criminal.

Rectal extraction of false probability argument to justify limiting how one can protect oneself.

It is 100x more likely you'll be killed in a car accident than murdered by a gun. Should we ban cars?

a reply to: Shamrock6

Agreed.
I am not trying to say person a shot him without knowing the kid had a gun at the very least.

Just we don't know what the kid did with the gun out side of make it known,most likely visibly not just verbally, that he had it.

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: Shamrock6

Agreed.
I am not trying to say person a shot him without knowing the kid had a gun at the very least.

Just we don't know what the kid did with the gun out side of make it known,most likely visibly not just verbally, that he had it.

Which, in this case is still considered felonious armed robbery...and a threat of deadly force. It's academic whether he just lifted his shirt to "show him" or pointed it at him, the crime and threat are the same.

a reply to: Sremmos80

Agreed.

You liked that I managed to bring Doc Holliday into things though. Admit it

a reply to: Shamrock6

Ya not a bad reference.
We can agree there

a reply to: Shamrock6

Twice even
DP