Some Atheist's will be saved according to the Gospel of John...

...As long as they remain on the side of good and benevolence.

First and foremost, I don't believe the Bible is infallible. Out of it, the Gospel of John is the least corrupted. Some of the worst are in the Old Testament and the Epistles of Paul. Paul who nearly contradicted every teaching of Jesus! So I think Paul is a false apostle!

In particular, Atheists who practice asceticism and rally the cause of the poor and the weak (including animals) will be saved even if they don't believe in Christ.

The Gospel of John doesn't require belief in the name of Jesus (as most "Pauline" Christians will tell you!), all you have to do is to do good!

- Most Christians will flaunt John 3:16 in your face but belief is works!! - John 14:12!! What Jesus did is live a life of asceticism, rallying the cause of the weak, and set people free from the ideals of this system run by the ruling elites!

- John 5:29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned. (no mention of belief in the name of Jesus!)

- John 12:47-48 “If anyone hears my words but does not keep them, I do not judge that person. For I did not come to judge the world, but to save the world. 48 There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; the very words I have spoken will condemn them at the last day. ("keep is not in the same context here as "accept". "Keep" is to act upon it. "Accept" is to welcome something as good but not necessarily do it.)


The Gospel of John has none of that virgin birth, blood communion, cross, resurrection, belief in the name of Jesus (as if it's like a magic spell) symbolisms that "Pauline Christianity" promotes.


Pauline Christianity is ridiculously unfair and unjust!!

In Pauline Christianity, it makes it possible for you to be extremely benevolent but because you never accepted Jesus in your heart because you live in the middle of the Amazon Forest and never seen a single missionary, you will go to hell if you die in that moment while on the other hand, a person who continues to do evil but because he accepted Jesus, he will go to heaven!!

Does that sound right to you?? NO it isn't!! BTW, I also found out there is no eternal torture in hell. Bad people simply lose their souls at some point in time and ceases to exist, no eternal torture and that's in the Bible too!!


I've been a Christian for the last 20 years. A Pauline Christian, but no more! Apostle Paul is evil, the Bible is fallible, only someone who has stopped thinking will think otherwise! Else, Jesus rocks, church sucks!

Faith is supposed to see, not get blind!! There is no blind faith!!

originally posted by: johndeere2020
...As long as they remain on the side of good and benevolence.

First and foremost, I don't believe the Bible is infallible. Out of it, the Gospel of John is the least corrupted. Some of the worst are in the Old Testament and the Epistles of Paul. Paul who nearly contradicted every teaching of Jesus! So I think Paul is a false apostle!

In particular, Atheists who practice asceticism and rally the cause of the poor and the weak (including animals) will be saved even if they don't believe in Christ.

The Gospel of John doesn't require belief in the name of Jesus (as most "Pauline" Christians will tell you!), all you have to do is to do good!

- Most Christians will flaunt John 3:16 in your face but belief is works!! - John 14:12!! What Jesus did is live a life of asceticism, rallying the cause of the weak, and set people free from the ideals of this system run by the ruling elites!

- John 5:29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned. (no mention of belief in the name of Jesus!)

- John 12:47-48 “If anyone hears my words but does not keep them, I do not judge that person. For I did not come to judge the world, but to save the world. 48 There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; the very words I have spoken will condemn them at the last day. ("keep is not in the same context here as "accept". "Keep" is to act upon it. "Accept" is to welcome something as good but not necessarily do it.)


The Gospel of John has none of that virgin birth, blood communion, cross, resurrection, belief in the name of Jesus (as if it's like a magic spell) symbolisms that "Pauline Christianity" promotes.


Pauline Christianity is ridiculously unfair and unjust!!

In Pauline Christianity, it makes it possible for you to be extremely benevolent but because you never accepted Jesus in your heart because you live in the middle of the Amazon Forest and never seen a single missionary, you will go to hell if you die in that moment while on the other hand, a person who continues to do evil but because he accepted Jesus, he will go to heaven!!

Does that sound right to you?? NO it isn't!! BTW, I also found out there is no eternal torture in hell. Bad people simply lose their souls at some point in time and ceases to exist, no eternal torture and that's in the Bible too!!


I've been a Christian for the last 20 years. A Pauline Christian, but no more! Apostle Paul is evil, the Bible is fallible, only someone who has stopped thinking will think otherwise! Else, Jesus rocks, church sucks!

Faith is supposed to see, not get blind!!

There is no blind faith!!

Star and flag. The whole "saved" and "accept Jesus" thing is a evangelical protestant thing. I remember being taught in catechism class that anyone who does right, believer or not, can be "saved."

Since I have evolved away form religion and theism, I haven't been following the latest ideas but that is my recollection.

People shouldn't need a book to tell them how to live proper and good lives, the sheer disregard for others life that some people display never ceases to amaze and disgust me.

In an ideal world we would just all get along and stop with the mindless murdering and petty wars without the need for a rule book but sadly humanity seems intent on destroying itself

You have to be righteous which means you must keep God's Commandments. Of all those in Bible, very, very few could be said to have been able to be called righteous. Righteousness is not a state of lawlessness in God's eyes, nor is it a state of sin.

So while there may be atheists who will be found righteous, the average atheist is as much a sinner as the rest of us.

There is no blind faith!!

Wow...the ultimate oxymoron...

All faith IS BY DEFINITION BLIND...LOL!!!

My understanding and interpretations of the bible are certainly very imperfect... but to me, basically all of Romans 2 really sounds like non-Christians are saved so long as they follow the moral laws. These moral laws are etched in their hearts by God (whether they realize it or not). Romans 2:7, for instance: To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.

That is just my understanding and interpretation. I am sure many disagree. But... as I really don't spend time worrying about how others will or will not be judged by God. I am not God. I just try to live by the teachings of Christ as best as I can. And honestly, I haven't followed God's moral laws perfectly, so I definitely need the forgiveness of the cross. I couldn't make it on my own.

So it's basically what I've been trying to convince the Christian people that I know for years. If you do good things, good things await you.

I think a lot of people who are 'Christian' will be in for a rude awakening when and IF there is a God. I put that in quotes because some people identify with it, but just ride the coattails of it because they think they will saved. There are some people who are Christian in no other way than they go to church, and that makes you a Christian the same way me standing in a garage makes me a car.

I can only wonder that if Atheists who are good people will be saved, does that mean that those who use Christianity as a means to spread hate will not be saved? I mean, those people, Christian (or not), are not GOOD people.

Double post. =_= Delete please.

How do you determine what parts of the bible are fallible, and which parts are infallible? And if you're wrong on which parts you cherry pick, then what?
It seems to me, the bible is either the "inspired" word of god, or it isn't. If it isn't, then why believe any of it? If it is, then how can you cherry pick what you like, and reject what you don't, then expect god to accept you as one of his own?

originally posted by: Klassified
How do you determine what parts of the bible are fallible, and which parts are infallible? And if you're wrong on which parts you cherry pick, then what?
It seems to me, the bible is either the "inspired" word of god, or it isn't. If it isn't, then why believe any of it? If it is, then how can you cherry pick what you like, and reject what you don't, then expect god to accept you as one of his own?

Find what is true by the effect it has on your life and others around you...

the gospels can change your life, but I can't say the same about Pauls writing, and especially not the OT books...

The truth came through the son of God... the rest are nothing but imitators... thieves and robbers as he said

S&F OP...

I love to see Christians wake up now and again

a reply to: johndeere2020

Have you actually read the book of John? Because the cross the last supper the resurrection are all in there. Dude seriously. Everything you just claimed about Pauline Christianity is wrong. He never says you have to ask Jesus into your heart. That's churchianity but not in the bible. Paul never claims the bible is infallible either. Men are god breathed and are not infallible.

I don't mean to be a jerk but go read the last few chapters of john. Ch 19 is crucifixion ch20 is resurrection. And then actually read Paul's letters. Everything you just described come from the institutional church. Not from the bible.

Just remember athiest and everyone else still have to recoginize the son in order to allow passage to the father. No matter how good you are you still have to have faith that jesus is the son and you must submit to the will of god at some point.

originally posted by: longy9999
People shouldn't need a book to tell them how to live proper and good lives, the sheer disregard for others life that some people display never ceases to amaze and disgust me.

The Gospel of John actually agrees with you

In the context of John chapter 5, the reason you would believe the Word of God is that it's already in you. This surely means some people will be saved without ever seeing a Bible, nor a preacher simply because they have much respect and love and care for all life and a hate of evil and injustice.

My purpose here is not to get people to "sign up" to my belief but simply for exposing the wrongs. You've been hearing the wrong Christ all this time!

All I can say is please have as much respect to all life as you can - even if it means having a less comfortable life. Because that is what really saves. Religiousness and repetitive rituals won't work and frankly, it's annoying!

Star and flag. The whole "saved" and "accept Jesus" thing is a evangelical protestant thing. I remember being taught in catechism class that anyone who does right, believer or not, can be "saved."

im reasonably certain that concept is in the bible, which ALL brands of christianity are supposed to adhere to. not just the highlighted portions or the ones that make you feel warm and fuzzy inside. if you do not believe in jesus, you are screwed. you must believe he is the son of god, he died for our sins, rose three days later, blehbleh. otherwise there is no point to being a "christian". his sacrifice and station means nothing if you do not invest in it.

its funny how people love to be associated with christianity until it asks them to actually believe in the stuff it stands for. "Believe in jesus the son of god? But why? i go to church and say grace before every meal, thats enough isn;t it?" lol

originally posted by: johndeere2020

originally posted by: longy9999
People shouldn't need a book to tell them how to live proper and good lives, the sheer disregard for others life that some people display never ceases to amaze and disgust me.

All I can say is please have as much respect to all life as you can - even if it means having a less comfortable life. Because that is what really saves. Religiousness and repetitive rituals won't work and frankly, it's annoying!

Couldn't have said it better myself, if people would just have a little more respect for the lives of others this world wouldn't be in the mess its currently in.

originally posted by: coastlinekid

There is no blind faith!!

Wow...the ultimate oxymoron...

All faith IS BY DEFINITION BLIND...LOL!!!

Blind faith is only invented by the apostate church to make people follow the false Christ of the false apostle Paul.

I will not follow whom I do not know:

John 4:22
You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews.

a reply to: johndeere2020

Blind faith is only invented by the apostate church to make people follow the false Christ of the false apostle Paul.

oh, you mean the guy whose works are considered a canon part of the bible. that thing he apparently lies about. interesting. how is it that the committe in charge of the bible failed to notice what you so generously brought to our attention?

originally posted by: longy9999
People shouldn't need a book to tell them how to live proper and good lives, the sheer disregard for others life that some people display never ceases to amaze and disgust me.

Also. This. If you need a book to tell you to be a good person, you're not really a good person.

originally posted by: Lyxdeslic

originally posted by: longy9999
People shouldn't need a book to tell them how to live proper and good lives, the sheer disregard for others life that some people display never ceases to amaze and disgust me.

Also. This. If you need a book to tell you to be a good person, you're not really a good person.

zing!

a reply to: johndeere2020

The reason why John talks about love so much is because the gospel of John was written by "the beloved disciple", an actual student of Jesus not just an eyewitness.

To bad there is no sermon on the mount in the gospel of John.

Jesus did say what greater love is there than to lay down one's life for your friends, and that in order to be a disciple of Jesus you must follow his commandment which he gave : to love others as much as he loved us. THe idea of selfless love is the main focus which is right on target with the greatest love (agape) to give of yourself from joy and loving sacrifice .