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An article on "Left Behind" for Christians.

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posted on Oct, 2 2014 @ 06:00 PM
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a reply to: Nechash

Left Behind is just Hollywood's latest attempt to distort the Word of God, just like Noah and Son of God. The Exodus movie coming out will be the same. These movies are designed by Satan to confuse people, especially the average Christian who is the typical "Joel Osteen" Sunday only type.




posted on Oct, 2 2014 @ 07:19 PM
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a reply to: AlephBet

Baptism saves YOU!
What it is saying in 3 Peter, 19 . . on, is that you can suffer and die.
An illustration for this concept is in the Ridley Scott movie, The Kingdom of Heaven, where Liam Neeson's character has this pledge that he has his knights make,

"Be brave and upright that God may love thee. Speak the truth always, even if it leads to your death. Safeguard the helpless and do no wrong. That is your oath."

where the fact that you have this baptism into Jesus' resurrection gives you the courage to make this pledge, that you can take persecution for being good.
It is that goodness that you then do that saves you.


edit on 2-10-2014 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 2 2014 @ 09:30 PM
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a reply to: jmdewey60



It is that goodness that you then do that saves you.


A word from the Bible that is relevant here is being double-minded. This is duplicity, or doing something good expecting a reward. The other side of duplicity is doing something good to avoid punishment. However, being double-minded is not the process. As Peter 3 points out, it is baptism (flood of Noah) that saves you, not your own work. God is the one doing the work to save us. Our own good works are a shadow of the true nature of God. Faith in God saves us, and as a manifestation of this faith, we do good works. No double mind is involved. We simply do good because we see the need in others. This is suffering by choice rather than suffering a consequence of choice.

You know this from past posts, but others may want to know.

R -------------> S ---------------> R

Reward leads to suffering. Suffering on purpose leads to reward. I can take drugs as a reward and suffer the results. I can work a job that feeds my family and suffer for the reward. It's all the direction we take and why we take that direction. If it is love for others, then we suffer correctly. If we do it for selfish gain, we are really doing it for ourselves. Any form of taking leads to suffering as a consequence. Any form of selfless giving leads to true reward for us and all those around us.

If you can see the truth in this, then you can see the difference between giving and taking for self. Salvation comes from giving, or suffering for others. Reward is simply a byproduct, just as faith has the fruit of charity for no hope of repayment.

Christ suffered on the cross for two reasons. 1) His own past as the Son of God. 2) What that caused for mankind as a consequence. Repentance is seeing your own faults in the error it causes for others.



posted on Oct, 3 2014 @ 05:33 AM
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a reply to: AlephBet

A word from the Bible that is relevant here is being double-minded. This is duplicity, or doing something good expecting a reward.
This is the first time I have seen it defined like that, and have no idea of how you came up with that.
"Double-minded", looking it it up, turns out to be in the New Testament, only in the Book of James.
I'm looking at the commentary on James by Ralph Martin and he is saying that the term doesn't seem to be a common Greek usage and was probably a way of translating the phrase from the Old Testament about being of two minds, giving as an example the verse in Deuteronomy to not be of two minds when you come to pray to the Lord.
The reward that it is talking about is the mental capacity to persevere, it isn't about going to heaven or being given eternal life.
What it looks like to me that you are doing is setting up a system of salvation by the work of your own doing of not being double-minded.

The other place where this term comes up is in James 4.
There, it is talking about how problems come up because of the desire for the things of this world.
Double-mindedness in this context means not focusing on the spiritual things that we should be asking God for.

It also shows up in Psalm 119:113, where the context is, according to the NIV:

Though I constantly take my life in my hands,
I will not forget your law.
The wicked have set a snare for me,
but I have not strayed from your precepts.
Your statutes are my heritage forever;
they are the joy of my heart.
My heart is set on keeping your decrees
to the very end.

I hate double-minded people,
but I love your law.
You are my refuge and my shield;
I have put my hope in your word.
Away from me, you evildoers,
that I may keep the commands of my God!

This does not seem to be saying that these people he is thinking of who were double-minded were too busy keeping the Law, but more likely the opposite, where they will at one point put on an act as if they cared about the Law, then in their actions, showed that they were actually quite wicked.

So, looking at the Bible, there is no indication that it means anything like what you are trying to say that it does.

The Bible does not use the word, reward, with the idea that there is something wrong with the idea of hoping for one, but to the contrary, uses it as an encouragement to do the right thing in order to get it.

Also the Bible does not put wanting to avoid punishment in a negative light.
Again, quite the contrary.

However, being double-minded is not the process. As Peter 3 points out, it is baptism (flood of Noah) that saves you, not your own work.
The people who were destroyed in the flood, were, because of their evil works.
Peter does not phrase it like that, where there is a dichotomy between your works, and baptism, as a means of salvation.

God is the one doing the work to save us. Our own good works are a shadow of the true nature of God. Faith in God saves us, and as a manifestation of this faith, we do good works.
Whether we are ultimately saved or lost is dependent on if we are good or bad, which is determined by our deeds.
What you (meaning everyone) need to do is get over the idea that the terminology of the Letter to the Ephesians and the terminology of the Letter to the Romans is interchangeable.

In Romans, we are nor saved by works, meaning following the Law as if you were a Jew, even if you were a Christian convert from Judaism.

No double mind is involved. We simply do good because we see the need in others. This is suffering by choice rather than suffering a consequence of choice.
Being double-minded has nothing to do with wanting to have a better afterlife, but is about the failure to actually focus on that aspect of our life, being distracted by the material things of this world.
There is no warning in the Bible against wanting a better reward after we die.
It warns about wanting too much of what this world has to offer.
Peter, and also Paul, talk about literal persecution for being a Christian.
People could have just participated in all the Roman style cultural activity of the day and avoided persecution, but they would not have been doing right according to how God directs us.


In Ephesians, we are saved, meaning gathered into the church which represents the congregation of the saved which serves the role formerly filled by "Israel".
That "salvation", the church, is not something that we did, meaning an invention by men, but was made by God and Jesus.
When we are "saved", meaning entering into that church that Jesus made, we are brought into it specifically to do good works, not meaning the works of following the old Law, but a Christian behavior which is doing good, rather than bad, such as sinning.

If you can see the truth in this, then you can see the difference between giving and taking for self. Salvation comes from giving, or suffering for others. Reward is simply a byproduct, just as faith has the fruit of charity for no hope of repayment.
You are putting this into human terms, removing God from the equation, outside of just this entity who facilitates our passage into the afterlife.
What you need is to get in touch with the concept of what you do not being optional.
You MUST be good, or else!
Now think . . how on earth can you do that?
Hmm, let's see . . how about on my own power, as a choice, and based on just my feelings of good will, I give someone something?

Can't you see how you are actually basing salvation on not just works, but on your self-empowered, human works, while ascribing greatness to God only for being strong enough to hold open the door to Heaven long enough for you to just walk on through?

Real Christianity is connecting with God by having Christ in you that empowers good works, not to "save" your skinny little hide, but to save the world by making it a place where you would actually want to live in.
edit on 3-10-2014 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 3 2014 @ 04:30 PM
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a reply to: jmdewey60

There are several versions of double-mindedness in scripture. As you said before, two minds. The other is Duplicity and the other is hypocrite. Partiality would be another.

For instance,

Proverbs 11:3 3 The integrity of the upright guides them,
but the unfaithful are destroyed by their duplicity.

If you then read all of chapter 11, it outlines all the aspects of saying one thing, but desiring another.

Luke 20

21 So the spies questioned him: “Teacher, we know that you speak and teach what is right, and that you do not show partiality but teach the way of God in accordance with the truth. 22 Is it right for us to pay taxes to Caesar or not?”

23 He saw through their duplicity and said to them, 24 “Show me a denarius. Whose image and inscription are on it?”

“Caesar’s,” they replied.

25 He said to them, “Then give back to Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s.”

It was a loaded question. Either way he answers, they already have a pretext ready to deny his answer. What does he do? He shows the truth. The created value in the coin is an illusion of the image of their leader. Money is used and relates directly to Proverbs 11 again.

As for James 1:8, I will refer you to the thread I did on that set of 18 verses. LINK. Here is a quote:

"---And here, he gets to the point of why we must be determined that God can lead us to the end of our request. When asking for wisdom, God brings trials to our life. Being double-minded is duplicity. If I seek God's wisdom for my own reward, then what am I really after? Reward. If I seek it to avoid some perceived judgment of God, then why am I seeking wisdom? To avoid judgement. What did James promise at the end of Wisdom's work? Joy, not reward. Joy is a complete and full heart. It is filled. If you are asking for wisdom, be prepared to sail the high seas with confidence. "

Asking for wisdom as a selfish request is not a mirror of God's will. Asking for wisdom in relation to giving to others IS mirrored to the will of God.

Selfish prayer: "Lord, make me the wisest person who has ever lived so I can be famous."

That's double-minded.

Humble prayer: "Lord, give me wisdom to help my alcoholic son."

Single mind. What is asked for matches why you are asking.



posted on Oct, 3 2014 @ 05:50 PM
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a reply to: AlephBet

Here is a quote:

"---And here, he gets to the point of why we must be determined that God can lead us to the end of our request. When asking for wisdom, God brings trials to our life. Being double-minded is duplicity. If I seek God's wisdom for my own reward, then what am I really after? Reward. If I seek it to avoid some perceived judgment of God, then why am I seeking wisdom? To avoid judgement. What did James promise at the end of Wisdom's work? Joy, not reward. Joy is a complete and full heart. It is filled. If you are asking for wisdom, be prepared to sail the high seas with confidence. "

Asking for wisdom as a selfish request is not a mirror of God's will. Asking for wisdom in relation to giving to others IS mirrored to the will of God.
But you are just inserting your own opinion into an unrelated Bible passage.



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