General Motors Co recalled 511,528 Chevrolet Camaros.

DETROIT - General Motors Co recalled 511,528 Chevrolet Camaros on Friday for an ignition switch problem similar to the defect linked to at least 13 deaths in Chevrolet Cobalts and other models.

GM said it was aware of minor accidents but no fatalities from the Camaro, a sporty two-door car. It said the Camaro switch defect differed from the problem in the Cobalts, but a consumer advocate said GM still should have recalled the Camaros sooner.

GM said a driver's knee could bump the Camaro key fob and move the ignition switch out of the "run" position, causing the engine to shut off.

General Motors Co recalled 511,528 Chevrolet Camaros.

General Motors, the company that probably got the biggest automotive bailout in American History is now having to recall a hell of a lot of new fly Camaro Models for something that should have been done right the first place.

I personally am an American car lover up until 1980, and a Honda fanatic from 1981-2002. What happened to the quality that came from having an American made car up in D-Town? I guess it started when the bodies stopped being steel and went into that material that I always refer to as Teflon.

What is really going on? I am willing to bet that the car is falling apart from cheap Chinese parts. The sad thing is a suped up Camaro can run you 50K easily, 22K on the lower end. Remember when a Camaro in 1978 cost almost 3200? With the poor workmanship of all American cars these days you would think the price would drop.

I had a 2000 Blazer and had to sell it. Every year I had to do a front end overhaul from the frame because of a defect I was told, but one that wasn't covered in the warranty. Its a pain in the ass to replace tie rods, ball bearings and joints, axls, and get the frame realigned every year. First and last Chevy. My bff got a 2004 brand new Chevy Impala off the lot and the transmission went around 16,000 miles. That was a long fight for her to get chevy to fix it, and when she did tranny number 2 died in the same mileage. Don't get me wrong, newer Volvo's are going through the same thing.

I digress, what the hell was the point of bailing out GM to do even less performance on a dying breed of car that doesn't even give good gas mileage

a reply to: ArchPlayer


Should of bought a Toyota...

I gave up on US manufactures a long time ago.

My high school car was a 1973 Toyota corona..that's right corona not corolla. That little four cylinder beast had 400000 miles on it, received just basic preventive maintenance and ran like a champ. All the while watching my buddies fight with newer US made cars that just kept falling apart...

a reply to: AprilFooseball

Best car I ever drove was a 2003 Toyota Camry. Drove literally 16 hrs and only had to fill up once. Granted Though, Toyota had that brake recall problem a while back though, so they aren't exempt either.

I personally think all car manufacturing is just going to crap. People are buying based on name value from back in the day versus quality. But then again, most car manufacturers want you in a new car every year; with the inflated prices it just isn't worth it if you compound gasoline inflation, insurance, and tags.

a reply to: ArchPlayer

This is typical. I had a new 1995 Firebird Formula convertible with LT1 and 6 speed (the trans am didn't come in a convertible). The car was delivered with a very small amount of oil and grease in the differential. On my first service, I had everything changed over to synthetic, the mechanic got third degree burns on his right hand when he touched the differential and was taken to hospital. So, knowing I probably had a bad differential, I went to the dealer and asked them to replace the differential as a seized or locking diff can be very dangerous, now remember this vehicle has about 1000 km's on it (first service). They wouldn't do it. So to test the car I took it up to about 180kph on the track and it felt like the wheels were going to come off (Z series tires professionally balanced and rated at 240kph+). Took it back to the dealer, still no go, they asked me why I was driving at 180kph, I told them because I could and the speedo goes to 240kph.

So, I called up Werner Pallus and Ted Robertson, the engineers at GM and they told me it wasn't the differential, but it was rather the drive shaft and that it sets up a secondary resonance in Firebird convertibles, I told them that wasn't the problem, it was the differential, but they ignored the fact that the car was delivered to me with almost no oil and grease in the diff. They decided to send my dealer a $2,500 aluminum racing drive shaft, installed for free under warranty. I took the car back to the track and ran her up like last time, 180kph, wheels started feeling like they were going to come off, the vibration was horrible, you almost needed a kidney belt. So I went back to the dealer and explained that I tested again at 180kph and asked them to replace the diff, again. He said no, they were unable to show the diff was defective because they could not test the car on the street at 180kph.

So I offered to rent Mosport for half a day, take one of their technicians with me and if I was wrong, I would pay the technicians salary for the whole day. The dealer wouldn't do it, he said it was against their insurance policies. The car was in the shop from a day to three days every month until it was unloaded for breach of contract.

Everybody has got an excuse to screw up, not do their jobs and support their products or services, and this is not limited to GM. It seems epidemic in every facet of society, but actually most prevalent in the political arena.

Cheers - Dave

a reply to: ArchPlayer

This is why it's best to buy used vehicles.

A 5-6 year old vehicle model will either be in one of two categories by that point: In superb shape or already having problems.

a reply to: bobs_uruncle

That is real sad what happened with your Firebird. Loved them until the new body style of the mid 90s. Also, it is not uncommon for Pontiacs to have SERIOUS electrical problems. I've helped more than my fair share of friends rewire their Grand Prix's and Bonneville's when their brakes fail - who even thought that was a great idea to begin with to have an electrical system control brakes?

Great bodies but unless you are gonna rebuild it from scratch not worth it IMHO. Love the fact you offered to rent a racing track to prove the defectiveness and they refused to come, ha ha ha. Had that happen with a custom built Ford Taurus I had from the factory for drag racing. Now I will say this for a Ford, when they run they run damn great, but when they hit about 85K (if you are lucky enough to keep it that long) they are either Found On Road Dead or Fix Or Repair Daily.

a reply to: OrphanApology

Problem is, all the used cars since around 2005 have something wrong with them if they are domestic. If they are foreign they cost just as much as a new car, and sometimes even more if it is a prized model. Looking at you Honda Ridgeline.

a reply to: ArchPlayer

Ford Focuses aren't bad.

Neither are Mazda 3s(which are Fords).

Ford cars are O.K.

Just steer clear of GM and Chrysler

a reply to: OrphanApology

My friend has had a lot of problems with her Ford Forcus as it got older, and she bought it brand new. She's pretty meticulous with maintenance, so having to replace the transmission at 50K, and then get serious work on her engine around 110K was suspect to me.

I HATE HATE HATE GM.

Except for my '71 Firebird 455, '70 Riviera, '76 Trans am (400ci), '69 Tempest Le Mans (400ci), '62 Grand Prix (421ci) and my '05 Grand Prix GXP. Other than that... Oh wait my '86 Olds...

Still, there's a line in the sand post-'79. Most everything they made after that is hot garbage in the sun. I can't say I'm surprised AT ALL about the recalls, I've said for as long as the new Camaro has been out I'm just waiting for them to burst into flames. My father's Malibu is on it's third recall now.

And to the Toyota people... I know quite a few people who worked in the plant in Vermont and... I'll never buy a Toyota or Lexus. Or a Scion but that's unrelated as Scions are just dumb. Hell, my next purchase after cramming an R8 4.2 into an A4 will be a Subaru BRZ because I refuse to have FR-S or Scion badges on the car.

Anyway go Dodge, Honda, Ford, VW, Audi, BMW, Mercedes, SAAB, Fiat.... Whatever. Just stay away from Toyota and GM.

a reply to: ArchPlayer

I guess it depends on the year.

Most of the post 2005 ones I've seen last a pretty long time.

Also the crown victoria's were another line that got excellent usage. Too bad they are discontinued.

originally posted by: ArchPlayer
a reply to: bobs_uruncle

That is real sad what happened with your Firebird. Loved them until the new body style of the mid 90s. Also, it is not uncommon for Pontiacs to have SERIOUS electrical problems. I've helped more than my fair share of friends rewire their Grand Prix's and Bonneville's when their brakes fail - who even thought that was a great idea to begin with to have an electrical system control brakes?

Great bodies but unless you are gonna rebuild it from scratch not worth it IMHO. Love the fact you offered to rent a racing track to prove the defectiveness and they refused to come, ha ha ha. Had that happen with a custom built Ford Taurus I had from the factory for drag racing. Now I will say this for a Ford, when they run they run damn great, but when they hit about 85K (if you are lucky enough to keep it that long) they are either Found On Road Dead or Fix Or Repair Daily.

I hear you re. the Fords and the Pontiacs, my Feiro GT wasn't too bad but I rewired just about everything since I changed motors. My cousin worked at Ford Oakville and used carry on about how great the Mustangs were in the early 70's. I was serious MOPAR at the time and I had a 71 Dodge Challenger, 505CID, hi rise eldebrock, dual 850 holleys with velocity stacks, 512/302 cam, stage iv's, 232 intakes, 187 exhausts in the titanium nailhead valve flavour, anti-pumpup lifters, california crank, carillo carbon fiber rods, 20 pound nitrous cylinder in the trunk, etc., tricked out, 1350hp, ran on acetone and aviation fuel with a quart of 98% nitro propane per tank, I had to change all the seals to nylon and teflon.

It was just scary, I did trials at Cayuga and ran an 8.91 @ 168mph, pretty damn good for a street vehicle LOL. Anyway, the cousin wanted to impress some chick on a date so he asked to borrow my car. I told him feather the accelerator, nothing hard or you'll lose it. Well, he didn't believe me, put foot, car lurched and the front end lifted about a yard and he lost his bladder LOL. It was nasty machine, I snapped off the bucket seat during hard acceleration and eventually I twisted the K frame away from the firewall. Was a shame, but a lot of fun up to that point.

Cheers - Dave

IMO GM cars tend not to be engineered bad. Design, layout, and handling aren't all that terrible. GM also makes some pretty solid engines. The problem is the re-engineering that goes on to save a buck further down the line as cars are altered and made ready for production. Typically after a few years dashboard plastic warps, a gasket blows, seatbelt doesn't retract as it should, factory transmission is weak from the start, etc. These problems are just because the parts are more cheaply sourced and made a lesser quality than what the original blueprints would have called for. Rest of the car holds up very well except where it's obvious that corners were cut. (And if you take the car apart enough you'll sometimes see extra places for fasteners that follow an attachment pattern on the body sheet metal, but oddly omitted from parts being attached.) Also anything recalled tends to stay fixed, as the crap-tastic part is replaced with a slightly more robust version that should have been used the first time around.

Why do I say this. I have a GM car. It's been reliable for the most part. I like it except for the 5% BS problems where it's obvious some beancounter got to make the final decision. A better plastic or an extra or more robust fastener, and my car wouldn't have the problems it's showing.

And this why Honda, BMW, or Toyota gets a better rep even though the GM product should be a better car. Also why they needed the bailout and had to kill off Pontiac. It's suicide by 1000 small cuts that shouldn't be happening. (I like Pontiac and have one, the only other cars now with similar traits are Japanese or Korean. When its time comes, it wont be GM for my next car.)

For most of the time in the company's history, they got away with it. Relentlessly. It's just that this time the penny-pinching resulted in a safety defect. Seriously though. Stop slacking off telling people not to hang anything from the key and replace the d### Chinese igntion switch already with something that actually goes through QA!