Rendlesham Forest…, A Christmas Story from 1980 - Can We ‘Let it Be’?

a reply to: mirageman

You are bringing up the point that sticks in my craw more than anything!

Now.. since there was all this APEN and other trouble around the twin bases,
and due to shyness about mind control technology in the USA right after the
MKultra debacle.. I can *possibly* see that they were using EM/sound
countermeasures on the fence.. i can *just* accept that... and there was
that little blurb about them being concerned about fixing the fence
(can you refresh my recollection on that?)

BUT.

That's really as far as I can stomach the concept of something experimental
being done in close proximity to the base (and mark my meaning here)..
with a purposeful ruckus being intended.. I just don't buy it. The yank
presence on the base was too sensitive... nukes on the base made it too
sensitive.. I just cannot believe they intentionally wanted to turn
that very delicate situation into a 3 ring circus.

what happened HAD TO BE unintentional .. and accident... which is
why... and for many reasons... prone to thinking that something
accidental like a BOL or 10 being inadvertently attracted does
make sense.

I can buy lots of experimental stuff being worked on in the general
region with EM/Radar/THz/Plasma... sure... but for it to spill over
into the region where it did... harder to justify.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Now.. since there was all this APEN and other trouble around the twin bases....

APEN were not involved Kev. They tried to disrupt investigations by ufologists. Concerns would be about IRA terrorism (although they would have been f**** stupid to even dream of attacking an American base). But mainly concerns about Soviet 'bird watching'.

I don't really know what security was on the perimeter fence but it was probably some form of EM detection. I just don't fully accept the drone story as only Penniston ever confirmed he felt he saw a machine. It's possible but then what was going on during subsequent nights. Why only during the night? Did people walking their dogs and getting some fresh air not notice anything. By the absence of any evidence it would suggest they didn't.

a reply to: mirageman

Personally? I don't have any evidence for this position,
but I give it less than 1% probability that there was
a 'craft' of any kind.

I think it was a BOL.

If the Pike book was good for anything.. it presented that
as a powerfully possible possibility.

Kev

PS: I your argument about the multi-night issue logically
precluding a crashed craft/drone/probe is EXCEPTIONALLY
compelling.

That leaves very few other possibilities

Since BOL have been seen for hundreds of years before
the incident and continue to this day.. I find the BOL
explanation exceedingly compelling, especially in
conjunction with your point about multi-night.

Frankly, in my mind I have RFI filed under "solved"
and I just hang out in the thread for the melodrama
between people, and just in case there is some
other development (and my friends post here!).

originally posted by: AdamE
PDF pg11
" Why make-up all this hooey about Biefeld-Brown not working when it does, unless you don't want anyone playing
around with it because it can lead you to more stable radar and optical cloaking?".
Source: www.americanantigravity.com...

Kids build Biefield-Brown ionic wind demonstrators for science fair projects which make for really cool demonstrations which are easy to make.

The question isn't whether it works, the question is, can you make one that can lift its own power supply off the ground too? I've never seen one do that. The science fair project demonstrators have thin wires going down to the power supply which never gets off the ground.

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
It would seem you'd have to have a nuclear reactor on
the plane... which I thought was illegal these days.

Or you'd have to consume a ridiculous amount of the craft's fuel to generate the plasma, making its effective range ridiculously short. Bathing a fast moving craft in plasma would necessarily take a lot of energy to constantly generate that much plasma as you suggest, good catch.

What's much more feasible or at least less demanding on fuel is the technology utilized on the B-2 which electrifies the leading edge of the wings. The reason for that is still classified, but it's suspected to be for either stealth, fuel efficiency or both. Creating an electric potential doesn't necessarily take much energy if the potential isn't applied across any load, and air is a pretty good insulator.

originally posted by: KellyPrettyBear
Personally? I don't have any evidence for this position,
but I give it less than 1% probability that there was
a 'craft' of any kind.

I think it was a BOL.

I thought Ian Ridpath's explanation seemed more or less plausible and I still think it can explain a lot, but the fly in the ointment seems to be this medical records drama, though I think Burrough's lawyer inflated that more than the actual substance by inferring things the US admitted to things they didn't actually admit to. However I also don't assume that there's absolutely nothing to it just because it was overstated. Kit Green certainly seems to think there's something to it and if he is right, I'm not sure how a BOL could account for that.

So the incident seems a little more mysterious to me since the medical records drama came up. If it weren't for that, I'd probably still be thinking there's not much that isn't explained by Ian Ridpath's theory. I suppose there could be a BOL too but what a coincidence it just happened to be in exactly the same direction as the lighthouse and they ended up at the lighthouse when chasing it. On the subsequent night, Halt's description of the light he saw sounds very much like I'd expect the lighthouse light to be described, and there's the 5 second interval on the tape which matches the lighthouse.

But if that's all it was or even if there was a BOL too, why all the fuss over Burrough's medical records?

a reply to: Arbitrageur

I think the lighthouse theory is a complete non-starter, with all due respect.
but i'm not against a completely prosaic explanation. Most UFO/paranormal
stuff turns out to be a prosaic explanation, if you can penetrate all the
deception.

You are correct.. the John Burroughs medical thing changed everything.
You could say that Kit Green put a little bit of "english" on his pool shot..
but whatever he really said, backed off the Va/Government. It might have
had NOTHING to do with exotic radiation damage to JB's heart. OR maybe
there was only a 10% chance of that explanation. But whatever he did
there was enough "meat" there, to add a lot of mystery to this whole thing.

There is at least one dirty little secret here... whatever it is.. that is being
protected.

but maybe (I'd wager) that this whole thing is 100x overblown.. there is
probably one notable/embarrassing secret here.. and a lot of hysteria.

Kev

originally posted by: mirageman
a reply to: AdamE

What I don't get is if this was a drone/secret tech craft being tested in the early hours of Boxing Day is this.

1) What it was doing sitting on the forest floor on night one and then flying off at rapid speed when approached.
2) The next night there was a further incident although the details are sketchy. Which may involve a blue spherical ball of light passing through the vehicle of the female Lieutenant's vehicle.
3) The following night again the Halt Posse are out in the forest having seen strange lights too.

While obviously the USAF were 'guests' of the RAF on base their troops should not have been venturing out onto UK sovereign territory without permission. The first night was reported to UK police and probably comes under 'just cause'. Subsequent nights though seem to be have been decisions taken by USAF Personnel alone.

So what was going on during those two (maybe even 3) further nights? And is there is a link to Kirtland AF base in the USA?

Hi MM. Seems I have some catching up to do after my last post.

1) I suggest the drone possibility on the first night due to:
a) Eastern Radar picking up a target approaching from the coast and disappearing over the forest.
b) The local eye witness accounts of triangular aircraft seen going down into the forest.
c) The reports of the object apparently moving around trees.
d) The object displayed MULTIPLE colours, other than just singular basic, green, or blue, or white, or green, or even the rare colours like purple.
e) These colours were described BEFORE the description of a blast of white light (white plasma are the nasty ones apparently, wanting to attach themselves to metal)

Did a craft set off Nature, or Nature set off effects from the craft?

2) There are natural ones too that may be due to a mixture of frequencies in the area and nature combined so hard to say if it was intentional formation or not. Some may even track above old underground pipes and tunnels becoming a sort of waveguide for the plasmas, so was it following this as the female Lieutenant's vehicle passed?
Or was this a form of "transmission without losses" as below?

3) I think 1) and 2) may cover this question?

This link is a small explanation of "Long-Living Plasma Excited by Electric Discharge in Water".
"Excitation of long-living plasma in the open air is very interesting phenomena due to its physics and also its possible applications in the tasks of energy conservation and a transmission without losses".
ire.kharkov.ua...

As far as I can tell from the numerous accounts, they did get permission due to the nature of the description of a possible downed craft. What if it was a plane carrying something of nuclear origin? Or Soviet, or a secret recon sat? One would consider checking out this possibility due to the nature of any such a scenario, imo.

Kirtland seems to have numerous links imo...
a) The security system BISS was in place. Please see link and 'Orientation'.
b) This BISS system being used at the WSA. (Maybe they also helped fix the fence, among other things?)
c) There were reports of other landings around this time at other bases according to some UFO investigators, though if memory serves me correct, described by a few as 'Alien craft', which I dont think were.
d) The photos and events of Paul Benewitz.
One link being, crafts photographed by PB displaying colours similar to that described on night one over and in the
forest.
The encrypted transmissions he picked up may be similar transmissions being sent to the craft on night one?
A story was concocted about Aliens and an underground base at Dulce and was where they had their own Walmart (my
slight exaggeration) to cover up the true nature of whatever they were up to.
One more thing. Being in possession of an electromagnetic rail gun in 1980 at the height of the cold war, was probably
something else they needed to be kept quiet.

a reply to: Arbitrageur

Hi Arbitrageur.
I see you picked out my link, and I agree, "The question isn't whether it works, the question is, can you make one that can lift its own power supply off the ground too? I've never seen one do that. The science fair project demonstrators have thin wires going down to the power supply which never gets off the ground".

When it comes to things lifting off the ground, and you may have seen it, 'Zero Point: The Story of Mark McCandlish and the Fluxliner' gives some insight into this, and is far more qualified than I to totally dismiss that we have things that could do this.
vimeo.com...

Do you think that the Paul Bennewitz photos are not as described?

What objects were seen or photographed in 1977 Colares? (Another alien/walmart cover up?)

If not, what do you suggest these are? Our tech, or Alien tech or neither?

Also no offence, but Ian Ridpath's explanation is laughable, imo.
www.ianridpath.com...

a reply to: Arbitrageur

An excellent summation.

The B2 wing surface theory was clearly something both suspected by Jane’s Defence but also used to distract Nick Cook, ultimately. He ends up chasing anti gravity and the Nazi Bell.

Consider what happened when Linda Moulten Howe wanted to show the Bennewitz footage on an upcoming HBO show. She got distracted by the Aquarius teletype.

Then look at the Experiencer group. All with a genetic marker and immunological markers. From what I understand chronic inflammation as well.

The point I struggle at is that Chris Bledsoe, who MUFON essentially downplayed a lot in a TV documentary is part of the same group as John.

He shows the same marker.

I think we either discount the validity of the group or we need some sort of wider model to describe these “events”.

The truth behind it might be far smaller than we think but something is there.

a reply to: ctj83

I find the Bledsoe aspect very odd!.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

What do you think the dirty little secret could be Kev? Should there be one.

As Chris Bledsoe is mentioned..

Hypnosis followed by the polygraph. see link (wrong order if being used, imo. Could lead to false readings)

"Facts that he could not recall had caused him confusion, and extremely bad headaches" also sounds like something Adrian Bustinza describes in a radio interview.

"To this end, they employed the services of Debbie Gioia, a Psychiatric Social Worker".

Did any of the RFI witnesses have a 'Psychiatric Social Worker' looking after them?

The case also bares some similarities to the Allagash incident.
Are these gentlemen also part of this group of the Experiencer group, as mentioned by ctj83?

I still say, to this day, It would be good to hear Adrian again.

I agree with ctj83. Something is there.

Quote sources - www.ufocasebook.com...

a reply to: AdamE

Supposedly there is a leaked tape of an experiencer group session according to Grant Cameron. I’ve never heard it.

a reply to: AdamE

Hi Adam,

Here's where there are problems with the drone/craft landing whatever you want to call it.

a) Eastern Radar picking up a target approaching from the coast and disappearing over the forest.

I have heard some of the personnel involved in the incident who say that Eastern Radar (also Heathrow Tower) picked up something on radar on Christmas night/early Boxing Day morning. But as far as I know there are no official records that actually confirm this.

b) The local eye witness accounts of triangular aircraft seen going down into the forest.

I've summarized the local witness accounts here : www.abovetopsecret.com...

Only Gary Collins reported a 'triangular' craft and he couldn't even verify exactly what night that was. The other descriptions do not fit such a description. So the 'triangular' craft theory relies on Jim Penniston's description and a guy who can't actually confirm what night his sighting was.

I would say that if this was a court of law there is not enough proof beyond reasonable doubt that something was tracked on radar and it was a triangular object.

a reply to: ctj83

According to Grant Cameron.....

a reply to: Baablacksheep

Apparently it’s freely available on the web.

I share your scepticism.

What are your thought on Georgina Bruni and Mr Mummy by the way?

a reply to: Baablacksheep

I hate being this boring..

but the history of UFOlogy clearly demonstrates, that the government ONLY
gets up in arms when a UFOlogist, or regular people get close to a boring,
non-exotic, non-ufo, non-paranormal "inconvenient truth".

A great example is the Bennewitz affair..

en.wikipedia.org...

If I recall correctly, the transmissions he was intercepting that he thought
were being made by aliens, were in fact classified transmissions from
the local military base.

So the story goes, the government pushed Paul into insanity and death
by feeding into his paranoid delusions.

I find it likely that whatever happened at RFI had a very mundane,
but security sensitive secret..

so it has been covered up with all the drugs, hypnosis, and intimidation
and all the other usual techniques.

I'd also like to add, that any total BS theories like time travel or binary
codes.. are the result of "experiencer syndrome"... a mild form of
mental illness, that many of us have.. (I have it too.. but I"ve nearly
got it cured/worked around).

a reply to: ctj83

Apparently it’s freely available on the web.

Do you have a link for it CTj83?

What are your thought on Georgina Bruni and Mr Mummy by the way?

Do you enjoy Indiana Jones LOL? I have been aware of the story for a long time. Bob Brier aka Mr Mummy appeared some time ago. One of the places he decided to visit was a UFO site, Ian Ridpath am sure will recall it all well. Sadly Mr Mummy did not last too long there and suddenly vanished after he was met with a few feisty ones. I believe Osborn had been contacted by him as well as Jim. What the reality to all of that story is I don't know, its all pretty wild and I don't think Bob Brier has ever confirmed any of the claims made about this Mummy in Africa and so on, am not overly familiar with that stuff. Of course this does not mean to say its not true, but it would be interesting to hear from the man himself about all of that and how he connects it all to the Rendlesham story. He sure caused a rumpus at the time. Perhaps Jim and Gary will be including all of that in their book? I suppose it all fits the Egyptian theme too?

Well the late Georgina Bruni certainly had interesting interests , there is no telling where all of that stuff fit into the grand scheme of things?

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Hi Kev, but people don't like boring. Humans like excitement, dazzle and the mysterious.

I understand some of your thoughts of course, but I suspect there is probably a lot more to come with the RFI.

I just hope its no temple of doom stuff .

a reply to: Baablacksheep

The witnesses that were there, are either dead now, or their brains
have been shaked n' baked, by either radiation/chemicals/hypnosis,
etc.

Sorry --- the chance that we will take this any further than Andrew
Pike did.. seems extremely remote. We should be thankful that
the RFI incident is close to solved... but I think we won't get
any closer.

Deathbed confessions are always fake.. so don't count on that
happening.

Kev

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Deathbed confessions are always fake.. so don't count on that

LOL. I cant imagine that Kevin that wont happen.