Measles Cases Triple in U.S., Vaccine Refusal Here and Elsewhere to Blame

Pardon?

Rubinstein, sorry, Hiddencode

You left the other thread as you and the "proof" you were posting were constantly being rebutted as all you could cling to was the "it's a conspiracy!!!" gambit.
And all you could do was lie constantly.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I left the other thread because if the proof fell from the sky with a big neon sign above it saying "the indisputable proof" and landed on your head, you would still refute it.

As for the rubincode theory, I actually think you are correct on that count.
That became apparent in this thread, when hiddencode repeated exactly what rubinstein said in the other thread.

hiddencode
This doctor is one of the world's top vaccine experts, she's spent an incredible amount of time studying vaccines, here she goes through them one by one and evaluates the risk against the benefit; it's one of the most informative and important videos you can watch

Also, if you still want to selectively vaccinate and draw up a safer vaccine schedule, this website is recommended by doctors for exactly that purpose. While I'm against all vaccines in the first world, I understand that some people will still one a couple. Always remember if you do vaccinate to avoid Tylenol (Paracetamol) as studies show that not only does it stop the vaccine from working, but it also brings the risk of Autism when combined with vaccines. (source: University of California). Whereas the people who didn't take anything or took Ibuprofen did not go Autistic after MMR.

www.smartvax.com...

Since you've deliberately lied in your previous post what's to stop you lying in this one?

Answer: Nothing.

1st lie: Sherri Tenpenny is not an expert on vaccines. It's debatable that she is still actually a doctor as, according to her old website, she stopped practising recognised medicine quite a few years ago.
She's not a virologist, immunologist or any ologist for that matter and has not published any significant research on vaccines nor vaccination.
She's only an expert in her own mind.

2nd lie: Doctor's recommend smartvax.com
No. No they really don't.
it's a thinly veiled (but nice and shiny) anti-vax site.

3rd lie: You're not for vaccines anywhere. You're vehemently against them as proven by your lies.

4th lie: If taken just prior to the jab itself, Tylenol can in very rare cases reduce the effect of the MMR. It doesn't stop it working though.
There are studies linking acetaminophen (Tylenol) with autism (and studies NOT linking it). These are completely independent of having MMR or any other vaccines before, during or after acetaminophen.


I'm guessing the "study" you're referring to from the U of Ca was this one as this is the only one I can find?
aut.sagepub.com...

This was an on-line survey of parents performed in 2009 and it's conclusions exonerated the vaccine and specified that the Tylenol needed to be studies further.

I've even got a link from an alternative site which states this.
www.altmedrev.com...


Whether there is a link between acetaminophen and autism is still up in the air but as can be seen from what you have posted, there's no link to it from MMR.

OneManArmy

Pardon?

Rubinstein, sorry, Hiddencode

You left the other thread as you and the "proof" you were posting were constantly being rebutted as all you could cling to was the "it's a conspiracy!!!" gambit.
And all you could do was lie constantly.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I left the other thread because if the proof fell from the sky with a big neon sign above it saying "the indisputable proof" and landed on your head, you would still refute it.

As for the rubincode theory, I actually think you are correct on that count.
That became apparent in this thread, when hiddencode repeated exactly what rubinstein said in the other thread.

edit on 201312America/Chicago12am12amMon, 09 Dec 2013 08:18:16 -06001213 by OneManArmy because: (no reason given)

Well post this "indisputable proof" then and we'll take it from there.
As you or no-one else have posted any in the other thread.

Let's put out the welcome mat !!!
Come on in small pox. Welcome back polio. Long time no see.
People protect your children from these potentially fatal diseases. We had them beat here.
Do we really want to invite them back in????

reply to post by Tucket


Prolly yeah they probably are.

Pardon?


1st lie: Sherri Tenpenny is not an expert on vaccines. It's debatable that she is still actually a doctor as, according to her old website, she stopped practising recognised medicine quite a few years ago.
She's not a virologist, immunologist or any ologist for that matter and has not published any significant research on vaccines nor vaccination.
She's only an expert in her own mind.

Dr. Tenpenny is a graduate of the University of Toledo in Toledo, Ohio. She received her medical training at Kirksville College of Osteopathic Medicine in Kirksville, Missouri. Dr. Tenpenny was board certified in Emergency Medicine through 2005 and has been board certified in Osteopathic Manipulative Medicine since 1995.

Prior to her career in integrative medicine, Dr. Tenpenny served as director of the Emergency Department at Blanchard Valley Regional Hospital Center in Findlay, Ohio, from 1987 to 1995. In 1994, she and a partner opened OsteoMed, a medical practice in Findlay limited to the specialty of osteopathic manipulative medicine.

In 1996, Dr. Tenpenny moved to Strongsville, Ohio, and founded Tenpenny Integrative Medical Center (formerly OsteoMed II), expanding her practice and her vision of combining the best of conventional and alternative medicine. In 2004, the medical practice moved to Middleburg Heights, Ohio where the clinic currently resides. TIMC is proud to report that patients from 39 states and 11 countries have come to the clinic to get well.

Source - Huffington Post

She may not be an expert on vaccines, but she is certainly more qualified than both you and I in presenting scientific medical research.
Instead of attacking the claims of the video, you attack her credentials. Typical "shill type" tactics.
YOU are not qualiifed to attack her credentials, she has been a practicing medic, unlike you or I. And she hasnt been struck off.
Attack the message not the messenger please.

reply to post by Pinkorchid


That was due to doctors caring for the children and the availability of over the counter medicines for fevers. Not a decline in the deadlines of the disease.
When we got the measles the doctor came to our house and his advice was to put the other kids in bed with the sick one so we could get it over with all at once.
I remember seeing kids I had gone to school with become unable to walk due to polio. Not any more because of the vaccine.

Pardon?

OneManArmy

Pardon?

Rubinstein, sorry, Hiddencode

You left the other thread as you and the "proof" you were posting were constantly being rebutted as all you could cling to was the "it's a conspiracy!!!" gambit.
And all you could do was lie constantly.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I left the other thread because if the proof fell from the sky with a big neon sign above it saying "the indisputable proof" and landed on your head, you would still refute it.

As for the rubincode theory, I actually think you are correct on that count.
That became apparent in this thread, when hiddencode repeated exactly what rubinstein said in the other thread.

edit on 201312America/Chicago12am12amMon, 09 Dec 2013 08:18:16 -06001213 by OneManArmy because: (no reason given)

Well post this "indisputable proof" then and we'll take it from there.
As you or no-one else have posted any in the other thread.

I proved that the "scaremongering" was a reality.
I proved that the mortality of measles has nothing to do with vaccination.
I didnt need to prove that pharma is about profit and not about health, I really dont think I need to, its plain as day.
I proved the government collusion with GSK to deliberately harm people in the UK because their version of the vaccine was "cheaper".

And here you are saying I proved nothing. Shame on you.

reply to post by watchitburn


Vaccines are not killing us. This is the mentality that spreads fear and disease. Exactly as this story shows.

OneManArmy

Pardon?

OneManArmy

Pardon?

Rubinstein, sorry, Hiddencode

You left the other thread as you and the "proof" you were posting were constantly being rebutted as all you could cling to was the "it's a conspiracy!!!" gambit.
And all you could do was lie constantly.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I left the other thread because if the proof fell from the sky with a big neon sign above it saying "the indisputable proof" and landed on your head, you would still refute it.

As for the rubincode theory, I actually think you are correct on that count.
That became apparent in this thread, when hiddencode repeated exactly what rubinstein said in the other thread.

edit on 201312America/Chicago12am12amMon, 09 Dec 2013 08:18:16 -06001213 by OneManArmy because: (no reason given)

Well post this "indisputable proof" then and we'll take it from there.
As you or no-one else have posted any in the other thread.

I proved that the "scaremongering" was a reality.
I proved that the mortality of measles has nothing to do with vaccination.
I didnt need to prove that pharma is about profit and not about health, I really dont think I need to, its plain as day.
I proved the government collusion with GSK to deliberately harm people in the UK because their version of the vaccine was "cheaper".

And here you are saying I proved nothing. Shame on you.

1. Since there has been no scaremongering per se then you cannot have proven anything.
2. Whilst you showed that the mortality fell with better treatment and sanitation etc which I agreed with you failed to acknowledge the rise in incidence in Japan when they stopped the MMR and the 88 deaths that ensued. What you've failed to mention here is the incidence of measles, which only fell after the vaccine was released.
3. I agreed with you on the pharma money bit but I disagreed on the health bit. Again, no proof.
4. I really don't remember you doing anything of the sort.

I stick with what I said.

reply to post by Pinkorchid


All you need to do is watch TV for half an hour to know that ALL drugs carry some risks and that none are 100% safe for 100% of the population. Underlying circumstances makes it impossible for drugs to be 100% safe for everyone so this point is moot. The truth is vaccines save lives everyday.

reply to post by golemina


Really poor argument.

AutumnWitch657
reply to post by watchitburn

 

Vaccines are not killing us. This is the mentality that spreads fear and disease. Exactly as this story shows.

They do kill some people, and injure more. To say they dont is a lie.
It becomes a matter of balance of odds. And the "greater good". It also involves people doing their own research to weigh up the odds for themselves so they can make an informed choice, without having to ignorantly rely on the opinion of a so called "expert". Absorb all the information possible and make a free choice. Nothing more, nothing less.

174 people contracting measles in a country of 317,208,000 people is less than a one in a million chance of contracting the disease, then there is the 1/1500 to 1/5000 chance of death from the disease.
Im not a gambling man, but basic maths tells me that to fear 174 incidents of measles with those odds, and the "fear mongering" is TOTALLY UNJUSTIFIED.

Tell me Im wrong.

OneManArmy

Pardon?


1st lie: Sherri Tenpenny is not an expert on vaccines. It's debatable that she is still actually a doctor as, according to her old website, she stopped practising recognised medicine quite a few years ago.
She's not a virologist, immunologist or any ologist for that matter and has not published any significant research on vaccines nor vaccination.
She's only an expert in her own mind.

Dr. Tenpenny is a graduate of the University of Toledo in Toledo, Ohio. She received her medical training at Kirksville College of Osteopathic Medicine in Kirksville, Missouri. Dr. Tenpenny was board certified in Emergency Medicine through 2005 and has been board certified in Osteopathic Manipulative Medicine since 1995.

Prior to her career in integrative medicine, Dr. Tenpenny served as director of the Emergency Department at Blanchard Valley Regional Hospital Center in Findlay, Ohio, from 1987 to 1995. In 1994, she and a partner opened OsteoMed, a medical practice in Findlay limited to the specialty of osteopathic manipulative medicine.

In 1996, Dr. Tenpenny moved to Strongsville, Ohio, and founded Tenpenny Integrative Medical Center (formerly OsteoMed II), expanding her practice and her vision of combining the best of conventional and alternative medicine. In 2004, the medical practice moved to Middleburg Heights, Ohio where the clinic currently resides. TIMC is proud to report that patients from 39 states and 11 countries have come to the clinic to get well.

Source - Huffington Post

She may not be an expert on vaccines, but she is certainly more qualified than both you and I in presenting scientific medical research.
Instead of attacking the claims of the video, you attack her credentials. Typical "shill type" tactics.
YOU are not qualiifed to attack her credentials, she has been a practicing medic, unlike you or I. And she hasnt been struck off.
Attack the message not the messenger please.

She really isn't more qualified.
And it's not her "research" but that's besides the point. She's never published anything of note.
Read my post, I was debating Hiddencode calling her a "worldwide expert on vaccines" which indeed she is not.

And I've refuted the majority of her claims in the other thread.

reply to post by golemina


SIDS is not a disease and no one ever said t was. It's a syndrome. Ann kids do die in their cribs from no known cause. I hope you never loose a child due to this.

OneManArmy

AutumnWitch657
reply to post by watchitburn

 

Vaccines are not killing us. This is the mentality that spreads fear and disease. Exactly as this story shows.

They do kill some people, and injure more. To say they dont is a lie.
It becomes a matter of balance of odds. And the "greater good". It also involves people doing their own research to weigh up the odds for themselves so they can make an informed choice, without having to ignorantly rely on the opinion of a so called "expert". Absorb all the information possible and make a free choice. Nothing more, nothing less.

174 people contracting measles in a country of 317,208,000 people is less than a one in 4 million chance of contracting the disease, then there is the 1/1500 to 1/5000 chance of death from the disease.
Im not a gambling man, but basic maths tells me that to fear 174 incidents of measles with those odds, and the "fear mongering" is TOTALLY UNJUSTIFIED.

Tell me Im wrong.

You're wrong.

Why do you think that figure's so low? Natural immunity?
Have a look at the incidence rates pre-vaccine.
See if the figures are the same as now.

reply to post by golemina


SIDS is not caused by vaccines. Such a stupid thing to say. You know your kids won't get into school without vaccines don't you? Are you prepared to home school them? Not from what I've read so far.

reply to post by rickymouse


The vaccine contains live virus and sometimes a very very mild case of the disease occurs after the vaccine. My youngest got the rash after the rubella vaccine. He did not have a full blown case of rubella. And I would never consider not vaccinating. Never. I love my children.


Yes I am suggesting that if you don't vaccinate you don't love your children. It's the same as those religious nuts who don't take their children to doctors when they are really sick, depending instead on prayer to heal them. Then they cry when their babies are DEAD.


Now I am leaving this thread because I am getting really pissed off.

It's important to understand about the fake/poor quality studies which are used to supposedly prove that the MMR vaccine is actually safe.

anh-europe.org...

"The official line: "Vaccine-autism link disproved"....

The frequently-repeated assertion at the heart of autism-denial is that research has proved that there is no link between vaccines and autism. Much of the time this refers back to one paper by a Danish group in 2003—a group with a vested interest, working as they did for the state-run vaccine industry. The paper considered children diagnosed with autism between 1971 and 2000; thimerosal was removed from vaccines in Denmark in 1992, and the paper argued that because they found that autism cases continued to rise after that date, thimerosal could not have been a causative factor. But regressive autism typically manifests in the second year of life, but is not diagnosed for some years; 75% of affected children in Denmark are thought to be diagnosed and reported between the ages of 5 and 19 years, so the reporting rate would not be expected to fall significantly in the 8 years from the removal of thimerosal to the end of the study.

This is not the most glaring problem in the study, however; that would be the fact that the authors moved the goalposts from 1995 onwards by including children diagnosed as out-patients; prior to that date only in-patients were included. Naturally, out-patients made up the vast majority—93% of all cases in the analysis, guaranteeing a rise in numbers whatever the mechanism.

The next favourite paper is by Andrews, Miller and others in the UK in 2004 [ii]; again there are questions about both the ethical probity and the methodological soundness of the study. Ethical questions arose because the two main authors worked for the Health Protection Agency—so they were partly responsible for the vaccination policy which they were reviewing—and because they did not declare in the paper that they had received money from several vaccine manufacturers; multiple conflicts of interest in fact. The methodological issues included inadequacies in the UK General Practitioner Research database on which the study was based, and the fact that the authors, despite their affilliations, even got the dose of thimerosal wrong, throwing out their calculations. This came to light subsequently, but the study has never been withdrawn, and continues to be cited as valid.

Since then there have been a number of other studies claiming to demonstrate that there is no vaccine-autism link. Most of them have been reviews of other studies (which allows media to quote them as “new research shows that….” when it is nothing of the sort), but the latest is a study from Italy [iii] which is actual, not warmed-over research. The paper, by Dr Alberto Tozzi, has been publicized as demonstrating yet again that thimerosal does not contribute to autism or neurodevelopmental problems. But guess what; it also turns out to have ethical and methodological issues. The ethical one is that the author does not declare any conflict of interest, despite having received grants in the past from Wyeth, GlaxoSmithKline and from Novartis — all major vaccine manufacturers. The methodological one is that there was no real control group; the study compared subjects who had received two different doses of thimerosal in a whooping-cough vaccine in 1992-3. The authors themselves have admitted that “comparing children with no exposure to thimerosal could have improved the study”, which didn’t prevent it being hyped as further proof of the safety of thimerosal. The other curiousity about the study is that in 1700 students they found only one case of autism; hardly a useful group to compare to primary school children in the UK or USA, where the same number would have more than 20 cases. There may be good reasons why Italian children are different to American ones — chiefly to do with their exposure to other toxins such as pesticides [iv]."