On Choosing Your Sexuality

Yeah, I know....sick of the gay threads almost as much as GZ threads. But something I want to share with you as an epiphany as it regards choosing your sexuality.

The debate about sexuality runs the gamut from its morality, to why people engage in various practices. As it regards morality, nothing can really be determined due to the wholly subjective nature of what morality is. We each develop our own views based on our own experiences and choices. Essentially, morality is "What Would I Do", as you then judge everyone else based on that standard (people will rarely admit to their own evils, choosing instead of rationalize them).

But much has been said about whether or not someone chooses to be gay. I see it on these boards all the time, usually from some random poster with very few posts to their names. But not always.

I think something important is overlooked in that debate, however: that we tend to believe others capable of the same things we are. It is what I stated above: the world is judged by your own standard, determined by your own experiences and your own context.

As a heterosexual male, I do not see homosexuality as a choice. Sex is a performance issue with men, and I just would not be able to perform. It would be like an anti-arousal for me. So homosexual sex is not a choice for me, personally, as I am physically incapable of it. This life's experience has made me believe that homosexuality is something you are born with, or at the very least have ingrained on you psychologically. It is a state that is part and parcel to your being, as you typically cannot control what arouses you (i am not denying the psychological impacts of learned behaviors and associations....but that is part of what makes you who you are, so there is no need to deny it).

So what of people who believe that it is a choice? What, in their own personal contexts, would make them believe that people can choose to be aroused by the same sex? It would never occur to me that someone might be able to control what arouses them without extensive psychological training. Nor would it occur to me that one could choose whether or not the same sex is arousing.

I think you see where this is going.....and it is absolutely not a slur on anyone (being gay is not an insult). However, I would suspect that many who claim that homosexuality is a choice, when faced with this quandry, would react quite aggressively.

And to be honest, I understand that. For someone who campaigns about the moral depravity of the homosexual, as well as the choice that homosexuals make because of this depravity....admitting that your own homosexual feelings provide the life's experience and context for your beliefs would be very difficult. But because you are able to wrestle your own demons and abstain from homosexual expression, you expect others to do the same. To live up to your own moral achievement.

Just like the guy who loses 200lbs, and then calls everyone "fat". I mean hey, if he can do it, why can't everyone else?

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


S&F

I had a friend a while back that I knew from grade school... Back then he wasn't my friend, only an acquaintance... I remember even as far back as grade three this guy was different then the rest of the guys in my class... School is always cliquey so pardon my crude terms here...

As far as the guys went, there were the sports kids, the game kids who meshed a bit... the geeks/nerds... and few outcast groups...

Then there was this one kid... he didn't hang out with any other guys... he played with the girls, and all of the girls loved this kid... At this point I didn't even like girls... I didn't know what sex was, let alone sexual preference... All of us just thought he was weird... many of the "alpha's" made fun of him on the regular... but no one actually bullied him... in fact Most of the guys were afraid of him... even the geeks took their turn picking on this kid... and he didn't care... he just smiled and went about his business

Years later I ended up working with this guy and became good friends... He Is one of the nicest guys I've ever met... I didn't figure out he was gay until years later... but I asked him if how long he's know about this "gay thing"... I said he's always known...

People are born gay, they don't choose it... and many don't figure it out until late in their lives... or are just afraid to accept who they are....

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


Very well-said. I believe that those who claim that homosexuality is a "choice" and/or can be "cured" are ignorant, misinformed, and lack the proper research and education on the subject.

I believe sexual orientation is part natural, part environment. Which part effects it more than others, most likely the natural part, but I can't actually argue against the cases where some people did end up having messed up sexual identities because of experiences they had as children.

Small number of cases in comparison though I would think.

In any case, a person has no control over the chemicals that are produced in their own brains that lead to attraction, any more than they can control the color of their skin. Sure you can 'choose' to not act upon those urges and feelings, the same way you could 'choose' to bleach your skin.

It would be disingenuous, idiotic and really an exercise in allowing other people to dictate your own happiness.

You can disagree all you'd like and you can argue and debate with me until we are blue in the face. What you can't do is treat people like you are better than them. Morally or spiritually, it doesn't matter, because at the end of the day, even your almighty religion teaches you that the only entity that can judge a person in this life is the creator themselves.

S&F

~Tenth

reply to post by Akragon


I knew my oldest was gay when he was 3. "Knew" may be too absolute....i had very strong suspicions. He played more like a girl, naturally, than a boy. My youngest....now he played like a boy.

He knew he was gay from forever. He said that looking back, he has always felt more feminine. Since puberty he was attracted to only males, not females at all. LOL, someone once described him as "very gay". I don't think I would dispute that.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


Excellent post...I appreciate your humble style and made you a friend.

I'll be a bit more audacious and state that sexuality is not a choice. As you state,
one is either born with their preference intact or has it ingrained on their psyche at
some later point.

The question I always ask of heterosexuals who vehemently believe that sexuality
is chosen is this....At what point did you make your decision?

Personally I am repulsed by the thought of sex within my gender and I can only
imagine that someone gay is equally as repulsed by the though of a heterosexual
encounter.

And at the end of the day, does someone's hetero or homosexual preference really
matter at all?

Almost every gay man ive ever asked has said they have always known, but the same is not true for most gay women ive asked. In fact i would say only 20% of women i talked to said they always knew.

strange.

reply to post by rival

Excellent post...I appreciate your humble style and made you a friend.

I don't know why I didn't do that long ago...

following suit...

reply to post by rival


No, your orientation doesn't matter (unless you are a potential mate).

I have told both my sons repeatedly, "What you are is irrelevant, who you are is what matters."

My oldest...for obvious reasons. But my youngest, he gets that speech for entirely different reasons. One day he came home talking about a girl at school who was a slut. I asked him what he meant, and he explained she got around. I then pointed out to him, "Why do you care what she does with her crotch? Do you lay claim to it?" He didn't know what to say, so just stared at me. "Remember, whether she is a slut or not does not matter. That is what she is, not who she is. And that word is a nasty label used judgementally. Often inaccurately."

Gay. Baseball player. White. Black. Mason. Chinese. Short. Attractive. These things are all examples of what you can be. But they will never be who you are.

Retikx
Almost every gay man ive ever asked has said they have always known, but the same is not true for most gay women ive asked. In fact i would say only 20% of women i talked to said they always knew.

strange.

Because men cannot perform, physically.

I know a lady who went to women after a string of horrible men burned her. She had a few female relationships, but is back with a guy. To her, it was more about what they could provide outside of bed that attracted her, or so she said.

Men and women are different. It is hard for you to consider just as it is for me. And just as it is for someone who has repressed homosexual urges to understand how homosexuality is not a choice.

Well said Mr Texan. And to support your argument, I'll share a little of my own story....

I can remember growing up as a young boy in a good catholic family on a farm in a very 'wholesome' part of our country that I always felt a little different. At the age when little boys don't like girls because they 'have girl germs' I was making friends with them. I didn't really like a lot of the rough and tumble games the boys played' although I partake in anything that involved running and hiding like hide and seek, bullrush etc.

I was always one of, if not the brightest kid in my class and I got on with everyone. As I grew older I began to become more and more aware of the fact I was different from most other boys. Not being sexually aware, I didn't have a clue what that difference was, I just knew that I did not really fit in with all the other boys in class.

Even when I hit puberty I was still in the dark. I developed before everyone else and my first feelings of sexual attraction were toward a boy in my class. To this day (I'm 40 now) I have hand on heart honestly never felt the slightest bit aroused by a female despite having some very close emotional friendships with a number of very lovely girls and more than one of them wanting to take things further.

So in my case my sexuality was not chosen, it was always 'just there' and it is certainly not from lack of opportunity with the fairer sex as some of my my female friends would have made wonderful wives.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


Life experiences make some of the toughest social issues very simple.

You most likely wouldn't be able to share your insight with us had you not gone through the experience with your son.

I appreciate your OP very much! Thank you.

_BoneZ_
reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

 

Very well-said. I believe that those who claim that homosexuality is a "choice" and/or can be "cured" are ignorant, misinformed, and lack the proper research and education on the subject.

Or they're making a choice to refuse that part of themselves.

Perhaps it is a chjoice for them to go against their own sexual urges and therefore they assume it's the same for others.

All I know is when I look at a woman.. I know I'm a bloke.

Anyone who says homosexuality is a choice, and can see the pain and suffering that alleged choice has caused so many people, is an idiot, to be honest.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

Without a doubt, that is THE MOST IMPRESSIVE post that I have yet to read, here at ATS. YOU nailed it, and I couldn't agree more.

Though we are, indeed, the product of our life's experiences, the keys to our perception of those experiences are the differing personalities that we were all born with. That applies to much, much, more than just one's sexuality.

Would you mind if I, also, add you to my friends list. Being the OLD TROLL that I am, I feel it's best to get permission first.

See ya buddy,
Milt

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


I am straight as a laser beam. You are right. The thought of sex with a male is off putting to me in a big way.

I watched once as a man died from aids over a period of time. His mate was with him until the end and the pure love that they shared made me envious. It was the type of love that love sonnets are made for. It made Romeo and Juliet seem like a kiddies play. Love knows no bounds.

While it is not for me, I would never try and change what is good for others.

We should celebrate our differences rather than denounce them.

It seems that it is always the right ring religious zealots that denounce what they refuse to understand.

P

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


The shortest and easiest explanation I think there is is the following...

People become sexual and start to feel, their sexuality towards others at some point.
This happens to everyone and isn't a personal choice, but more like a natural system, that triggers this and all of a sudden, we start to feel what we feel.

We fall in love with men or woman, without ever even thinking about it.... it's overwhelming us in all sorts of emotional and sexual way. We can only follow what our feelings say, and go with them if we want to feel good and happy.

So if that's when we feel the same sex is what will make us feel happy then, it just is...
We can only act on what we chose for ourselves... Become happy, or deny our feelings and feel bad about it.

reply to post by BenReclused


The friends list thing....sure. I haven't really had time to figure out how to leverage it to my benefit....but I have noticed that quite a few others have.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

I haven't really had time to figure out how to leverage it to my benefit...

Well... To your benefit... I'm not likely to troll those that are on my friends list, unless they really, really, deserve it.

See ya buddy,
Milt

I always notice these threads and the most prominent thing I think of is how irrelevant choice is to the rights of people in same sex relationships.

I've had a few conversations with straight people who think gays choose their orientation and my response is always "and if they did choose it, that is THEIR business."...

If some man chooses to be with another adult male it is no ones business but his and that other man. If they want to enter into a legal contract(marriage) it is their business and nobody else's. The reason why people are in same sex relationships is irrelevant to every argument for same-sex rights.

For me I think males are generally not attractive. I am considered a "lesbian" by the traditional labeling of society. If I was single and got asked out by a guy that looked like this guy I would probably say yes however.


www.demeterclarc.com...



When did I realize I was attracted to women? When I hit puberty and had my first crush. I like the way women look. I like their bodies. I like the gender programming they receive that males lose out on.

Either way though, regardless of MY reasons to who I like and have sex with...if I choose someone with the same genitalia I should have the same protections as rights as anyone else who chooses a mate.