I think I know What Chemtrails are... and it's worse than you can imagine!

applesthateatpeople

Zaphod58
reply to post by applesthateatpeople

 

You're right, we need to start mass arrests now of people who fly. There were only 643 million people that flew in the US in 2011, so let's get right on it. That'll put a stop to those pesky contrails.

Or maybe we can go back to how it was in the 40s and 50s, and only the 1% can afford to fly, screw everyone else.

Funny, considering there aren't that many people in the US.

And if everyone flies twice on average, and a lot of foreigners fly into the USA??

And, the fact remains: people who fly are trusting their LIVES to a corporation.

Seems pretty stupid to me.

Yes...you do.

Zaphod58
reply to post by Korg Trinity

 

I'm well aware of how dynamic the environment is, and how hard it is to model. I'm also well aware, far more than most, of how contrails are formed, why planes fly the way they do and how hard it would be for planes to carry enough to effect the environment in any useful way.

Really... as you clearly know so much... please tell me the chemical they are using to create the chemtrails... what is it's effective density in ppm....

Once I have this data I would tell you the mass of said chemical and therefore we could deduce whether your supposition is correct.

Korg.

In the three days after 9/11 all commercial flights in the US were grounded. That situation provided scientists with the opportunity to test the effects of commercial flights on surface temperatures. During that three day period, they discovered that surface temps increased and concluded that contrails from jets did in fact cause "global dimming".

David Travis of the University of Wisconsin-Whitewater and two colleagues measured the difference, over those three contrail-free days, between the highest daytime temperature and the lowest nighttime temperature across the continental U.S. They compared those data with the average range in day-night temperatures for the period 1971-2000, again across the contiguous 48 states. Travis's team discovered that from roughly midday September 11 to midday September 14, the days had become warmer and the nights cooler, with the overall range greater by about two degrees Fahrenheit.

NOVA: The Contrail Effect
By Peter Tyson


Other studies have been done to confirm the conclusions.

I think the OP may have it right....

Now that the US government has shut down, we should watch the skies to see if the "chemtrails" diminish or stay the same.

If nothing else, it would show whether the government has anything to do with it or we are just imagining the whole scenario.

Right here in SC, right now at 10:47 am, the skies are the most beautiful blue I have ever seen.

NightFlight
Now that the US government has shut down, we should watch the skies to see if the "chemtrails" diminish or stay the same.

If nothing else, it would show whether the government has anything to do with it or we are just imagining the whole scenario.

Right here in SC, right now at 10:47 am, the skies are the most beautiful blue I have ever seen.

I doubt it... this obviously would be a black project off the General Ledger...

But who knows it may be affected... Let's watch.

Korg.

reply to post by Korg Trinity


Too bad they aren't real or we could have that discussion.

reply to post by Blarneystoner


Three days isn't nearly enough sample though. Even the scientists admit that it only APPEARS to have that effect. The the days after were also remarkably clear. They would need to ground the flights for several days, several times a year to know for certain if that data was a result of no contrails, or just the weather being better than usual.

Zaphod58
reply to post by Blarneystoner

 

Three days isn't nearly enough sample though. Even the scientists admit that it only APPEARS to have that effect. The the days after were also remarkably clear. They would need to ground the flights for several days, several times a year to know for certain if that data was a result of no contrails, or just the weather being better than usual.

Isn't it strange how there was a ban on all air traffic and the sky was remarkably clear??

Also the average temperature was worked out over the same three days from an average going back as far as the 70's...

You may not like what the data suggests... but you can't deny cold hard data.

Korg.

reply to post by Korg Trinity


It's interesting yes, but I'm not going to base an entire premise on a tiny sample of data. Now if it had been two weeks, or had happened more than once then you could say contrails have that effect. But three days is a blip. An interesting one, but just a blip.

Zaphod58
reply to post by Korg Trinity

 

It's interesting yes, but I'm not going to base an entire premise on a tiny sample of data.

Neither am I... A single piece of circumstantial evidence is not enough to convict... however if there is a wealth of evidence however circumstantial that all points to same conclusion... then one must always pay strict attention to even the most circumstantial.

Though I have to say that I don't think the three days of data following 911 is circumstantial... I think it is, if anything... a bloody big WHITE ELEPHANT!

Korg.

Korg Trinity

AndyMayhew

Korg Trinity

AndyMayhew

Korg Trinity

Chemtrails look like Chemtrails under ALL conditions...

But they don't!

They only appear visible when contrails would also be expected to be visible and only persist when contrails would also be expected to persist.

If that was true... then the video I posted there should not have been any chemtrail at all...

Korg.

Why?

What was the altutude of the aircraft and what did the atmospheric soundings indicate?

Now, I say that if chemtrails were being sprayed we wouldn't see them - especially if they were done for clandestine reasons. After all, why make it patently obvious? There are an awful of weather geeks (like me) around the world watching the skies every day who would soon notice if contrails occurred when they shouldn't.

Aha I see what you are saying..

The reason they are visible is that their purpose is to create a global dimming effect, this can easily be achieved through the formation of cloud cover...

But not high level clouds - which have the opposite effect. They cause warming.

Therefore, if what people claim to be chemtrails are being created as part of a geoengineering policy, then the aim must be to cause very slight (probably not significant) warming.

If you want to cause global dimming, try sulphur particles (which aren't visible in the atmosphere). Although of course, that does increase acid rain ..... the reason we cut them in the first place.

mrthumpy

Korg Trinity

Aloysius the Gaul

Poison the well much?

Stating that contrails cannot last longer than a few minutes defies almost 100 years of known contrail characteristics (the first persistent contrails were reported before eth end of WW1!)

Pointing out that the supposed evidence does nothing to show that these trails are anything othe than contrails is just pointing out the truth.

resorting to baseless assertions, poisoning the well and personal attacks as you have just done is the resort of people who know they do not actually have any real evidence.

No you totally misunderstand me.

I have not ever throughout this thread stated that contrails cannot at some times look exactly the same as chemtrails..

What I stated is that Chemtrails exist where contrails could not exist.

and as for poisoning the well.... if there are fools who would drink the water before testing it... let them die!

Korg.

You've yet to show why contrails can't exist in those locations. Look at those papers on ISSRs again.

If Korg was even remotely interested in the truth, it could be proven at least to him very quickly. Use flight aware to identify planes leaving trails in an area that he decides cannot possibly support contrails. Once you have the tail number, start the investigation. If it's a commercial passenger flight, He is flat out wrong, if it's a sooper secret military flight, find out where it's going.

Korg Trinity

Isn't it strange how there was a ban on all air traffic and the sky was remarkably clear??

no - not at all - aircraft cause contrails that can expand into cirrus cloud, so fewer contrails and subsequent clouds from them was entirely logical.

Also the average temperature was worked out over the same three days from an average going back as far as the 70's...

there was no change in the average temperature during the ban on flights - what there was was a change in the diurnal temperature range - the difference between het coldest part of the night and the hottest part of the day - that increased.

"We show that there was an anomalous increase in the average diurnal temperature range for the period Sept. 11-14, 2001," the researchers reported in today's (Aug. 8) issue of the journal Nature. "Because persisting contrails can reduce the transfer of both incoming solar and outgoing infrared radiation and so reduce the daily temperature range, we attribute at least a portion of this anomaly to the absence of contrails."

The diurnal temperature range is the difference between the nighttime low temperature and the daytime high temperature, usually for a given day.

- Science daily

And it was entirely possible that it had nothing at all to do with the lack of contrails as outlined in some of the links in this article where it is noted that even the author of the initial paper says the link to contrails is a hypothesis - not a firm conclusion.

You may not like what the data suggests... but you can't deny cold hard data.

right back at you - not just with this but all the other thousands of data sources that debunk the chemtrail myth.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


You're also an adherent, and protector/guard of the official story surrounding the 9/11 event am I right?

reply to post by Zaphod58


There were other studies as well. They are outlined in the link I provided.

it only makes sense. If there are light reflecting particulates in the atmosphere, not as much sunlight reaches the ground.

..and hasn't Germany and Sweden admitted to weather mod using chemtrails?

m.youtube.com...

This has already been announced by a former vice president of the USA. The debate is over!


www.theguardian.com...

It is because they love you.

reply to post by Blarneystoner


There have been studies that show they cause warning too though. You can find studies for both sides when it comes to contrails.

No they haven't admitted to that. The video that said they did was a deliberate misinterpretation. They were talking about the militaries use of chaff, and the claim was they said chemtrails

NewAgeMan
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

 

You're also an adherent, and protector/guard of the official story surrounding the 9/11 event am I right?

No.

reply to post by dIS3MBoW3MeNt

This has already been announced by a former vice president of the USA. The debate is over!

Your right, but he didn't.

Plus it has been shown to be a hoax...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Interesting analysis.

Perhaps the "chemtrails" are trying to promote global dimming, or at least trying to counteract global warming, if global warming is in fact happening. it's hard to tell if it really is or not. Too many people say it is happening, and too many are saying it isn't, I get tired of trying to keep track.

But i guess that's a possibility. In another post, someone posted pictures of rainbows that have been appearing in the sky. They weren't typical rainbows though. They were around a mass of clouds (usually) which isn't surprising since you need moisture in order to have a rainbow. I'll post the link below this paragraph so you can get a idea of what I'm talking about.

Maybe if people are cloud seeding with these "chemtrails" these strange rainbows are a result of it. I've been hearing people witnessing these kind of rainbows more often then they used to be. So perhaps this is a effect of cloud seeding. It would kind of make sense given the right substance to be seeded in a cloud. It may be more prone to create the prism like array of colors you typically see in rainbows.

www.abovetopsecret.com...[/url]

As far as why they would keep it secret, I'd say it's because they don't want to panic people. If you go out and tell people our planet is getting to hot and we have to take actions to prevent it, people may get nervous. Which is why the government usually hides things from us, either because their guilty of something, or they think us simpletons won't be able to handle the truth.

But I'm just throwing out a suggestion. I'm not saying I believe it, or it is fact. Simply just trying to piece one and two together, since I have been seeing similar posts lately.