Obama: 'Breakthrough' is possible on Syria

Dianec
"get rid of weapons and we will back off" - good you noticed. Hope others see through that as well. They aren't very good at acting anymore are they?

Not since Clinton.

Wookiep
reply to post by seabag

 

No offense but I don't understand where the "conspiracy theory" in this is.. It's known that the rebels have been assisted in Syria since at least 2011. (leaked)

The conspiracy theory I was referring to was when he said:

They will find a way to have their war.

I tend to agree this administration is hell bent on going to war despite the LACK of evidence that Assad's regime is behind the chemical weapon attack.

Might be a glitch, anyway google it I guess.

(laugh out loud) gonna take a while to get used to this new board haha.

I agree..and I miss the old emoticons. I want to roll my eye and LOL on some posts but it just doesn't have the same effect now! I guess this will work > LMAO!

Liquesence
reply to post by xuenchen

 

Yeah, because Russia became the new diplomats, while the US remains the military aggressor.

How to save face from this one, when you're shown to be the international bully and your "foe" is diplomatically de-escalating the situation?

edit on 9-9-2013 by Liquesence because: (no reason given)

You can save face by doing what you were appointed to do, politics.

I have been saying a while now that the best move for Syria as a whole is to deploy diplomacy, it is in a way good news that Obama has decided to at least look at a diplomatic solution. After-all isn't the job of a politician or a diplomat to find resolution with words and not arms?

East work with the west, west work with the east.

If and that is a big IF some kind of deal is set up where an international consortium can "control" these chemical weapons in Syria then we have one step in moving towards acquiring some peace in Syria. Safe zones where chemical weapons are or are being transported means nobody fighting each other (secure area before you move weapons).

I don't know maybe characters are just buying time, but I feel diplomacy is having a possible desired effect.

Poor old Obama, drinking his own cool-aide. Sorry "Mr." President, I don't believe anything you say. The only solution in my opinion to the Syria issue is to let them work it out on their own.

Assad never used chemical warfare, if someone did, it was without his approval. Should we blame you Obama for all the cops killing innocent civilians here in the States? :: Rolls eyes ::

He still mainains the lie that assad is killing his own people

What?
I didn't realize that some here have achieved full "Assad isn't killing civilians" mode!

You seriously believe that??

-even those calling for the rebels to be destroyed know that Assad has killed civilians throughout the war.

????

Mr. Assad, is that you? Welcome (i guess) to ATS)

reply to post by canucks555


LMAO! Good point!

The reality is that if Obama and his ilk have evidence, as they emphatically suggest, WHERE IS IT??? Is he going to show us Tuesday?

reply to post by seabag

I am not saying that Putin is doing this for the sake of the international community. However when it comes to geopolitics, this is a high stakes poker game. Do you honestly think that Putin and Iran would just simply sit by and do nothing if the USA were to launch missiles at Syria? No, in this case Putin is actually putting up, instead of walking away, seeing that the USA is ignoring the UN. Funny how the UN was suppose to be the exact place that was suppose to prevent this kind of action, and yet Obama is ignoring the security council in this case. It is bad for the country and world. What I would say if anything Putin, is trying to put a new PR spin on the world stage for his country, showing how they are for peace and the USA is more for war. And so far it is working.

seabag
reply to post by canucks555

 

LMAO! Good point!

The reality is that if Obama and his ilk have evidence, as they emphatically suggest, WHERE IS IT??? Is he going to show us Tuesday?

As i have stated from the beginning, they have no evidence, nothing, which is why everything is "classified." As you say, if they have, just show it. They don't, so they can't.

And at this point and so late in the game, who would even believe the supposed "evidence?" I'm sure a lot of people would, but to me and many others here, whatever is presented this late is likely fabricated.

Will I believe any "evidence" the administration presents? Helllll no.

So there'll have to be more than just "evidence."

They'll have to REALLY sell it like there's no tomorrow.

reply to post by sdcigarpig

I am not saying that Putin is doing this for the sake of the international community. However when it comes to geopolitics, this is a high stakes poker game. Do you honestly think that Putin and Iran would just simply sit by and do nothing if the USA were to launch missiles at Syria? No, in this case Putin is actually putting up, instead of walking away, seeing that the USA is ignoring the UN. Funny how the UN was suppose to be the exact place that was suppose to prevent this kind of action, and yet Obama is ignoring the security council in this case. It is bad for the country and world. What I would say if anything Putin, is trying to put a new PR spin on the world stage for his country, showing how they are for peace and the USA is more for war. And so far it is working.

That’s one way to look at it.

I just happen to think that Putin is “putting up” against the west every chance he gets, not just in this instance. It just so happens Putin has the moral high ground in this instance. That doesn’t change the fact that he’s going to pull extra hard for his boys in Tehran and Damascus, which is why I view THIS move as suspect.

seabag
reply to post by sdcigarpig

 

I am not saying that Putin is doing this for the sake of the international community. However when it comes to geopolitics, this is a high stakes poker game. Do you honestly think that Putin and Iran would just simply sit by and do nothing if the USA were to launch missiles at Syria? No, in this case Putin is actually putting up, instead of walking away, seeing that the USA is ignoring the UN. Funny how the UN was suppose to be the exact place that was suppose to prevent this kind of action, and yet Obama is ignoring the security council in this case. It is bad for the country and world. What I would say if anything Putin, is trying to put a new PR spin on the world stage for his country, showing how they are for peace and the USA is more for war. And so far it is working.

That’s one way to look at it.

I just happen to think that Putin is “putting up” against the west every chance he gets, not just in this instance. It just so happens Putin has the moral high ground in this instance. That doesn’t change the fact that he’s going to pull extra hard for his boys in Tehran and Damascus, which is why I view THIS move as suspect.

Putin would never do it for the "international" community, only for Mother Russia.
This would not be the first time they've been active pacifists. Look at North Korea.

edit- And I mean after WWII, not recently.

canucks555
He still mainains the lie that assad is killing his own people

What?
I didn't realize that some here have achieved full "Assad isn't killing civilians" mode!

You seriously believe that??

-even those calling for the rebels to be destroyed know that Assad has killed civilians throughout the war.

????

Mr. Assad, is that you? Welcome (i guess) to ATS)

Of course the Syrian government has killed some of it's own people. There is a war going on in Syria, remember?
I don't think it is good but I think having the country over run by rebels is insane and what's even worse is to think that the elite are behind to plot a major war. The reason this war is lingering is because there is no way Assad could be hitting civilian areas as hard as he could. If he was hitting the rebels with full gusto, I think there would be much more damage...and yes, I know there is already a lot and some of that blame can certainly be taken by rebels. My point is that he is not directing his full fire power at them, imo... because he does not really want to kill innocent people, just rid the country of this malicious so called rebel movement and hold whats left of the country together.

I have no way to prove that, you are free to disagree but that is what I believe.

...and not saying it's right to kill ANYONE, but this "his own people" crap is getting old. What? So it's much better to go to some other country and kill people of other nations and it's not quite as murderous? That makes no sense, not to mention that since many of these people are coming from across the border, it's not like they were trapped there or really had a dog in that fight to begin with... because they are trying to so called liberate a country they are not even a citizen of, which is an insane theory to try to promote.

As for killing your own people.. same can be said of the United States.

So it's gets really old hearing that schtick roll out of a politician's mouth again and again.

reply to post by abecedarian


Putin is doing this so his contract for the natural gas project isn't ruined. I'm sure there's more but that seems the most logical. Israel has been pretty quiet in all of this. I am getting mixed messages from them but am going with what they've said in the link I put below. Sadly, I think they would have preferred we attack so they could also get Iran out of the way but thus far are saying that while they don't trust Syria they are happy to see all weapons go. The Free Syrian army is saying they have no idea where they all are (massive amounts well hidden), and think it's a stall tactic.

I have a feeling something will blow up over there before this is over. I believe Putin wants it all to settle down (to be just barely above the radar if at all), but a big part of that is too much intervention threatens lucrative trade and new contracts. The status quo (pre 8/21) was working for Putin - could have intervened sooner. How is Assad's eventual departure or Al Qaeda taking over going to change his own plans. I'm sure he is planning to keep Syria armed well. Also, Assad isn't being compliant just because he is out of options. Russia has appeased him, reassured him in some way.

Don't mean to sound so suspicious. Just exploring how all the puzzle pieces fit. Because they don't share hidden agendas we are left to guess and that means sometimes going way off into left field.

www.ynetnews.com...

they can only be accountable for their own known stockpiles. They cannot account for any that have been brought into the country. The west has to understand this and they need to make it clear that they fully suspect other stockpiles to show up if rebels in their country are bringing them in... this might as well be laid out on the table right now.

He can't use them without serious repercussion, so why keep them? Why stall?

The UN should help set guidelines for how long it should take so that it will be an international "norm" and Russia should help oversee the removal since Assad obviously trusts them to a degree because if I was in the regime, I certainly wouldn't want US in there handling it.

They cannot be allowed to pull a "ALL OF THEM...NOW" and then later "FOUND SOME MORE OVER HERE....YOU LIED... BOOM" type of thing.

Everyone is going to be suspecting the next terror plot until all out war breaks out or the rebels give up.

sdcigarpig
Being a student of history, one could say the following:

Take the offer and don't be stupid. Russia, does not make offers or solutions that often. And the last time it did, it was on the brink of war with the USA. So we should consider their offer and take it, let them work out the details and if it happens again, we can then point to their failure to prevent the use of a chemical weapons.

This is exactly what I said when all this first started.

Let someone else deal with an internation situation for once, because it will be THEM who is judged on how they handle it-much like we have been in the past. America lacks FACTS on the intelligence aspect of Syria in which other countries might actually already know. Let THEM deal with it. If they do- we cant be seen as the
country responsible.

Obama would be smart to take the deal. Lets see if he is.

Has this letter been debunked? www.bnp.org.uk... df
Typos and all?
I know nothing about that website nor the one that I saw it on.

reply to post by NotAnAspie


I don't know why they are thinking he's stalling. Good point you make. Maybe they don't trust he cares about an attack or wouldn't want to go out with a bang? They naturally don't trust so would also like to hear their justification for thinking Assad is stalling.

reply to post by Dianec


This article makes some sense out of the whole thing.

First, some background on the player.

Qatar has proven reserves of oil and natural gas.[10] Qatar tops the list of the world's richest countries by Forbes.[10] Qatar has the highest human development in the Arab World.[11] In 2009, Qatar was the United States’ fifth-largest export market in the Middle East (after the UAE, Israel, Saudi Arabia and Egypt).

Qatar

then read this;

Russia does not want the proposed Quatar gas pipeline to Europe, where they export most of their gas. So they have supported the Assad military dictatorship, their client and puppet, who has blocked it on their behalf - until Assad agreed to the Iranian pipeline to Europe. That’s when his troubles began - with Quatar and their Sunni auxiliaries in the Syrian uprising.

Civil war broke out shortly after the Assad regime signed on for the Iran, Iraq, Syria, Turkey route, cutting Quatar out and elevating Iran. The Syrian rebels were subsequently bankrolled by Quatar. Once Assad is gone, Quatar will get its pipeline to Europe. Mission accomplished. The same way that US troops died to get Exxon the northern Iraqi oil concession.

Syria’s Pipeline War: “Operation Gas Pains”

And here's some background on Russia's vested interests;


All the 'chaos' in Syria is to Russia's advantage.

Assume the gas pipeline deal between Iran-Iraq-Syria is the issue in the window.

Now focus on an energy company in Russia called Gazprom

Open Joint Stock Company Gazprom (Открытое Акционерное Общество «Газпром», OAO Gazprom Russian: ОАО «Газпром», IPA: [ɡɐsˈprom]) is the largest extractor of natural gas and one of the largest companies in the world. ....................

Gazprom's activities accounted for 8% of Russia's gross domestic product in 2011.

The company possesses subsidiaries in many various industry sectors, including finance, media and aviation. In addition, it controls a majority of stakes in various companies.

Delaying and stalling the Syria pipelines is to Russia's advantage.

Gazprom supplies much of Europe's gas.

The Syrian pipeline is competition.

There's trillions of dollars involved.

and just look at Gazprom's vested interests worldwide..

They even have an Israeli connection (N.T.V. Global Network (Israel) Ltd.)

And surprise !! They're big in the U.K. of all places !!

Gazprom UK Ltd (100%)- investment company
Gazprom Marketing and Trading Limited (GM&T) (100%) - energy trading
HydroWingas (25%) - gas trading
Interconnector (UK) Limited (10%) - operator of the Interconnector pipeline
Sibur International (100%) - petrochemicals
WINGAS Storage UK Ltd. (33%) - underground gas storage reconstruction[4]

Gazprom's stock trades on the London Stock Exchange too !!

And the U.S. OTC: GZPFY

Russian energy company Gazprom has several hundred subsidiaries and affiliated companies owned and controlled directly or indirectly. The subsidiaries and affiliated companies are listed by countries. The list is incomplete.

List of Gazprom subsidiaries

SOME of he 'Western' powers that be (including Saudi Arabia) *hate* it because it doesn't use the U.S. Dollar.


Gazprom website

starfoxxx
Assad should give up who ever let that chemical weapon attack happen without his consent. They should be given over to the international court, even if it is his brother.. Be stern with them, no need to start dropping bombs.. Lets hope Obama the destroyer doesn't let his hubris and arrogance get in the way.
Obama is trying to act like he has a pair, but everyone can see the king has no clothes.. Obama is in over his head and the people around him are drowning in their own failure.

I like to believe posters are real people not paid propaganda agents. But some posters really make me wonder. I have noticed you are pushing the idea that Assad should give up whoever did this. You have posted similar statements in other threads.


Maybe I am just paranoid and looking for patterns. I bet that is it.

reply to post by xuenchen


Oil and money. It makes me nauseated to think of how many lives have been lost because of their greed. They can't be human. Murdering innocent children to further their agenda is beyond comprehension. Their very presence pleading in desperation for our approval in the media makes me have terribly disturbing thoughts about them. They make me recoil in disgust. Everything has been a lie.