U.S. Army Instructor: Beware Religious Extremism of Evangelicals, Roman Catholics

reply to post by Res Ipsa


Just this morning I watched on alternet.org a program they have just launched in which two Evangelical leaders (one of whom is the spiritual advisor to Obama and is an aging white guy from Florida, and the other a black man 4th-generation "Pentecostal" from California who's in the 30-ish age range). It was interesting to listen to them speak to the issues at hand, but it was difficult to make myself watch it --

I did watch it, and it became clear that even the Evangelical community is deeply divided. So, it's the extremists that the Army trainer is talking about - who are definitely prone to violence and are dangerous.

So the guy has taken list from another website, which listed some Christian groups because they preach hate against gays, and work against all people having the same rights under the law.

reply to post by R_Clark


yup. it is.


its not a target practice list, its a list to watch out for them ^^ same as nazi, skin heads, kkk, and anyone else that has EXTREME views like a JIHAD or a HOLY ROMAN WAR. OR KILLING YOUR DAUGHTER BECAUSE YOU THINK SHE ISNT A VIRGIN ANYMORE....

religion is #$%^ed, they shouldd all be watched CLOSELY..

did you really think the answer was going to be no? lol

Originally posted by ~widowmaker~
reply to post by R_Clark

 

yup. it is.


its not a target practice list, its a list to watch out for them ^^ same as nazi, skin heads, kkk, and anyone else that has EXTREME views like a JIHAD or a HOLY ROMAN WAR. OR KILLING YOUR DAUGHTER BECAUSE YOU THINK SHE ISNT A VIRGIN ANYMORE....

religion is #$%^ed, they shouldd all be watched CLOSELY..

did you really think the answer was going to be no? lol

(sing the following sentence using that one song from Sesame Street)
"One of these things are not like the other, one of these things don't belong"
Do you see which?
Why yes little Jimmy, it IS the Holy Roman War......why? Because it is ancient history while all the other things are current extreme views. This person has a problem with Catholics and decided to sneak them into this loathsome group.

reply to post by Res Ipsa


You ever hear of Ireland? I dont think Catholic violence is as old school as you think ! Hell, vetran scum from the Irish kerfuffle train terrorists everywhere else in the bloody world, and have done for years! From both sides of the battle mind you, Im not going to be partisan or discriminatory here. Irelands battles have all been between loyalist and seperatist, protestant and catholic, and both sides made money by farming out thier experts as trainers for foriegn terrorist groups.

Get some realistic perspective here !

Originally posted by TrueBrit
reply to post by Res Ipsa

 

You ever hear of Ireland? I dont think Catholic violence is as old school as you think ! Hell, vetran scum from the Irish kerfuffle train terrorists everywhere else in the bloody world, and have done for years! From both sides of the battle mind you, Im not going to be partisan or discriminatory here. Irelands battles have all been between loyalist and seperatist, protestant and catholic, and both sides made money by farming out thier experts as trainers for foriegn terrorist groups.

Get some realistic perspective here !

The Holy Roman War is ancient..........Are you really trying to equate the localized violence in Ireland as representative of Catholic doctrine?

Any chance you are still pissed about the results of our conflict in 1776?

Once again, hum the Seasme Street song.......one of these things la laaaa la la laaaaa la.
This time it is "Doctrine" Your groups all have "Doctrine" in common....except for the Catholics. No doctrine to wage war or engage in violence.

care to revise your perspective?

reply to post by Res Ipsa


First of all, the events that happened in the seventeen hundreds are of course ancient history, and I for one have no problem with the way things worked out back then.

However, I do not see a reason to revise my perspective. Any religion with a structure, with a clergy, with a leadership and a political methodology attatched to it, could have been accused and can be accused now, of having sects and organisations within it, which act outside the law to further the interests of that religion. Any powerhouse with funding that reaches into the billions in world wide total is the same way.

Big oil has people they employ to get their dirty work done, big pharma has, the Roman Catholic Church do, and I have no doubt what so ever that there is an anglican organisation out there which functions as a paramilitary outfit when required.

So no. I have no reason to revise my thinking. It dosent matter a damn wether the violence inherant in a situation is caused by the written word of a deity, or by the weakness and heresy of an individual in vestments deliberately misinforming his followers, allowing them to falsely believe in absolution for sins committed in war. The results are the important thing, and they are the same no matter how you spell the name of your God. War, blood, humanity chewing away at the rotten stump of its own genitalia, like a rabid dog with an itch. These are the results, and they are all that matter.

Dogma, wording, they are all so much window dressing for the territorial phallus waving match that is the work of the lesser beings among mankind. I am not refering to those who are sent to war, or even those who choose to go. I am refering to the cancerous little bits of dried pus that send them to fight. Truth is, if religion werent used as an excuse, then something else would be. But it is bloody convienient that it happens to be such a good , such an easy reason to use.

I say this as a Chrisitan, who believes deeply in an afterlife, who believes deeply in the power of God Almighty, Jesus Christ, my saviour, and the fearsome will of the Holy Spirit... religion, more than any other political or sociological construct, has been used to excuse more bloodletting, more rape, more torture and ill omened action on this planet than any thing else. Burning of witches, the mentally ill being treated as if they were possessed by demonic forces, and summarily executed (which still happens today), the thousands upon thousands of children molested by men of the cloth, sexual deviancy committed from behind robes of station and import. Wether the Bible agrees with these things or not, is not important. What is important is that they happen, and they happen because mankind has people within it who lie, dissemble, and cheat people into believing that a given behavior can be excused for any reason.

It doesnt matter how many buildings fall in one nation. Killing hundreds of thousands of civillians in another will never be justified. It doesnt matter how many hundreds of thousands of civillians die in a nation, because blowing people up with a car bomb will not solve anything, and is just as much an action born of stupidity and lies as the action that lead to hundreds of thousands of pointless, needless, unjustifiable murders.

Its all a cluster copulation, born of mans bloody minded willingness to throw ones lot in with a group of powerful sociopaths in the hope that when the crap really hits the fan, your house isnt the one getting covered in manure.

So, there SHOULD be a damn careful look had at all the religions that might try to influence a soldier, just as there should be at all political parties for which that man might vote, by whom he might be influenced in the execution of his duties. Because you know what? Anyone with even the merest little bit of power, could be the next one that tries to take the world by storm, and that needs nipping in the bud, no matter which holy sign he prays beneath.

That was a ton of obfuscation and didn't address the point, the "Doctrine" issue.

Nazi, KKK, Jihads, Skinheads, Catholics.

What they have in common is that they are; 1) groups of people 2) can be found anywhere in the world
3) eat breakfast 4) watch tv. etc...I could rattle off 100 more things they have in common.
But the point was, one of those groups do not have a "doctrine" of hate or intolerance.
That is the only important point. Not the individual members. The Doctrine.

If you want to narrow it down to one person then go ahead, but that should be the leader of the group, in
this case it is Pope Francis. How about picking the leader of every single group you can think of, including political leaders, and see how the Pope stacks up......Don't need another history lesson since in this case it is not predictive. Society advances, slowly, with bumps and bruises, and set backs, but it advances. Meaning don't expect another Holy Roman War. Don't expect the U.S. to hang Indians or give them blankets filled with plague. or a return to black and white only bathrooms or the return of slavery...

Your view of mankind lacks perspective because you are viewing it through mass media, social media, and instant global viewing of everything that is going on.....if we had all of this information going back decade by decade you would think that today, right now, is the height of man's glory and achievement.

reply to post by Res Ipsa


Ok, first of all, lets get something straight. Every single group, club, organisation and association on Earth has a doctrine, from the newest street gang, to the oldest religion. One cannot live a life in the developed world without absorbing someone elses BS ideas of how to live a life, what constitutes freedom, what is right, what is wrong. Therefore the entire question of doctrine is moot. Its all over the place, and unavoidable unless you fall out of the womb with all the maturity of an adult, and the comprehension to match.

Second, with regard to your assumption that veiwed differently, the world as it is today could be seen as the pinnacle of human endevour, I have to say that is perhaps the most willfully ignorant thing I have ever heard. Sure, the dark ages were a piece of crap in some respects, but at least the enemies of freedom had the good grace to show up with a sword and dare you to act. These days all oppressors do is issue paperwork, hide behind massive mountains of legalese that no one really understands, not even the professionals who work in law. They become faceless and difficult to strike back at.

If you give me a straight up choice between having an enemy who wishes me dead by violence, or an enemy who wishes to make my very existence a crime, wishes to crush my spirit and flounce around in an expensive suit sucking at the teat of affluence, then I would choose the enemy who wishes me dead by violence. There is a clear and utterly uncomplicated set of reactions one can reasonably have to that stimulus.

I find it strange that you claim that it is not the way the world is, but our ability to see the harm being done in real time, with the internet and a better connected mass media which causes me to have the world view I have. Yes, I am better informed than a person of my social standing might have been five hundred years in the past. Does that mean that I should be less outraged by the way of the world? Does being better informed merely mean that I should dial down my indignation to account for the increase in my awareness that comes with that? Of course it does not. What would the point of all this communication be, if an increase in awareness did not come with an increase of righteous fury? The world is SICK, and getting sicker every day. The only difference is the skin the evil in it wears, and the way it moves amongst the population.

More data means that ones world veiw widens, as it should, that ones awareness of what is happening around them increases, as it should. It is NOT a bad thing that we have more of it than our ancestors did.

My point is the Catholic "Doctrine" isn't remotely similar to the other groups doctrines you lumped together with the Catholics......you never did watch Sesame Street did you? How did you miss the point so badly?

The fact that we can view the whole world makes it easier to address injustices since we are aware of them and see them streaming live. It makes the world 'APPEAR" like it is worse than it was historically. But it obviously is not.

We have reached an impasse regarding anything approaching more than banging my head against my desk.

reply to post by TrueBrit

Its all a cluster copulation, born of mans bloody minded willingness to throw ones lot in with a group of powerful sociopaths in the hope that when the crap really hits the fan, your house isnt the one getting covered in manure.

So, there SHOULD be a damn careful look had at all the religions that might try to influence a soldier, just as there should be at all political parties for which that man might vote, by whom he might be influenced in the execution of his duties. Because you know what? Anyone with even the merest little bit of power, could be the next one that tries to take the world by storm, and that needs nipping in the bud, no matter which holy sign he prays beneath.

I'm so glad you wrote this.
I agree with you entirely.