Adam Lanza did not use an assault rifle, hand guns only.

reply to post by ParanoidAmerican


Thank you.

Originally posted by CthulhuMythos

Originally posted by Grimpachi
The only question that needs to be asked is why some of you feel the need to turn this tragedy into a false flag, conspiracy, or whatever it is you are trying to prove.

This was a horrific tragedy carried out by a screwed up 20 something year old. I just hope the families of the victims never see the crap you are pushing. News reporters are not infallible they never have been. I find the efforts of those who are trying to make this a conspiracy disgusting those of you doing this should be ashamed of yourselves.

I don't think it is so much a need to turn this tragedy into a false flag or conspiracy, but more a need know what really happened in the face of so many anomalies and unanswered questions, when we see that things are not adding up. It is only then, when the questions do not get answered and lead only to more questions, that the 'need to know' starts to unveil a cover-up, which then may reveal a conspiracy and perhaps finally become a scandal if/when the truth is outed.

What I see, is the ATS 'collective' doing more detective work than the authorities are doing over this case (and other cases too). Yes, in the confusion reporters can make a mistake, but this is not just small mistakes on the number of injured or killed, or spelling someone's name wrongly. This is serious mistakes, like quoting from the school Principal after the shooting (the local news paper knew the Principal very well, so how could they mistake someone else as the Principal?) and then changing their page about 4 times on the same article, with the later 'time stamp or numerical stamp' not being the version where the statement was removed. Also it is not just the local news paper that is getting things wrong, it is lots of news feeds. So either ALL the news crews are totally inept and so we have to ask how many other mistakes do they make on a daily basis that goes unnoticed or something is really amiss here.

Regarding the parents, if it was my child, I would not be satisfied until I knew EXACTLY what went down especially in the face of what looks like some sort of cover-up, in which case I would want justice from ALL those involved.

You and many here are making the mistake of thinking you are doing investigative work which you are not. Yes news sources make mistakes an overwhelming amount of mistakes and they are not part of any investigation. Stating that by finding flaws in what news teams have reported is proof of anything other than proving how much news team’s suck is idiotic. The parents have a right to the absolute truth but you and I do not. We are not entitled to any of it. I am sure the parents have inside information as they should because it was there family not ours. ATS is not doing an investigation of any type the people here are starting with preconceived notions and then finding clips to fit their ideas. It is sick to be honest. I haven’t run across a single thread in years where ATS has uncovered or solved a single case and it won’t start today. If you think different you are only fooling yourself. This is one of many threads where someone has tried to imply this to be something other than what it is and it is sick.

I can guarantee the family of these children do not want nor care for a group of conspiracy theorists who can’t even find there town on the map to be delving into this event especially when those people can’t tell the difference between evidence and screwed up news report. It is idiotic.

What I see, is the ATS 'collective' doing more detective work than the authorities are doing over this case

This sentence right here would be funny if it wasn’t so sick. You think your investigative internet skills are so important. You aren’t doing anything stop fooling yourselves. What you all are doing is anything but detective work. This sentence is nothing but self-important BS.

reply to post by Grimpachi

Yes news sources make mistakes an overwhelming amount of mistakes and they are not part of any investigation. Stating that by finding flaws in what news teams have reported is proof of anything other than proving how much news team’s suck is idiotic.

It's not ONLY the news sources that have represented false facts here, it is the authorities in charge of the investigation that have done so. You need only look to the chief medical examiners statements to verify this, among many, many other details. Get that part right guy.

Your assertion that investigative work can not be done from piecing together what are supposed to be official statements and undeniably seeing that there are conflicting and false statements are absurd. I am very sorry for the families that have lost loved ones over this tragedy and it is heinous but lets be honest, innocent women and children die horrible deaths every day all over the world, some in large part because of dubious drone strikes and military action that our government is involved in. You can not let emotional guilt get in the way of the truth my friend.

I bet that poor border patrol agents family would have been horrified to hear all of the conspiracy theorists ideas about what happened to her son as well, that is until it was shown to be a huge government scandal full of lies directly designed to erode our second amendment rights and that as it turned out, was exposed for the greater good of our country.

Obviously fast and furious didn't work and can not be denied and then the question becomes....... Do you really think it stops there and they just give up the agenda?

reply to post by Helious


I have read all the threads dealing with this shooting including the one of the medical examiner and it hasn’t proven one damn thing. I have read several threads started where people say they weren’t crying enough or in the case of the medical examiner he didn’t act the way people wanted. The answer is NO an overwhelming NO. You people are not investigating anything but what you are doing is sick and despicable. There is something wrong with some of you very, very wrong.

reply to post by harry1sg

Once thru the locked entry doors one usually also has to enable a buzzer to open secure doors to the classroom hallways....maybe that is what he meant (if not, then it is confusing).

*sigh*

Hartford Courant Article about Bushmaster Jamming - Sunday Dec 23 2012

Seems that NBC may be the wrong one here... Or our local papers don't know what they are talking about..

I'm not sure if anyone's brought this up, but it will be interesting to see the ballistics reports. They will verify which handgun/ rifle was used, and if the ballistics matches the guns Lanza used. It will also help determine the possibility of other shooters. I'm curious now if we'll hear the results.

Originally posted by Grimpachi

Originally posted by CthulhuMythos
I don't think it is so much a need to turn this tragedy into a false flag or conspiracy, but more a need know what really happened in the face of so many anomalies and unanswered questions, when we see that things are not adding up. It is only then, when the questions do not get answered and lead only to more questions, that the 'need to know' starts to unveil a cover-up, which then may reveal a conspiracy and perhaps finally become a scandal if/when the truth is outed.

What I see, is the ATS 'collective' doing more detective work than the authorities are doing over this case (and other cases too). Yes, in the confusion reporters can make a mistake, but this is not just small mistakes on the number of injured or killed, or spelling someone's name wrongly. This is serious mistakes, like quoting from the school Principal after the shooting (the local news paper knew the Principal very well, so how could they mistake someone else as the Principal?) and then changing their page about 4 times on the same article, with the later 'time stamp or numerical stamp' not being the version where the statement was removed. Also it is not just the local news paper that is getting things wrong, it is lots of news feeds. So either ALL the news crews are totally inept and so we have to ask how many other mistakes do they make on a daily basis that goes unnoticed or something is really amiss here.

Regarding the parents, if it was my child, I would not be satisfied until I knew EXACTLY what went down especially in the face of what looks like some sort of cover-up, in which case I would want justice from ALL those involved.

You and many here are making the mistake of thinking you are doing investigative work which you are not. Yes news sources make mistakes an overwhelming amount of mistakes and they are not part of any investigation. Stating that by finding flaws in what news teams have reported is proof of anything other than proving how much news team’s suck is idiotic. The parents have a right to the absolute truth but you and I do not. We are not entitled to any of it. I am sure the parents have inside information as they should because it was there family not ours. ATS is not doing an investigation of any type the people here are starting with preconceived notions and then finding clips to fit their ideas. It is sick to be honest. I haven’t run across a single thread in years where ATS has uncovered or solved a single case and it won’t start today. If you think different you are only fooling yourself. This is one of many threads where someone has tried to imply this to be something other than what it is and it is sick.

I can guarantee the family of these children do not want nor care for a group of conspiracy theorists who can’t even find there town on the map to be delving into this event especially when those people can’t tell the difference between evidence and screwed up news report. It is idiotic.

What I see, is the ATS 'collective' doing more detective work than the authorities are doing over this case

This sentence right here would be funny if it wasn’t so sick. You think your investigative internet skills are so important. You aren’t doing anything stop fooling yourselves. What you all are doing is anything but detective work. This sentence is nothing but self-important BS.

I did not say that I was doing investigative work, I am not that good, but ATS as a group are doing a lot of 'finding out what happened' .
Have you read the thread about Christopher Rodia? see the index/summary page Here
This information is new to me, did you know about the bullet riddled car? Or the car that was supposedly the shooters but was really registered to Chris Rodia?

Unlike you suggest, I do not have any 'self importance', and do not claim to have investigative skills. However, I do see a lot of other people caring enough about what is really going on to take a lot of their time to really look at what is reported, how it is reported, how those reports have changed and what is significant and yet goes almost unreported.

You do not know what these parents would or would not want. But I know what I would want as a parent, and I said that in the last post. I would want ALL the anomalies answered and judgement on all those involved.

Regarding whether only the parents have the right to the absolute truth, I disagree. We ALL have the right to absolute truth, especially when an incident like this is used unashamedly by the law makers to change laws which affects the whole country and furthers agendas of the current government.

reply to post by CthulhuMythos


You just made a statement about how ATS is doing a better job investigating and now you say you didn’t.

Your second statement is much better your all doing a whole bunch of finding out. Well that’s great go do some finding out whatever that means.

I think some of you can’t understand the difference between a news report and an official statement. The investigation is being conducted by those living in that area and as you should know there hasn’t been an official report given on the matter so when threads like this one come up making innuendos feeding the conspiracy nutcases based off a freaking news report and nothing more it is disgusting.

These cases are not open to the public and much of the information will not become public if no other reason than these were children. There isn’t anything to dispute as of yet.

It takes a sick mind to think the people that are starting and feeding threads like this are doing anything but feeding their own egos. Instead of posting this crap on the internet why don’t you people go voice your concerns of the bad reporting to the network I would say family’s but if it was my kid and someone came to me with this drivel I would probably snap and there would be another murder to investigate.

Face it you people pushing your twisted theory’s aren’t doing anything except satisfying your morbid conspiratorial mindsets. There is absolutely nothing to be done at this time you think you all could at least wait till there was a report released but your all like frothing beasts looking for scraps.

Originally posted by Grimpachi
reply to post by CthulhuMythos

 

You just made a statement about how ATS is doing a better job investigating and now you say you didn’t.

Your second statement is much better your all doing a whole bunch of finding out. Well that’s great go do some finding out whatever that means.

I think some of you can’t understand the difference between a news report and an official statement. The investigation is being conducted by those living in that area and as you should know there hasn’t been an official report given on the matter so when threads like this one come up making innuendos feeding the conspiracy nutcases based off a freaking news report and nothing more it is disgusting.

These cases are not open to the public and much of the information will not become public if no other reason than these were children. There isn’t anything to dispute as of yet.

It takes a sick mind to think the people that are starting and feeding threads like this are doing anything but feeding their own egos. Instead of posting this crap on the internet why don’t you people go voice your concerns of the bad reporting to the network I would say family’s but if it was my kid and someone came to me with this drivel I would probably snap and there would be another murder to investigate.

Face it you people pushing your twisted theory’s aren’t doing anything except satisfying your morbid conspiratorial mindsets. There is absolutely nothing to be done at this time you think you all could at least wait till there was a report released but your all like frothing beasts looking for scraps.

People are asking questions and getting info from other members....right or wrong...there are questions and thoughts given and taken. If you want to believe everything MSN says and the heat and confusion of the moment then good for you..

If others want to question news releases and try to weave a story on their own then so be it; right or wrong it is a sharing of ideas. No matter if we agree or not.

If it offends you then don't read the thread.

It would have been easy with all the security clamp down to say the shooter used whatever.

Pistols will not fit "never let a good crisis go to waste" and some nefarious grand plan carried over from "Fast and Furious"....See, easy to come up with an idea but that does not make it so; only means people do not always trust what the government or what some authority says.

Some feel there have been inaccuracies before with a government stamp on it.

There have even been crimes committed by officials to include Presidents who De-neighed they were guilty until shown the door. Nixon "I am not a Crook" comes to mind..... So exploring ideas and getting feed back from those with new or available articles or news broadcast is kinda the mission around here, no?

Maybe it was just a lone nut job who planned and executed those poor kids and teachers; people who will never finish a life started because of one messed up idiot..

reply to post by Grimpachi


Please do actually read what I have said.
I said 'ATS' is doing a better investigative job, not that 'I' was doing a better investigative job.

Since you are so against all the 'conspiracy nuts' asking questions and trying to find out exactly what happened in an event where so much does not add up......... to all the conspiracy nuts of course........ then why don't you tell us all what did happen?

If it is just a plain cut and dry incident, like you seem to think, then please do tell us all, what are the explanations to all the burning questions that don't make sense to the rest of us? Which version of events is the correct one? Remember, the correct version must leave no questions left over and will explain ALL the evidence found. From the report of a child seeing someone cuffed on the floor (not dead), to a policeman saying what sound very like 'take Adam's life' at a point where we could ask how did he know who he was so quickly since the shooter is supposed to have had his brothers ID on him? Also let's not forget the father caught smiling and laughing immediately before giving a heart wrenching, tear jerking speech to the press. I don't know about you, but if that was my child, my face would not be capable of smiling and tears would would be flooding down my cheeks. There also needs to be an explanation about the car full of bullet holes, the car that belonged to the guy Christopher Rodia (which had a guns in it), which was the car that he drove to school, why did the school not know who his mother was when she was supposed to have worked there.......... and on and on and on with unanswered questions.

It is not 'disgusting' to want to know the truth, it is natural curiosity when things don't fit together, be it a classroom full of children or a cinema full of adults. Would you just rather accept the official story, regardless of how many holes there are in it? Would it not be better to find the real explanation, even if it bursts your bubble of how good and trustworthy the authorities are? Have you written to all the newspapers to tell them how disgusted you are that they are reporting things before the official story is put out? Or telling them how disgusted you are that they have reported things that are then later reported as totally opposite? Some how I doubt it.

As a previous poster said, this is what ATS is about and if you don't like it, then don't read it.

reply to post by CthulhuMythos


I will wait for an actual report and when I speak wanna be investigators I am talking about all nuts that are taking part. I guess you do not have any experience with tragedy because you interpret another person’s expressions as unfounded or wrong. Not everyone is the same I had a young PFC that would burst out laughing every time we came under fire and it was unnerving to me but that is how he dealt with stress. Do you expect everyone to cry nonstop 24/7 it’s called coping mechanisms and extremely strange behavior is very common in stressful situations. Are you a medical professional a PHD dealing with trauma cases?

Those of you that are not even patient enough for an official report that are jumping to conspiratorial conclusions are being disgusting, with border line libel accusations. I have read 2 treads where people have tried to say they were actors. It is called respect and common decency which so many seem to lack with these innuendos. It is something even more basic than that and it’s called common sense which these threads are completely void of. There has been only one thread out of all of these that was an honest question and that was identifying the weapon pulled from the trunk because there were conflicting reports but as it turns out it was a shotgun. I can understand the interest in that but threads like this one based off of a stupid news report. It is sick and those jumping on the bandwagon are just as bad. The families are still burying their loved ones and some of you are too damn wrapped up in each others wild ideas to even let the people mourn before starting your crazy arse crap with the conspiracies. BTW there the dumbest ideas I have ever heard anyone with a shred of common sense wouldn’t give them a second thought.

The bodies are still basically warm and the accusations and innuendos are disgusting it shows zero respect. Don’t fool yourself it is only your morbid curiosity driving you and nothing else.

They claim 4 handguns (not 2) were found in the school now. My questions are:
1) where they all registered to his mother, if not, to whom?
2) where Lanza's fingerprints on all of the guns?
3) did Lanza have gun powder residue on his hands from firing a weapon?
4) where all of the guns fired?
5) was it conclusive that Lanza killed himself and not someone else (point blank range)?
6) while we are asking questions....how did the AR 15 get in the trunk (assuming it was the "bushmaster" and murder weapon) and were all of the deaths caused by a .223/5.56 bullet(s)?

Originally posted by ParanoidAmerican
reply to post by captaintyinknots

 

Out of all the gun owners and other store owners I have met in the past 30 yrs, not one has went through the process of getting an NFA weapon. I have met one trust that owned several but that was through a militia, not an individual. We agree it is not easy or cheap, but it is not even common. I would like to know registration numbers though.

edit on 23-12-2012 by ParanoidAmerican because: (no reason given)

It depends on the crowds that you associate with. I know dozens of "I only deer hunt" gun owners who know nothing about NFA firearms. If that's your type of crowd, of course you won't know much.

I also personally know 8 people who own NFA firearms and I've been to events where there were over 100. Myself, I own 2 with more to come in the near future.

Your backtracking statements like "okay, they are POSSIBLE to get but almost nobody has them" are still completely incorrect. You'll also find that most owners of NFA firearms don't go around telling everybody about it. Even staunch gun advocates have asked me why I "feel the need" to own a short-barrel AR15. I find standard firearms pretty boring so I have started moving over to the more exotic side... including short barrel rifles and suppressors. You'll never be able to fully appreciate a suppressor until you comfortably fire a rifle without hearing protection. They are not only legal but encouraged in some countries to cut down on noise pollution. Unfortunately, Hollywood has convinced everyone that only hitmen use "silencers" so they must be bad... when reality shows us that simply hearing the sound of a gunshot has never prevented or helped to solve a crime.

Edited to add: I come across as attacking you in this post but that's not my intention... simply trying to educate. A person has no speaking tone on the internet so it's always difficult to come across the intended way.

A well trained person can do just as much damage with a six shooter as an untrained person can do with an automatic weapon.... The weapon used does not matter when people are dead. I wish Americans weren't so stupid when it comes to media and sensationalism of this shooting.

Originally posted by ParanoidAmerican
reply to post by tjack

 

Something I can not find is the total number of registered Class III, anyone got an idea my net is seriously restricted atm.....

edit on 23-12-2012 by ParanoidAmerican because: (no reason given)

The best "guess" I've been able to find is about 250k. I say guess because people can't seem to get a straight answer from the ATF. Class III guns made after 1986 are not supposed to be transferable to civilians so the total available for transfer should be fairly fixed. But it seems that due to corruption on the part of some politicians and the ATF (Big surprise there) that they are registering some post '86 guns transferable...

LINK

reply to post by CommandoJoe


Good find! Thanks for that bit of information. I know of several wealthy people who have lots. Ted Neg and a guy in AZ off the top of my head both hold shooting expos.

Originally posted by Answer

Originally posted by ParanoidAmerican
reply to post by captaintyinknots

 

Yes in some states WITH a FFL you can own a full auto weapon. Civilians w/o an FFL can not own them. I have done my research, my grandfather used to hold an FFL and owned a gunshop for many years.

Please do further research. You are flat-out, 100% incorrect yet you keep arguing the point anyway.

Civilians can own full automatic weapons, short barrel rifles/shotguns, and suppressors without an FFL in most states with a full background check, fingerprints, local LE chief sign-off, $200 tax, registration, and a 3-6 month wait. Furthermore, a standard FFL holder CAN NOT own such weapons IN ANY STATE without further licensing from the ATF or if they go through the same process as any other private owner. Simply having an 01 FFL does not permit a person to possess or sell NFA restricted firearms. Period. In order to purchase a full-auto firearm, one must go through a dealer who has the proper licensing to deal in NFA firearms. Your average gun store/pawn shop does not have this type of license.

Regardless what you think you know through second-hand/third-hand information, I have been through the legal process to own registered NFA firearms two times now and I do not have an FFL, nor do my friends who own such firearms including full-auto and suppressors. A quick Google search will give you the info you need.

The last thing we need right now is more incorrect information being spread.

edit on 12/23/2012 by Answer because: (no reason given)

Forget gun shops, and pawn shops. It is my understanding that anyone can purchase any legal to own gun in the USA from his neighbor or friend ( within his own state, not across state lines) - anytime with no waiting period, no background check or filing any paperwork with the state for the sale transaction. Of course they must then register that gun in that state if registration is required.. on many guns in many states, registration is not required. There are even legal to purchase semi-auto to full auto gun kits or mods people can get to turn a semi automatic gun into a full auto gun.

It's even legal in many states to openly carry these non registered guns without any weapon carry permit ( because they are not concealed) I own one such semi auto, I can strap it to my hip and walk around in Wal-Mart if I wanted to, perfectly 100% legal. The state does not even have to know I own the gun.

These harsher requirements talked about in the above threads, only apply for buying from a registered dealer with the gun as a new weapon sold as such from the factory as in the case with trying to buy a full auto weapon.

Originally posted by Grimpachi
reply to post by Helious

 

I have read all the threads dealing with this shooting including the one of the medical examiner and it hasn’t proven one damn thing. I have read several threads started where people say they weren’t crying enough or in the case of the medical examiner he didn’t act the way people wanted. The answer is NO an overwhelming NO. You people are not investigating anything but what you are doing is sick and despicable. There is something wrong with some of you very, very wrong.

Really?? Tell me what is wrong with questioning the horrific media coverage? At the very least it tells us that the media should not say a word until the police say so. Given the fact that the reports were so wild and varied you really have to wonder how it is even allowed. It is one thing to get on tv and say we have reason to believe or an unconfirmed source......it is totally another to say state and feds told us this is true. There are many many things to discuss about this story...I agree some of the ideas about actors or whatever else are outrageous but it happens....that does not mean it is wrong for us to discuss this event and question authority as we see fit. I find it very hard to believe you belong to a forum like this and then respond to a thread in a manner that would be indicative of the "thought" police. I personally witnessed live on tv the media and the police lie PERIOD. If you think it is sick and twisted to question that I suppose that is your prerogative but last I checked the rest of us American citizens are guaranteed certain rights and we will exercise them as we see fit.

reply to post by SMOKINGGUN2012

Really?? Tell me what is wrong with questioning the horrific media coverage?

You can't figure it out? OK start reading here.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Here is a U2U some one sent me.

Someone else showing a little compassion,

I was getting sick of trying to get everyone to realize the media making stuff up does not a conspiracy make.. My poor state is still in massive shock over this, and I know for a fact that we all would rather not have people turn it into a game...

*HUGS*

#####, up in Connecticut..

Have some decency when speaking about these matters. Too many people are treating this as a game and there interest is far from finding the truth.