Ex Defence Minister Wishes to Nuke Pakistan Border

Lord Gilbert: "If you told them that some ERRB warheads were going to be dropped there and that it would be a very unpleasant place to go, they would not go there.
"You would greatly reduce your problem of protecting those borders from infiltration from one side or another.
www.huffingtonpost.co.uk...

Clearly he doesn’t understand these people are willing to die anyway, and so anything barring a lethal dose would not deter them.
And if fear spread into Pakistan-Afghanistan people being contaminated with lethal fallout, it would be no great surprise to see many of them become suicide bombers before the fallout got to them (regardless how much civilian fears of fallout would be enemy propaganda –and there would be plenty of it.

For a guy born in 1927 perhaps someone has used a “senile” “wave weapon” against him? Or perhaps it’s just old age!

Gilbert was roundly criticized for his comment by fellow parliament members. Responding for the government Lord Wallace said the coalition did not share the "rumbustious views" of Gilbert.
John William Gilbert, or Baron Gilbert, twice gained the seat of the defense minister, first in the Labor government of James Callaghan and then in the Tony Blair’s first PM term. Gilbert also was a member of the Intelligence and Security Committee while he was an MP. rt.com...

Served under Labour, and in Tony Blair’s Cabinet. Surely just a coincidence he’s now completely of his trolley?

As more people get older & older, I suspect the Lord’s is going to be an increasingly fun place to be!! Sort of “Monster Raving Loony Party” (accept they once, really were in power).

As readers here know I’m not against using nuclear weapons
www.abovetopsecret.com...

But only as an electrically & morale damaging tool, in a way that kills as close to nobody as possible (even with fallout included).

PS: For some reason this isn’t being covered by the BBC –regime mainstream media. Can anyone find on Sky-BBC, Daily Telegraph even?

reply to post by Liberal1984


This was posted a few days ago then 404'd by the Mods...

Although, even then, the only reference I could find to this supposed speech was in Indian newspapers. Even now, the only reference I can find seems to be re-hashed articles of the same story carried by "alternative" sources.

Considering every minute of Parliamentary business is covered and broadcast live, you'd think there would be a video of this supposed speech. I cannot find one, anywhere...

Now, even if he did say what he apparently said, you (and the other websites) are spinning what he did say:

Your Lordships may say that this is impractical, but nobody lives up in the mountains on the border between Afghanistan and Pakistan except for a few goats and a handful of people herding them. If you told them that some ERRB warheads were going to be dropped there and that it would be a very unpleasant place to go, they would not go there. You would greatly reduce your problem of protecting those borders from infiltration from one side or another”

Note, he doesn't actually say we should Neutron bomb the border, but rather he says " If you told them that some ERRB warheads were going to be dropped there and that it would be a very unpleasant place to go, they would not go there." The way I am reading it, he doesn't suggest actually doing it, just telling them we are going to and hope they fall for the ruse...

All that aside, I can still find no actual video evidence he even uttered those words.

Ok, I finally found a video... For once, RT did something useful!

rt.com...

However, noticeably, they cut him off when he is about to go on and he doesn't actually say we should Nuke the border or even use ERRB weapons, just tell them we were....

reply to post by stumason

The way I am reading it, he doesn't suggest actually doing it, just telling them we are going to and hope they fall for the ruse...

The threat alone would not stop the fanatics. They would just ramp up their terrorism and dare someone to drop a bomb on them and praise Allah as the flash disintegrated them.

It is that kind of sabre rattling that could actually lead to WWIII.

Originally posted by happykat39
reply to post by stumason

 

The way I am reading it, he doesn't suggest actually doing it, just telling them we are going to and hope they fall for the ruse...

The threat alone would not stop the fanatics. They would just ramp up their terrorism and dare someone to drop a bomb on them and praise Allah as the flash disintegrated them.

It is that kind of sabre rattling that could actually lead to WWIII.

Dropping a nuke anywhere is serious stuff. It would only make things worse.

stumason This was posted a few days ago then 404'd by the Mods...

What rule did it violate? Did it provide the ATS audience with real information, the government is (actually) perfectly happy for people to chat about (in exchange for those said peoples IP address)?
Or was it in danger of becoming a Top Topic (even without a close knit group of 30 or so people, artificially giving it flags?)
Just wondering!

Considering every minute of Parliamentary business is covered and broadcast live, you'd think there would be a video of this supposed speech.

Glad you now see there is one.

However, noticeably, they cut him off when he is about to go on

Stumson Aren't you in danger of spitting on the truth with unreasoned skepticism? But if you found a continuation (that did not match RT quotation) then you'd certainly have a point. However...
(Whilst there are plenty of examples of BBC, Fox and Sky news deceiving their audience) I am not aware of one such example from RT. Nor would one be in RT’s interests because you can bet your pants that when one comes (as is somewhat inevitable in the business of journalism) it will be highly, highly, publicised by mainstream-regime media.
Furthermore: What Lord Gilbert, said on camera is completely consistent with the way he was quoted by alternative media.

The way I am reading it, he doesn't suggest actually doing it, just telling them we are going to and hope they fall for the ruse...

When you read the context it’s quite clear he wants to do it.
Otherwise it’s obvious it would not work, as even Taliban have access to radio news, and they would therefore be laughing about our empty threats.

Wake Up Sheep, or Become Chops?
It’s most significant the way this story is not being reported on by our mainstream, media. Almost anything nuclear is self-evidently, newsworthy (even if it’s only for “entertainment” value) so by now Lord Gilbert should surely have the nicknamed as “Lord Neutron Bomb” in all U.K tabloids.
Unfortunately we do not have proper competition between the mass-media, much more than we have (proper-natural) democratic competition between the political parties. But it is interesting to see the media, work with the regime in maintaining public unconsciousness.

Originally posted by Liberal1984
What rule did it violate? Did it provide the ATS audience with real information, the government is (actually) perfectly happy for people to chat about (in exchange for those said peoples IP address)?
Or was it in danger of becoming a Top Topic (even without a close knit group of 30 or so people, artificially giving it flags?)
Just wondering!

No idea chap, it just vanished......

Originally posted by Liberal1984Glad you now see there is one.

Indeed... Took me 4 days to find the bloody thing though.

Originally posted by Liberal1984
Stumson Aren't you in danger of spitting on the truth with unreasoned skepticism? But if you found a continuation (that did not match RT quotation) then you'd certainly have a point. However...

All we have though is a short quote, which actually stops short of saying what is claimed in the thread title and is out of context with the rest of the debate both before and after. All I am saying is be careful making presumptions about what a person apparently meant when it is clear, even from the quotes, that isn't what he actually said.

Originally posted by Liberal1984
(Whilst there are plenty of examples of BBC, Fox and Sky news deceiving their audience) I am not aware of one such example from RT. Nor would one be in RT’s interests because you can bet your pants that when one comes (as is somewhat inevitable in the business of journalism) it will be highly, highly, publicised by mainstream-regime media.

And there are many examples of RT putting out total garbage. Be careful putting them on a pedestal and declaring otherwise "free world" media as "regime", because anyone with half and ounce of grey matter knows RT is controlled by the Kremlin. It was, after all, setup with the sole intention of countering Western news outlets and their perceived biases.

Originally posted by Liberal1984
Furthermore: What Lord Gilbert, said on camera is completely consistent with the way he was quoted by alternative media.

Indeed, but it is out of context and cut short. I could be caught on camera saying "Gays cannot have Children", which is wide open for interpretation as to what I meant, ranging from the factual (they literally cannot have children of their own) to having an alternative meaning attached to it, such as it being a personal belief that it is wrong for them to have children. It is somewhat curious that the only quotes are short and provide no background, with the only video clearly cutting off a second part of the speech by Lord Gilbert which may have changed what he said entirely.

Originally posted by Liberal1984When you read the context it’s quite clear he wants to do it.
Otherwise it’s obvious it would not work, as even Taliban have access to radio news, and they would therefore be laughing about our empty threats.

Read the context? There is no context! It is a single sentence, taken out of a longer speech which you have no detail for. For all we know, he might have been making glib remarks in response to other equally stupid statements by the old fools on the Lords.

I would like to see the entire debate before passing judgement and it would serve you well to seek out this information and make your own mind up, not rely on media which is clearly rehashing the same story (in some instances copying it word for word off other sites) and doing no verification of the story themselves.

Wake Up Sheep, or Become Chops?
It’s most significant the way this story is not being reported on by our mainstream, media.


Probably, as I strongly suspect, because there is nothing in it as the whole thing has been twisted by the so called "alternative media" (of which, notably, all who carry the story have strong anti-western bias anyway). I can guarantee that if it had traction, the Sun at least would carry such a story, with such a title for Lord Gilbert.

And there are many examples of RT putting out total garbage.

What examples come to mind? What do you know of that’s false. I for one am most keen to see an example of RT lying.

Be careful putting them on a pedestal and declaring otherwise "free world" media as "regime", because anyone with half and ounce of grey matter knows RT is controlled by the Kremlin.

So what? Anyone with half an ounce of matter knows that although our government does not control the media (except the BBC to some small degree) our media does control our government, and does a good job at putting private & lobbyists interests miles ahead of the publics.

It was, after all, setup with the sole intention of countering Western news outlets and their perceived biases.

But there are very few news stories I see them not covering, whilst there are a great many (like this one) our “free?” media has not been allowed to show the audience. It was thanks to RT that I first learnt of the Syrians tricking prisoners into being suicide bombers…
www.youtube.com...
And about Syrians turning towards Al Quada www.youtube.com...
RT also covered the exaggerated protests celebrating the fall of Gaddafi, e.g. the waving of the Indian flag on “live Tripoli coverage” www.youtube.com...

In Short…
RT is doing a fine job of exposing Western (corporate-BBC owned news media) as something not much better than what they suffered during Soviet times. Our media is doing little to show RT’s coverage to be bogus, and if we did, we’d probably be lying.

It is somewhat curious that the only quotes are short and provide no background, with the only video clearly cutting off a second part of the speech by Lord Gilbert which may have changed what he said entirely.

If you can find the Lords footage we all know is filmed, and you spoke of as if it was freely available, and if you find a contradiction from what RT is reporting then you have a point. Otherwise it’s just speculation –speculation I’d argue is far more justified in Western media because the examples I’ve given are just a few I know of where they plainly lie to our people.

Read the context? There is no context!

The Huffington Post (link already given) expanded on it www.huffingtonpost.co.uk...

reply to post by Liberal1984


We do this dance about media, RT and the West every time, Liberal.

I have, over the course of the years and many threads, pointed out many times were RT has twisted and misrepresented situations. I also have, on many occasions, acknowledged our own media's failings. Being aware of them is the key.

I'm not, however, about to do this dance again because, quite frankly, you don't pay the slightest bit of attention to anything that contradicts your viewpoint as you go into every situation believing RT to be the gospel and the West as constantly lying.

For example, you trotted out many RT articles about Libya that proved to be false and when proven so, you mysteriously disappear from the thread only to resurface again with another new, yet extravagant claim. You were, after all, claiming the West to be supporting Islamist extremists in Libya and predicted a strict, Islamist state to be formed. This, of course, turned out to be totally false. In fact, of all the Arab spring countries, Libya is the only one with a moderate Government, not one dominated by the Muslim brotherhood.