Abduction or imagination? Is something in our forests?

Personally I don't believe in aliens, but usually children don't lie about these things

Has he ever had any episodes of any form of parasomnia? Sleepwalkig, so-called night terrors, or anything else out of the ordinary?

I used to sleepwalk and have extremely convoluted tales upon waking of where I had gone and what I had done. I also used to have night terrors where I would unlock the door and go outside, all while asleep, with dream imagery superimposed over the real world around me. It made for extremely compelling and seemingly inexplicable stories of encounters and other odd details.

Just something to consider. Peace.

Really interesting but would the development of a child of 3 allow such long sentences etc..Three is also the age most children have or develop the sense of imaginary friends..just a thought.I am glad it turned out ok though.

dbl post

I'm pretty bad at using google, I can't find this campsite for the life of me. Does anyone know where it is? I see Mt Shasta, Mccloud city and Mt Shasta Ntnl forest but when I search for campgrounds around there nothing comes up except some lodge.

reply to post by SuspendedBelief

Misskat,my blood runs cold reading of these cases-ive first came across mention of the park dissapearance phenomenon about a year ago-there is something very strange and dangerous going on,most definitely.What i dont understand,is why the American public dont Insist that this very real and serious problem receives a highly visible(transparency in the conduct thereof,no secretive abc agency stuff) and painstakingly thorough investigation.Especialy the people who lost children/adult loved ones? There should be a formal inquiry into this matter at highest government levels,imo-so many citizens are vanishing/killed/mercifully found but with very strange accounts of what happened.I am so very happy you got yr lil guy back-such a mercy! Which brings me to the matter of belief in God being under threat, that is mentioned in the reply here- not to turn this into a debate re belief systems,bt our "god",our source,is Inside us, ive felt since i was a child,and i believe every child feels this,often we lose this connection-organised religion smothers the awareness of this ,ironicaly. So,i dont see why aliens/evil spirits/whatever beings/entities should make a person lose their belief in the Creator, evil spirits/aliens/shapeshifters didnt just pop into existence either-they too had to be created by SOMETHING-you can go as high up this chain as you want-at the top of it all,there still is the Source/Creator.No need to feel threatened,unless you try and confine the Infinite to the narrow coffin of a humanmade religion.Bless you,Misskat,and yr family,i hope people can be made aware,whats needed is a national campaign so unknowing folks can at least have a choice,whether to expose themselves+kids to this danger.

It seems there are indeed hidden marijuana grow sites in our forests. Maybe like another poster said, the drug cartels are kidnapping kids for human trafficking, selling them for bonus profit. Very scary stuff. I definitely wouldn't go camping around certain areas of California where growing is very common.

www.fs.fed.us...

www.fs.usda.gov...

Whoa.

I found this picture on a Forest Service blog site about an illegal marijuana grow site cleanup in North Eastern Washington.



blogs.usda.gov...-36018

Look closely at the trash and you'll see many backpacks, sleeping bags and tents. Some of the backpacks look like school children's packs. Now I know some of this stuff had to belong to the growers themselves so they could camp there for an extended period of time, but I'm willing to bet that a lot of this is stolen from hikers and campers. Some of it could even be from murder victims or kidnappings. I mean that looks like a loot pile to me.

Now... this gets even more interesting.

Back when I lived in this area there was a bag of $500,000 cash found hidden on the side of a convenience store across from my house. Here is the article. community.seattletimes.nwsource.com...

This is about 20-30 miles from the site of the marijuana grow "north of Winthrop" mentioned in the blog article.



What I'm wondering is if this $500,000 was a simple payoff for marijuana or if it might have been a payoff for a kidnapped child? Washington is well known as a state with a lot of kidnappings. Eastern WA is extremely easy to move around in and trafficking a kidnapped child across the Canadian border would be fairly easy for someone determined enough.

Is there a cover up currently going on about the extent to which these drug cartels have set up shop in American National forests? When Agenda 21 shuts these areas down to the public, the drug cartels are not going to leave, they will just have free reign over the areas.

The public needs to be made aware of the danger of exploring and camping in National forests and wilderness areas. Maybe support for amnesty would not be so high if people were more aware of these illegal marijuana grows and their connections to mexican drug cartels which traffic in humans.

Oh yea, and this is just a personal story but when I was a teenager and my little sister was only about 6 years old we were at a soccer game in Tonasket which is in this same area. She has blond hair and is a typical looking prime target for kidnappers. There was windowless van parked by the soccer game with two mexicans in it. They were staring at my sister the whole time unless I would look at them, then they would pretend like they were just watching the game. After a little while of this I got nervous and decided I should probably take her home. We got in my car and left. I was curious if the van would follow me so I watched in my mirror. To my shock it began moving and pulled onto the road going the same way I was. I drove straight to the police station in town and the van turned around and took off. Unfortunately I didn't see where it went or get any license info on it. I filed a report but nothing ever came of it that I know of.

I am all for you giving your opinion and all that, but why do you need to be rude? "I call BS"? Like you think she made this all up just to have a thread to get stars and flags? If you don't believe the child experienced what he did, you wouldn't be alone. If you think it is probably explained best using conventional wisdom instead of robot grandmas you wouldn't be alone. If you posted really just to tell this lady you think she is lying, then you are a dick.

reply to post by sputniksteve


Well said.

But...you missed the driving point of his/her reply...aliens.

For reasons best known to themselves, some people on ATS will almost automatically, write a very negative post such as shown simply in order to make it absolutely clear to all readers that 'aliens' do not exists, the millions of worldwide reports spanning centuries, are nothing but lies and fantasies from Walter Mitty types, and publicity seekers...even Royal families, presidents, pilots both civil and military, astronauts / cosmonauts, religious leaders, soldiers, policemen and women, and yes...ordinary people.

The numbers that have reported and continue to report these phenomena, says that just going by the numbers alone there are going to be included in the reports lies, fantasies and out and out hoaxes. Of course there is going to be, it's human nature to a degree...but, because a percentage will be false, means by the same weight of numbers of reports and laws of probability...there are also certainly genuine reports.

Which of course...means ET IS visiting, conducting experimentations and abductions, collecting samples and generally doing things we've all come to associate with them.

Some people, as we all certainly know, especially true of 'government employees'..will say anything to rubbish, divert attention, and generally attempt to use various 'steering tactics' away from the ET connection to any subject.

It's a well rehearsed thing among those 'tasked' with dispelling such connections or conclusions..others will rubbish this subject, ignoring the mountains of evidence and testimony to fit their personal beliefs, so much so that being downright rude and patronising doesn't matter to them.

Why this is so, is another question.

I'm glad your Son's little boy was found safe and sound Misskat, i can appreciate a little of what your Son went through, i have two young boys myself...the sheer cold panic he felt must have been extraordinary.

I know kids make up stories, we all know that...but it's unusual for the story to be persistent and for it to be as detailed and remain as consistent over the course of a year later...who knows who or what he found or found him, whether ET or some weirdo living in the woods, in my opinion something or someone interacted with him and made a lasting impression on his memory, taken with what you say happened to you and your friend Misskat, i'd say it's a coincidence too far...if i were local to the area i would definately go back with a large party, armed to the teeth and explore as many nooks and crannys as i could find within reasonable walking distance between where he disapeared and where he was discovered under the bush.

You never know, you might get some answers about what happened to him and to yourself.

You can definately rule out sleep walking as sleep walking was reduced to a scam years ago.

I would check into the ancient lore of the land for involvement of Indians with alien beings. What happened to you might be a result of a hidden power trying to direct you to a hidden cave with ancient paintings of Indians and beings not from Earth.

reply to post by MysterX


Oh, didnt you hear? Anyone who reports a UFO- anyone- is either mistaken, or most probably, lying, hoaxing or is mentally ill. There cannot possibly be anything remotely anomalyis in our skies because we, the glorious all knowing human being, with our huge grasp of 'science', even though we are at the pinnical of our evolution and know everything about everything, have been unable to unlock the secrets of interstellar travel, so therefore it doesnt exist.

We proclaim this from the lofty heights of a few hundred years of scientific endeavour, even though a 150 years ago we had horse drawn vehicles, gas lights and steam engines were new technology, even though a few hundred years before that we were convinced the earth was flat and the centre of the universe, and burnt people at the stake for suggesting otherwise, we now know, 100%, that there is absolutely no chance whatsoever that an alien race could be visiting because, well, we cant do it, so no matter how many millions of years of extra evolution another race may have got on the all powerful, mighty human, they couldnt possibly know something we dont.

Oh yes, and if you are in a position of trust, say an airline pilot or an astronaut, and you 'think' you saw something that doesnt fit in with this paradigm, well, you best just keep your mouth shut, because overnight you will go from hero to zero, your credibility in ruins ('sure, we trust you to fly this aircraft day in day out with hundreds of passengers aboard, but you saw a UFO? Take him off flight rotation, he's obviously deluded') Or as I heard recently, one of the Apollo astronauts described as a 'hack' for daring to stray from the path of main stream beliefs in aliens.

Sarcasm mode off:

On another note, Im lucky enough to live in Scotland, where there is no such thing as a 'trespass' law in the wilderness, and never will be (thank goodness). The only exception is MOD firing ranges or private enterprises immeadiate land (although Donald Trump recently put this to the test with his obnoxious golf course for the fabulously wealthy).

What is this Agenda 21 you US citizens are talking about? Sounds extemely unconstitutional- are people up in arms about it? Are they seriously attempting to put much of the wilderness 'off limits' to the average citizen? This would make me more suspicious than anything else I have heard for a long time- why? Whats out there? Are they protecting people or is there something out there they dont want people to see? Something they want?

Also, have you noticed the amount of people who have posted that they used to go into the wilderness on their own without a care, but recently have stopped, and feel uneasy and threatened? Not just on this forum either- what is going on???

Originally posted by Socrato
I'm pretty bad at using google, I can't find this campsite for the life of me. Does anyone know where it is? I see Mt Shasta, Mccloud city and Mt Shasta Ntnl forest but when I search for campgrounds around there nothing comes up except some lodge.

www.fs.usda.gov...

Location: From Weaverville, go north on Hwy 3 for 34 miles to County Road 106 cross over the bridge and continue for 13 miles to French Gulch/Clear Creek junction, turn left and go 2 miles. Latitude: 40.93079995 Longitude: -122.5859239

You will need to get a California Gazetteer [ quadrangle map ] to find county rd.106, Now let me ask you, if you Socrato can't find this online, why would we trust your paranormal hunting skills?
Sheesh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by Caver78

Originally posted by Socrato
I'm pretty bad at using google, I can't find this campsite for the life of me. Does anyone know where it is? I see Mt Shasta, Mccloud city and Mt Shasta Ntnl forest but when I search for campgrounds around there nothing comes up except some lodge.

www.fs.usda.gov...

Not suprised you couldnt find that from Google Earth! 6 camping spaces in the middle of the forest!

reply to post by Thunda


The campground is easily found thru forest service info.....facepalm, took 3 seconds of google-foo.....

I also found no record of a Search for a missing toddler during the time frame given, altho Siskiou Sheriff's don't list theirs as well as the neighboring county of Shasta.
www.co.shasta.ca.us...

Checked local papers as well. This is not to say the OP is misrepresenting anything, it's just to say verification is necessary.

reply to post by Caver78


Absolutely, and good link- was just saying, trying to find that from the air would be virtually impossible!

Sorry Thunda, I get impatient with the google-impaired...LOL. I attempted to check out the OP's story and Shasta has plenty of Search and rescue assists with Siskiou County but came up empty. I'm hoping the OP can assist.
I'm one of the biggest woo proponents, especially as plenty of it goes on in the woods, but before I get excited
some of this has to check out.

There isn't a ''McCloud'' campground altho there is one fitting the description called Fowlers just outside of the town of McCloud.

www.shastahome.com...

Originally posted by Caver78

Originally posted by Socrato
I'm pretty bad at using google, I can't find this campsite for the life of me. Does anyone know where it is? I see Mt Shasta, Mccloud city and Mt Shasta Ntnl forest but when I search for campgrounds around there nothing comes up except some lodge.

www.fs.usda.gov...

Location: From Weaverville, go north on Hwy 3 for 34 miles to County Road 106 cross over the bridge and continue for 13 miles to French Gulch/Clear Creek junction, turn left and go 2 miles. Latitude: 40.93079995 Longitude: -122.5859239

You will need to get a California Gazetteer [ quadrangle map ] to find county rd.106, Now let me ask you, if you Socrato can't find this online, why would we trust your paranormal hunting skills?
Sheesh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

edit on 19-11-2012 by Caver78 because: (no reason given)

Thank you friend. I really am google impaired. My wife tells me I'm too specific and use the wrong key words. I sometimes have to ask her to google something for me after I try a few times and get nothing. She usually finds it first go around.

Ugh. They never taught us how to use a search engine in school, I was in 3rd grade by the time the internet finally came out.

But man, thanks, really. I do try, I often just come up with things that are way off topic or way to limited in scope.

Originally posted by Thunda
reply to post by MysterX

 

Oh, didnt you hear? Anyone who reports a UFO- anyone- is either mistaken, or most probably, lying, hoaxing or is mentally ill. There cannot possibly be anything remotely anomalyis in our skies because we, the glorious all knowing human being, with our huge grasp of 'science', even though we are at the pinnical of our evolution and know everything about everything, have been unable to unlock the secrets of interstellar travel, so therefore it doesnt exist.

We proclaim this from the lofty heights of a few hundred years of scientific endeavour, even though a 150 years ago we had horse drawn vehicles, gas lights and steam engines were new technology, even though a few hundred years before that we were convinced the earth was flat and the centre of the universe, and burnt people at the stake for suggesting otherwise, we now know, 100%, that there is absolutely no chance whatsoever that an alien race could be visiting because, well, we cant do it, so no matter how many millions of years of extra evolution another race may have got on the all powerful, mighty human, they couldnt possibly know something we dont.

Oh yes, and if you are in a position of trust, say an airline pilot or an astronaut, and you 'think' you saw something that doesnt fit in with this paradigm, well, you best just keep your mouth shut, because overnight you will go from hero to zero, your credibility in ruins ('sure, we trust you to fly this aircraft day in day out with hundreds of passengers aboard, but you saw a UFO? Take him off flight rotation, he's obviously deluded') Or as I heard recently, one of the Apollo astronauts described as a 'hack' for daring to stray from the path of main stream beliefs in aliens.

Sarcasm mode off:

On another note, Im lucky enough to live in Scotland, where there is no such thing as a 'trespass' law in the wilderness, and never will be (thank goodness). The only exception is MOD firing ranges or private enterprises immeadiate land (although Donald Trump recently put this to the test with his obnoxious golf course for the fabulously wealthy).

What is this Agenda 21 you US citizens are talking about? Sounds extemely unconstitutional- are people up in arms about it? Are they seriously attempting to put much of the wilderness 'off limits' to the average citizen? This would make me more suspicious than anything else I have heard for a long time- why? Whats out there? Are they protecting people or is there something out there they dont want people to see? Something they want?

Also, have you noticed the amount of people who have posted that they used to go into the wilderness on their own without a care, but recently have stopped, and feel uneasy and threatened? Not just on this forum either- what is going on???

So, to re-bump my post, what is this Agenda 21 people are talking about?

reply to post by Thunda


Agree with your 'ufo' post Thunda, 100% mate.

Not that i know a lot, but from what i can tell, Agenda 21 is about somehow restricting or completely banning Americans from travelling around in American woodlands and forested areas...why is a mystery to me though.

But then again, sense and American politics are pretty strange bedfellows these days, imo.

I could understand if an area had become toxic or dangerous to people, but we're talking about the actual wilderness, not an industrial dumping ground or something.

I think it's all pretty weird tbh.

reply to post by Socrato


OK will call ''truce''...LOL
My better half also suffers from the same ''keyword'' impairment, so I sympathize with your Missus.

One thing not mentioned, and NOT in anyway meant to diminish the OP's family drama, is that this is a disinfo plan by the ET's or Bigfoot themselves to keep people out of the woods. It isn't past either group to set the OP up with this experience. Both use screening and both have a vested interest in keeping nosy people out of areas they are currently using.

en.wikipedia.org...
here's an overview it's also the LAST googling I'm going to do for anyone else.....ROFL