Richard Mourdock: God intends women to get raped!

Originally posted by sonnny1
reply to post by LiveEquation

 

I am male. But...............

I know women have final say, when it comes to their bodies.

Just like a man does.

Actually, that is not very fair at all. Women do have final say over their bodies, but when that body is giving birth to a life that will effect not only her but the man who helped to create that life as well... then he should have some say.

This opinion is highlighted often in cases where the female may not want to have the baby and chooses abortion but the male wants to have that baby and chooses life or vice versa. The fact that the male counter parts life is so deeply effected by the choices of another, yet he has no say in the matter, is a deeply flawed concept. This flawed concept has consequences that extend well beyond the issue of abortion and giving birth.

On another note... Holy misrepresented thread title Batman!! Mourdock does not say God intended for women to be raped. He is simply saying that all life is precious, regardless of how that life is created. Fact is, there are many people who feel that same way... and they are not all Republicans or Men. I know a women who gave birth to a child at the age of 16 after she was raped. It was her Mother who insisted that she have the child. Now life has not been easy for that girl and I will not pretend that it has, but it is not only Republicans or only men who share that line of thinking.

What's bothering me about the responses, at least locally (I live in Indiana) is that people are treating it as a matter of personal belief, as if Mourdock is some sort of outlier. This is the modern republican position. Their legislators aren't just making noises at "Christian" fundamentalists to get votes anymore. Since the Tea Party Incursion of 2010 they've been actively passing legislation at the state level (all over the place) designed to make getting an abortion difficult, grueling, humiliating, punitive, or impossible.

The union of the republican party and religious extremists has been fully cemented. Their ultimate goal is "personhood" for blastocytes. This would not only criminalize all abortion but most forms of birth control, including IUDs for Ba'al's sake. Sounds like a CT, but since you're a reader of political threads you probably already know it isn't. The only reason Mourdock, Todd Akin et. al. sound unusual is that some republicans have a hard time, well, dialing it back a notch before the elections so they don't spook the normals.

Originally posted by MrWendal

Originally posted by sonnny1
reply to post by LiveEquation

 

I am male. But...............

I know women have final say, when it comes to their bodies.

Just like a man does.

Actually, that is not very fair at all. Women do have final say over their bodies, but when that body is giving birth to a life that will effect not only her but the man who helped to create that life as well... then he should have some say.

There is far reaching cry from getting pregnant and giving birth.

This opinion is highlighted often in cases where the female may not want to have the baby and chooses abortion but the male wants to have that baby and chooses life or vice versa. The fact that the male counter parts life is so deeply effected by the choices of another, yet he has no say in the matter, is a deeply flawed concept. This flawed concept has consequences that extend well beyond the issue of abortion and giving birth.

So do you want to legislate the man's consent into law? How for does that go? Does a rapist or incestuous family member get a say? What about forcing a woman to track down her "one night stand?" What if the woman isn't sure who the father is, should she get mulitple consent forms signed? Should this legislation apply only to married couples?

On another note... Holy misrepresented thread title Batman!! Mourdock does not say God intended for women to be raped. He is simply saying that all life is precious, regardless of how that life is created. Fact is, there are many people who feel that same way... and they are not all Republicans or Men. I know a women who gave birth to a child at the age of 16 after she was raped. It was her Mother who insisted that she have the child. Now life has not been easy for that girl and I will not pretend that it has, but it is not only Republicans or only men who share that line of thinking.

So what if many people feel the same way? Many people feel mixed races shouldn't marry too. We don't legislate based on feelings or personal religious beliefs.

Originally posted by spinalremain
Reply to post by 3chainz

 

How do rape babies come into existence?

The same way that consenual babies do. Carrying the pregnancy to term.
Look, I don't endorse what this fool is saying, but I understand what he meant and so do you. You're twisting his words into meaning that God wants women to be raped and that's not what he meant. He is just different from you and I (and 99% of people) in that he believes all life should be protected. He doesn't understand the pain that the mother would have to endure just by looking at the child and he is obviously a religious fanatic. That said though, he never said that "God has a plan for rape". The baby is the outcome of the rape, but the rape is what you're focusing on.

 

Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

 

I will state I think he is just the kind of person who has no idea how to phrase his thoughts, but I think it's a bit much to attack people for taking what he said to it's natural logical conclusion.

"I struggled with it myself for a long time, and I realized that life is a gift from God, and I think even when life begins in that horrible situation of rape, that it is something God intended to happen,"

If god intended for you to get preggers then what is it? The main problem here is the man opened his mouth and proclaimed he knew what the divine intended. Now, this brings up a whole slew of philosophical issues when you say things like that. If God intended for the woman to get knocked up then he also intended for the act leading to said condition. The problem is you are asking me to separate the two points when that is not possible. One cannot exist without the other.

It would have been smarter to just say "Rape is bad, but life is a good thing, please let's not kill babies".

The question that people haven't really addressed is whether a woman should have a choice with what to do with her body once she gets pregnant. I know most people are pro-life. What is the reality? Should a government tell a woman what she can do or not do with her body? Todd Akin went even further when he blatantly lied when he claimed that when a women body senses rape, it shuts down reproduction faculties.

Why are these men opposed to what women can or not do with their bodies?

Does life really begin at conception?

or is conception a continuation of life? (conception does not arise from dead cells but from live cells thus it is not a miracle or should not be viewed as such)

Ya know this is the stupidest thing ever now. I am a democrate and even I know that the man was talking about the life created by the rape that was what God intended. Not the rape itself. But hey waste time with crap like this because you can.

reply to post by sonnny1


WOAH Why would he not know anything about conception because he's a man ? Men are half the equation when it comes to conception and one who knows nothing about it is just ignorant. Are you saying that because you dont know anything about it? Are you saying that conception is a womans issue? I'm not sure what you're saying really.

Originally posted by doesntmakesense
saw this on AP, seemed to be the only thing they mentioned from that debate, weird right? Mourdock simply means God intends everything to happen for a reason- yes rape too. Who knows, maybe this baby will turn out to do great things, but only if it was born at a certain time that wouldn't happen if she hadn't otherwise been raped. Maybe her baby would turn out to be an evil person if it weren't for the experience, because you know the mother would REALLY stress fundamental characteristics like love, respect, and responsibility. His statement makes sense to a lot of religious folks and it may end up helping him, guess it depends on God's intentions

Two stars for this ignorant post is more than I can stomach. No you moron he didnt mean that God intended the rape. He was speaking about the life created by that rape not the indefensable violent action that is rape. If anything that would fall under activity of satan no? Isnt he really responsible for all the bad stuff in the world anyway ?

He's saying that life can only happen if it's God's will for that life to come about. God creates life. He didn't say that God intends women to get raped .. he said that God intends the life to come from that bad event. At least, I think that's what he's saying. I could be wrong .. but that's what I get reading it.

reply to post by LiveEquation


Not to mention raising the child with the face of the person who did this to you so that you remember for the rest of your life. And just how much will you love that child with the face of a rapist? How will that childs life go? How many therapy hours will it take for the child to build self esteme and for the mother to learn to love the product of violence. Only the strongest of women would be able to do this. I would not.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


I'd add another star but it would only get lost in the fray. So instead I will say excellant point!

Originally posted by sonnny1
reply to post by LiveEquation

 

Could be he thinks ALL life, regardless on how its conceived, is a blessing from God.

If that's true then God should go to hell along with all those who believe in this. It's sick.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder
Ut oh arent you putting the devil out of business ?

reply to post by jibeho


How do you reconcile "God has a plan" and "free will". God has a plan but we dont have to follow it? Why would a diety put up with crap like that from us ?

reply to post by Grumble


This God seems to really be the hands off type ya know. Set the wheels spinning and sit back and see where it all goes.

reply to post by windword


Please you absolutely MUST show where in the bible God commands rape. You cannot make a statement like that without backing it up. I demand it.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
He's saying that life can only happen if it's God's will for that life to come about. God creates life. He didn't say that God intends women to get raped .. he said that God intends the life to come from that bad event. At least, I think that's what he's saying. I could be wrong .. but that's what I get reading it.

But as pointed out by another poster above, if God intended the life, he also intended the rape that created the life. You cannot seperate the two events.

Originally posted by 3chainz
Well then, someone should rape Murdoch and see if he thinks God intended it to happen.

Disgusting reply.

These are hysterical misinterpretations of a man who was trying to state that no matter what, abortion is not ok, even for victims of rape. God forbids murder. Christians believe abortion is murder. There is no eye for an eye in Christ's teachings; or it's not ok to sin even if you were the recipient of another's sin.
Maybe that unborn child would be the most lovable son/daughter a mother could ever hope for? Maybe a blessing from God after such a horrific ordeal? Maybe that is God's Will? Willing peace and love upon one of his hurting children?

reply to post by karen61057


Sure, no problem.

Just to set the stage, lets provide the scriptural theme that takes free will away from women, and their right to say "no."

Genesis 3:16
Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

And now, here's your biblically condoned rape.

(Deuteronomy 20:10-14)

As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder, that you may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.

(Judges 21:10-24 NLT)

"This is what you are to do," they said. "Completely destroy all the males and every woman who is not a virgin." Among the residents of Jabesh-gilead they found four hundred young virgins who had never slept with a man, and they brought them to the camp at Shiloh in the land of Canaan.
.................

But there were not enough women for all of them. ..................

Then they thought of the annual festival of the LORD held in Shiloh, between Lebonah and Bethel, along the east side of the road that goes from Bethel to Shechem. They told the men of Benjamin who still needed wives, "Go and hide in the vineyards. When the women of Shiloh come out for their dances, rush out from the vineyards, and each of you can take one of them home to be your wife!

Number 31 17-1

17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.
18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.

Deuteronomy 21:10-14 NAB)

"When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives, if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife, you may take her home to your house. But before she may live there, she must shave her head and pare her nails and lay aside her captive's garb. After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her, and you shall be her husband and she shall be your wife.

Makes me feel all warm and fuzzy.

reply to post by windword



Wow, So God did command his male followers to enjoy women as spoils of war? No wonder his sons couldn't resist, they raped earthly women who bore the mutant giants.

Kudos to you

I can't imagine growing up knowing I was a consequence of rape. A consequence of brutality. how could i ever view myself as a gift.

To those who say Mourdock didn't mean what he said, Why is the Shape shifter Romney distancing himself from what Richard said? Mitt says he doesn't agree with Mourdock that god intends for rape to happen.

If i understand correctly, Mourdock was saying rape victims have no right to abortion because of god's will?