a motion introduced to place a ban on cigarette sales to anyone born after the year 2000?

Originally posted by TheCaucasianAmerican

Originally posted by Poopooplatter
reply to post by randomtangentsrme

 

The two can't be compared is the whole point. People need a car, people don't need cigarettes.

You actually DON'T need a car you have two legs that's what they were made for , transport.

Just because its easier didn't mean you need it.

How does one ship goods??? Exactly. Use your brain man. People also don't live close to their work. This is the easiest argument by far in the world. You can't compare smoking with emissions. There should be more strict emission laws, but people have to drive. Quit pointing the finger everywhere else.

Originally posted by DerekJR321
As a smoker.. I can honestly say that I am so sick and tired of "non-smokers" complaining all the time.

In New York, we are not allowed to smoke near buildings, not allowed to smoke in bars, etc etc etc. We are taxed like crazy ($10+ for one pack). We are constantly put down, ridiculed and called stupid names by people such as the OP. And its all nonsense.

Don't want your kids to smoke? Be a better parent and educate them. Don't say "oh well all cigarettes should be illegal" because someone doesn't have the power or the ability to educate their children.

Don't want to breath second hand smoke? That's fine. As a smoker, who knows plenty of other smokers I can say that I don't know any one of them who blows smoke in others faces. Or who blows smoke at kids. When I would smoke at work, we would intentionally go away from the buildings, side walks or any other "public" area. Not that we had to. We were just being courteous.

If you want to get rid of cigarettes because they "clog up your hospitals" then you damn well better press for getting rid of ALL alcohol. I know the innocent victims of drunk drivers clog up your hospitals right? Or the chronic alcoholics who need constant treatment, or liver transplants. They too clog up your hospitals.

I'm just sick of this one sided view on smoking.

If I never smelled your smoke I never would complain. Sounds like you are trying to be courteous but I see no way to avoid everyone in nyc.

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
This is true, booze is restricted, yet it is still freely enjoyed by many.

For now

Yet, Cigs are not restrictd (to the point i can smoke in the streets surrounded by children) and people are already calling bloody mary over 'proposed' restrictions.

Throughout various states in Australia smoking is banned in pubs, clubs, casinos, hospitals, work places, public transport, childrens playgrounds, restaurants, schools, shopping centres, sports stadiums, taxis, cars with children under 16, malls and most likely many more.

I have no problem with any of those. My issue is that unlike booze, there is no where I can smoke freely while out enjoying myself.

I really don't understand why a business shouldn't be allowed to decide to be a smoking establishment. We would have smoking and non smoking pubs and people would have the [*choice*]. As it stands they are removing all choice.

If Cigs had a value, if they had benefits of some sort or brought feelings of euphoria etc, then ok maybe there would be an argument.

That's bit of a subjective argument though. I enjoy a cigarette.

But cigs are nothing but a corporations way of making money by making you hooked. Its as simple as that.

They've taken away the choice to grow it ourselves if we didn't want to hand money over to tobacco companies. Why'd they do that? Tax.

Cheers for the debate, work sucks today!

A bit boring here today too

reply to post by Poopooplatter


Yup well I live in the mountains with 3000 people in the town. Odds of me blowing smoke and it actually making it to someones nose? Almost nil ... so ya.

Originally posted by Poopooplatter

Originally posted by aaron2209
reply to post by Poopooplatter

 

If you think the debunking of propaganda isn't important, why are you on this site?

All I did was prove your debunking of an out dated article not important. This doesn't explain my overall view of debunking propaganda. Get real!

No you ignored facts because it didn't align with your beliefs.

Originally posted by TheCaucasianAmerican
reply to post by DerekJR321

 

What!?!?! I pay $3.70 for a pack!!! $10 that's nuts I thought I was ripped off

sorry bro.

I paid $10.52 today for a pack of Marlboro's.... only place I can get cigarettes cheap in NY is on the Reservation.

reply to post by 0zzymand0s


They've declared war on it already.

Just think of the things that have now been restricted. Here in Canada, all tobacco advertising is banned. All the sporting events that were sponsored by tobacco companies has been banned from that advertising. The packages now have huge pictures on them of graphic stuff and they cover three quarters of the packages...

www.smoke-free.ca...

The war is truly on and they are winning. I am happy about that actually. Not because of the oppressive actions but because I'd like to see a smoke free society but I'd like to see it by choice not forced upon anyone. Adults should be free to make that choice on their own. Nothing is demonized and attacked as a product then tobacco. The dude I debated on the radio said something to the affect of...

"No other product is in our sites like tobacco. We want it so that it becomes so hard for people to get the products that they disappear from society. "

That right there is blatant attack on freedom and these people don't care what you or any other freedom loving person thinks. They hate the product and they want it gone. And they have the money and lobby power to make it happen. Check the link I put in a previous post. They don't spend that money on research, it's to fight the war.

Originally posted by Poopooplatter

Originally posted by TheCaucasianAmerican

Originally posted by Poopooplatter
reply to post by randomtangentsrme

 

The two can't be compared is the whole point. People need a car, people don't need cigarettes.

You actually DON'T need a car you have two legs that's what they were made for , transport.

Just because its easier didn't mean you need it.

How does one ship goods??? Exactly. Use your brain man. People also don't live close to their work. This is the easiest argument by far in the world. You can't compare smoking with emissions. There should be more strict emission laws, but people have to drive. Quit pointing the finger everywhere else.

So move within a block of your work. Only buy local goods. Don't point the finger at lesser polluters if you are not willing to keep your own poisons out of the air. You do not need to continue to support those that grossly pollute our planet.
We have compared smoking to emissions, but you do not like the comparison, because it deflates your argument completely.

Originally posted by TheCaucasianAmerican
reply to post by Poopooplatter

 

Yup well I live in the mountains with 3000 people in the town. Odds of me blowing smoke and it actually making it to someones nose? Almost nil ... so ya.

Haha well I wish I could say the same but I'm stuck in a tobacco driven area filled with rude people that will even smoke with kids in cars. Lots of things are inaccurate as far as accusations towards Kentucky, but we seriously have a smoking issue.

Originally posted by DerekJR321

Originally posted by TheCaucasianAmerican
reply to post by DerekJR321

 

What!?!?! I pay $3.70 for a pack!!! $10 that's nuts I thought I was ripped off

sorry bro.

I paid $10.52 today for a pack of Marlboro's.... only place I can get cigarettes cheap in NY is on the Reservation.

Lucky bugger, $14 for a pack of 20s and just broken $40 for a 50g pack of rolling tobacco. Goes up twice a year here in Feb and Aug

Originally posted by Poopooplatter

Originally posted by TheCaucasianAmerican
reply to post by Poopooplatter

 

Yup well I live in the mountains with 3000 people in the town. Odds of me blowing smoke and it actually making it to someones nose? Almost nil ... so ya.

Haha well I wish I could say the same but I'm stuck in a tobacco driven area filled with rude people that will even smoke with kids in cars. Lots of things are inaccurate as far as accusations towards Kentucky, but we seriously have a smoking issue.

Yup. Well that's not my problem. You have a car save up some money and leave that town if its so smoky.

Originally posted by randomtangentsrme

Originally posted by Poopooplatter

Originally posted by TheCaucasianAmerican

Originally posted by Poopooplatter
reply to post by randomtangentsrme

 

The two can't be compared is the whole point. People need a car, people don't need cigarettes.

You actually DON'T need a car you have two legs that's what they were made for , transport.

Just because its easier didn't mean you need it.

How does one ship goods??? Exactly. Use your brain man. People also don't live close to their work. This is the easiest argument by far in the world. You can't compare smoking with emissions. There should be more strict emission laws, but people have to drive. Quit pointing the finger everywhere else.

So move within a block of your work. Only buy local goods. Don't point the finger at lesser polluters if you are not willing to keep your own poisons out of the air. You do not need to continue to support those that grossly pollute our planet.
We have compared smoking to emissions, but you do not like the comparison, because it deflates your argument completely.

Lol yes in an ideal world. I work in an industrial area with no homes even close. Got a better job? I'll take it, but for righteous I have to make do. You still can't solve the shipping issue. Trucks have to exists. Trains only get you so far.

Originally posted by TheCaucasianAmerican

Originally posted by Poopooplatter

Originally posted by TheCaucasianAmerican
reply to post by Poopooplatter

 

Yup well I live in the mountains with 3000 people in the town. Odds of me blowing smoke and it actually making it to someones nose? Almost nil ... so ya.

Haha well I wish I could say the same but I'm stuck in a tobacco driven area filled with rude people that will even smoke with kids in cars. Lots of things are inaccurate as far as accusations towards Kentucky, but we seriously have a smoking issue.

Yup. Well that's not my problem. You have a car save up some money and leave that town if its so smoky.

No I'm not leaving they should. Their choice to smoke, go away. I didn't choose to inhale it.

reply to post by DerekJR321


Can you tell me what benefits smoking has on society?
I agree with you, and glad someone finally said being decent means finding a private place to smoke, cudos to you.
but, and this is a big but, smoke drifts.... which is why non-smoking and smoking sections never worked.

Secondly, If me and my kids are wlaking in a park and a smoker is walking towards us, why do we have to move? we arent the ones smoking, he's polluting the air around him and we have to walk through it.

I don't get why this has turned into a smoker vs anti smoker debate. they are not banning people who smoke from smoking, they are stopping people who don't smoke now from starting.

I have mixed feelings, the right to choose is being taken away, but at the same time there will be a generation who will not make the same mistake as most of us smokers. i tell my kids you better never smoke, how is it any different to this? do you tell your kids not to smoke? are you infringing on their freedoms if you do? or do you just want them to be healthy and not make the same mistakes?

I don't see this a negative infringement. and nobody who smokes would be prevented from doing so unless your about 12 years old and then the question would be why the hell are you smoking at that age?

this proposal means smokers can continue to smoke and eventually the population will be weened of them and will not miss anything because they never started to smoke in the first place and will not be craving them and making mistakes they wish they never made.

if you like to smoke your not being prevented from doing so. only the people who never started are and therefore will not crave or miss it.

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
reply to post by DerekJR321

 

Can you tell me what benefits smoking has on society?
I agree with you, and glad someone finally said being decent means finding a private place to smoke, cudos to you.
but, and this is a big but, smoke drifts.... which is why non-smoking and smoking sections never worked.

Secondly, If me and my kids are wlaking in a park and a smoker is walking towards us, why do we have to move? we arent the ones smoking, he's polluting the air around him and we have to walk through it.

Great point. Let's go for the positives. I feel as though the negatives already favor the non smokers. What do smokers have for positives?

Originally posted by lifeform11
I don't get why this has turned into a smoker vs anti smoker debate. they are not banning people who smoke from smoking, they are stopping people who don't smoke now from starting.

I'll admit I jumped on this and probably got carried away as it has been a decade of being treated like a second class citizen and having rule upon rule dumped on me and constantly hearing about more and more and more.

Also, I just don't see it being a success. After all drugs are illegal.

reply to post by Poopooplatter


A better job? Move and become a tobacco farmer? There will be plenty of fresh air, and you can ban smoking on your farm.

Hey man, I drive to work too. I'm not condemning you, just pointing out there are better crusades than smoking and second hand smoke, especially with the margin of error of the studies ( and the samples) as they are.

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
reply to post by DerekJR321

 

Can you tell me what benefits smoking has on society?

Apart from the fact that not everything every individual does needs to have a benefit on society, I would say the billions in revenue that goes towards all sorts of public services.

reply to post by Agit8dChop


Yay! An other law that tells Americans what they can and can not put into their bodies!

Maybe there will be a law against over opinionated people from allowing their opinions to hinder the rights and freedoms of others?

LOL NOPE! Just more rights taken away!