Let's clear up a few things about Truth

you cannot know it if you are dishonest, in denial or willful ignorance.

The dishonesty you put between yourself and others is what makes you ignorant of Truth.

1 day of honesty is equal to 4 years of university and 1 year of ATS.

Truth is God.

Truth is neither good nor evil. It does not judge or punish. It is not subjective unless you are Truth.

Honesty in self makes everything clear. The Truth of any conspiracy, history, future exists as an expression of information. When you are honest and no longer feel threatened by Reality and so do not deny it, you can see, hear, touch experience this information directly.

The idea of studying, seeking, researching is what you do to allow yourself to accept the Truth that pre-exists before you even read a single sentence, or watch a second of video, or listen to a single word from an expert.

Knowing is not magic. And it is not about learning. Faith is not belief. Faith is not religious. It is about honesty. Accepting the Truth. We are not inventing the Truth. We are expressing it or denying it.

Consider gravity. The dumbest creatures on the planet KNOW the Truth of it. Gravity was not discovered.

So too with everything. Science and Religion are frameworks of nomenclature. Nothing more. Nothing less.

The Truth is not literal. Two honest people can share the DEEPEST understanding of the universe and God without speaking a single word. No white paper, bible or expose needed.

For the ignorant, overcoming the pride and defense of a nomenclature framework is a matter of honesty.

Originally posted by rwfresh
you cannot know it if you are dishonest, in denial or willful ignorance.

The dishonesty you put between yourself and others is what makes you ignorant of Truth.

1 day of honesty is equal to 4 years of university and 1 year of ATS.

Truth is God.

Truth is neither good nor evil. It does not judge or punish. It is not subjective unless you are Truth.

Honesty in self makes everything clear. The Truth of any conspiracy, history, future exists as an expression of information. When you are honest and no longer feel threatened by Reality and so do not deny it, you can see, hear, touch experience this information directly.

The idea of studying, seeking, researching is what you do to allow yourself to accept the Truth that pre-exists before you even read a single sentence, or watch a second of video, or listen to a single word from an expert.

Knowing is not magic. And it is not about learning. Faith is not belief. Faith is not religious. It is about honesty. Accepting the Truth. We are not inventing the Truth. We are expressing it or denying it.

Consider gravity. The dumbest creatures on the planet KNOW the Truth of it. Gravity was not discovered.

So too with everything. Science and Religion are frameworks of nomenclature. Nothing more. Nothing less.

The Truth is not literal. Two honest people can share the DEEPEST understanding of the universe and God without speaking a single word. No white paper, bible or expose needed.

For the ignorant, overcoming the pride and defense of a nomenclature framework is a matter of honesty.

edit on 2-10-2011 by rwfresh because: (no reason given)

Reads like you're trying to sell God and keep people from the truth to me. And that's the truth

Originally posted by steveknows


Reads like you're trying to sell God and keep people from the truth to me. And that's the truth

How can someone keep you from something that they don't have the ability to keep you from? Each individual keeps themselves from the truth by dishonesty. Then they collectively blame each other to remain willfully ignorant.

Originally posted by rwfresh


Knowing is not magic. And it is not about learning. Faith is not belief. Faith is not religious. It is about honesty. Accepting the Truth. We are not inventing the Truth. We are expressing it or denying it.

Consider gravity. The dumbest creatures on the planet KNOW the Truth of it. Gravity was not discovered.

So too with everything. Science and Religion are frameworks of nomenclature. Nothing more. Nothing less.

edit on 2-10-2011 by rwfresh because: (no reason given)

While I agree with parts of this.....I have some issues with other parts. For instance the part I quoted. Animals don't "know" gravity, they experience it....by your arguement a rock would also "know" gravity. I think you are trying to argue that common sense trumps knowledge and scientific research....which is simply not true. While common sense is a great thing, it often leads us to false conclusions....Common sense told us that the Earth was flat, and that the Sun circled around it. Knowledge and scientific advancement proved such 'common sense' wrong.

As another example....look at the Monty Hall logic/probability puzzle


Common sense would tell you that you have a 50/50 chance at choosing the correct door, yet probability theory shows that this is simply not true....In fact people have actually physically done this test in the real world with paper cards thousands of times, and the end result proves that the 'common sense' answer is demonstrably wrong in the very real world.....Probability theory is proven right time and time again, whenever anyone takes the time to test this theory out with a real world example.

How can you not know if you are dishonest, perhaps you should google the definition of dishonest.

reply to post by rwfresh


its ignorant to think that i should put my trust in somebody whom i cannot see. left a great story book though lol but as far as the rest ALRIGHTY THEN GO ON WIT UR BAD SELF

Originally posted by rwfresh


1 day of honesty is equal to 4 years of university and 1 year of ATS.

Currently I am job seeking. I want to put this on my resume. Do you think prospective employers will take this as the truth?

reply to post by bhornbuckle75


Hi Thanks for your thoughts. Truth is not common sense. Although common sense can and has been mistaken for Truth.

You say common sense told us the earth was flat. How do you know? Many people and cultures knew the earth was round.

Science is a nomenclature. It is not truth. It is a way of communicating truth. And often a way of miscommunicating Truth.

The truth is pre-existant to ANY discovery. And in most cases the discoverer was open to the true result which is generally why an experiment is conducted in the first place.

Also, we should be honest about scientific truths. It's generally a matter of time before they require manipulation and modification to remain True. At the heart of scientific knowledge is an assumption.

Also the earth is not round. It is more oval shaped. Wikipedia says it's an oblate spheroid. Did Magellan call it an oblate spheroid?

I say this to point out something which can be experienced as True. And that is, any nomenclature is not Truth. It is a by product of truth.

I'm not trying to be a smart ass or condescending. There is no doubt in my mind that at the very leading edge of Science are the equivalent of spiritual ascetics who's experiments are the masses/rituals which lead to REAL experiences of Truth. FOR THEM. Me reading about e=mc squared is a kin to me reading about an ascetic meditating in a cave for 2 years. Einstein and the ascetic had the experience of Truth and i end up reading about it. Yes i know muons now potentially travel faster than light ;')

Originally posted by Autodidactic
How can you not know if you are dishonest, perhaps you should google the definition of dishonest.

You are right. Sorry. Everyone does know if they are being dishonest.

It would have been more accurate for me to say: I cannot experience myself as Truth if I am knowingly denying it.

Originally posted by MissCoyote
reply to post by rwfresh

 

its ignorant to think that i should put my trust in somebody whom i cannot see. left a great story book though lol but as far as the rest ALRIGHTY THEN GO ON WIT UR BAD SELF

Then why would you think that?

You believe that being honest makes you vulnerable. It does.

reply to post by rwfresh

Truth is God.

if that statement is true - please proove it

reply to post by ignorant_ape


How can anyone prove Truth to you? Admit it's impossible.

Originally posted by rwfresh


Also the earth is not round. It is more oval shaped. Wikipedia says it's an oblate spheroid. Did Magellan call it an oblate spheroid?

I have no idea. I never met Magellan. How do you know what he called it? Are you assuming he called it anything? Perhaps your first problem with truth is that you even read anything on Wikipedia.

I'm not trying to be a smart ass or condescending. There is no doubt in my mind that at the very leading edge of Science are the equivalent of spiritual ascetics who's experiments are the masses/rituals which lead to REAL experiences of Truth. FOR THEM. Me reading about e=mc squared is a kin to me reading about an ascetic meditating in a cave for 2 years. Einstein and the ascetic had the experience of Truth and i end up reading about it. Yes i know muons now potentially travel faster than light ;')

Ok, how did we get to this, from wanting to know what the truth really is.

I thought I was confused by your original post about truth....Apparently your idea of truth is just what it is. An experiment in trial and error by anyone who dares to put it to use.

To tell you the truth, I think you have lost me on what your idea of the truth is.

Originally posted by supine

Originally posted by rwfresh


1 day of honesty is equal to 4 years of university and 1 year of ATS.

Currently I am job seeking. I want to put this on my resume. Do you think prospective employers will take this as the truth?

The prospective employer you want to work for will. Are you a software developer? If you are honest about your ability and your intent i would hire you for sure over a dishonest, self-ignorant holder of a university degree. But someone who is just as honest with a university degree would probably be hired first..

reply to post by rwfresh


I agree rwfresh. That is if I understand your point.
How can we understand truth if we are not truthful ourselves?
This I think is what you say here.

Truth? Way beyond my ability to discern.
What I can discern is my own ability to tell the truth. Simple?
If my own ability to tell the truth is weak, then it is because I have not practiced enough.
Practicing telling the truth as much a possible teaches one how simple it is to lie.
And learning how simple it is to lie, one learns how simple it is to be lied to.

Stopping ourselves from lying allows us to understand all those times when we might have lied.
Lots of little ones, one after another after another after another until finally we have begun to clear ourselves of those lying circuits in our brains. And the truth begins to make itself known to us.

Is so?

Originally posted by rwfresh

Also the earth is not round. It is more oval shaped. Wikipedia says it's an oblate spheroid. Did Magellan call it an oblate spheroid?

I have no idea. I never met Magellan. How do you know what he called it? Are you assuming he called it anything? Perhaps your first problem with truth is that you even read anything on Wikipedia.

Well at least you are being honest.. You have no idea. I guess neither of us are qualified to be talking about him.

I'm not trying to be a smart ass or condescending. There is no doubt in my mind that at the very leading edge of Science are the equivalent of spiritual ascetics who's experiments are the masses/rituals which lead to REAL experiences of Truth. FOR THEM. Me reading about e=mc squared is a kin to me reading about an ascetic meditating in a cave for 2 years. Einstein and the ascetic had the experience of Truth and i end up reading about it. Yes i know muons now potentially travel faster than light ;')

Ok, how did we get to this, from wanting to know what the truth really is.

I thought I was confused by your original post about truth....Apparently your idea of truth is just what it is. An experiment in trial and error by anyone who dares to put it to use.

To tell you the truth, I think you have lost me on what your idea of the truth is.

Well to put it simply.. be honest, that's where we can go to experience the truth first hand. Something you already knew.

Originally posted by TerryMcGuire
reply to post by rwfresh

 

I agree rwfresh. That is if I understand your point.
How can we understand truth if we are not truthful ourselves?
This I think is what you say here.

Truth? Way beyond my ability to discern.
What I can discern is my own ability to tell the truth. Simple?
If my own ability to tell the truth is weak, then it is because I have not practiced enough.
Practicing telling the truth as much a possible teaches one how simple it is to lie.
And learning how simple it is to lie, one learns how simple it is to be lied to.

Stopping ourselves from lying allows us to understand all those times when we might have lied.
Lots of little ones, one after another after another after another until finally we have begun to clear ourselves of those lying circuits in our brains. And the truth begins to make itself known to us.

Is so?

Yes you understand it perfectly and put it in a beautiful way.

I expect truth to be powerful, and my challenge is to let go of my vision of what power is. I will never know the awesome power of truth if i keep expecting it to express itself in the way I assume it should be.

In terms of knowable information.. I believe quite literally, that the most honest person in the world is also the most intelligent. Because they hold absolutely no bias. They are completely open to Reality.

A dishonest man is paranoid and sees lies everywhere.
An honest man knows only the Truth.

reply to post by rwfresh

I expect truth to be powerful, and my challenge is to let go of my vision of what power is. I will never know the awesome power of truth if i keep expecting it to express itself in the way I assume it should be.

Now that sounds like wisdom to me.

In terms of knowable information.. I believe quite literally, that the most honest person in the world is also the most intelligent. Because they hold absolutely no bias. They are completely open to Reality.

Figuratively this is a charming thought, though I think, if taken literally it might be to absolutist. For me, this truth is more compelling when approached by understanding it as the "more" honest person and a "more" intelligent person and "more" open to reality. I don't know as we CAN understand absolutes literally. I think we have figurative truth when we reach these levels of honesty. Maybe.

A dishonest man is paranoid and sees lies everywhere.

An honest man may tell lies he thinks to be truthful. He is a deceived man. Knowing we are deceived if by nothing more than our own senses and neural /chemical composition, allows us the opportunity to enter into concentrated self introspection and the road of increased honesty. This man I think also will see lies everywhere with out paranoia. Or little paranoia.

reply to post by TerryMcGuire

Knowing we are deceived if by nothing more than our own senses and neural /chemical composition, allows us the opportunity to enter into concentrated self introspection and the road of increased honesty. This man I think also will see lies everywhere with out paranoia. Or little paranoia.

Takes some serious effort... Perhaps a little while to cool down too!

System of Truth

How about it?

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