"Playing The Race Card"?? Yeah Right!!! You Don't Know The Half!!

Originally posted by ProphecyPhD
Why must people place blame on the young boys? Why can't they just accept it for what it is? The youngsters were PROFILED and half of you are tripping over your selves to blame something on them.

It's not a question of ''putting blame on them'', it's an attempt to analyse the situation in a more critical manner. As previously stated, he says that they asked the manager why he was following them three times, which was before he started filming.

Without seeing these interactions it's impossible to gauge the incident as a whole, let alone jump to premature conclusions. It might have been a genuine misunderstanding which led to them being followed, or they may have given the manager some cheek and he carried on following them as a way to ''exert his authority'' over a couple of young whippersnappers.

Those are just two speculative, yet possible, alternatives to explain the ''incident''.

There is no overt racism in the video, only the opinions of the teenager. To believe out-of-hand that the manager was racially profiling them on the basis of that video is an absolutely huge assumption which doesn't have any qualifiable evidence to back it up.

The point is, the manager may or may not have had a racially biased motive for following them, but to automatically make a knee-jerk cry of ''racism'' doesn't do anybone any favours. Frivolously throwing the ''race card'' around not only trivialises genuine and inarguable racism, but it's also not a very nice accusation to make towards someone who has not been shown to have acted in a definitively racist manner.

Originally posted by 2012srb
What they need is a boot in the *** for playing games with the staff.

I blame the parents.

WHile you're here can you give me the list of approved garments to wear to the grocery store?

No hats
No hooded sweatshirts
NOTHING that would be considered Middle Eastern or Muslim (god forbid)
No SeanJohn, PhatFarm or RocaWear

What am i allowed to wear? I would hate to get a boot in the butt because of my ignorance.

reply to post by Sherlock Holmes


Star for you. Thank you for actually having a discussion with me instead of just trolling. You come across as very educated and as a "thinker". What do you think of some of these replies?

Originally posted by thegrandpotato
I'm white and i'm followed all the time in stores and by police too, but its because the way i look. I have tattoos all over and i look young. I'm sure they think i'm stealing or have drugs (which i do not) Let them waste there time though, i think its funny to make them look dumb when they stop me and i have nothing and have done nothing wrong. It entertains me.

Imagine being black with braids and (GASP!!) a HOODED SWEATSHIRT

reply to post by ProphecyPhD


1. Nothing was said about clothing;

2. We only have one side of the story;

3. They played a game with the man, making themselves suspicious.

The same thing would have happened if they were white, Hispanic, or Asian.

I have no sympathy because your perspective is warped.

Originally posted by ProphecyPhD
reply to post by TheRealTruth84

 

That was the MANAGER not security and they did laugh, pay for their items and leave. Did you watch the whole video? Maybe you should read the whole thread as well to gain a better perspective on the discussion going on. Did you read some of these replies? Did you read the one directly under your last post?

The fact is these paying customers were profiled for apparently no reason. The people defending such actions are the point of the thread.

Yes I watched the whole video, the manager was waving to the camera by the end...Yes I have read the entire thread, hence me speaking up regarding the way you have handled certain logical replies. The reply directly under my own was an example of the ignorance in which you will need to learn to handle and deflect positively. Again racism will never completely go away, when you open a thread pertaining to it, you open the door to those that are looking to attack you. Kind of like starting a thread saying, Democrats are awesome! Republicans are the reason we are in the gutter! Imagine the tornado that would create! Yet, this is politics, he said she said, I'm right you are wrong...etc.

I understand logic can be hard to swallow, but it is the closest thing we have to truth at this time. As U.S. citizens we are not in the position to start bashing one another over every little disagreement. We are in a situation that is calling for us to band together as one and confront the wrong doings of our gov't. and certain military institutions. Don't worry, your forefathers did an amazing job creating equality and acceptance in the world and they brought it to a point in which it could have never been w/o some incredible figures behind the movement. Women rights also rings a bell here...
There are much more pressing issues at hand currently that need to be tackled as a whole and not as individuals. Let the ignorant remain ignorant, and let the realist rise up and regain power once again.

reply to post by ProphecyPhD

Maybe you should log off ATS and go study, with a high GPA you won't need a loan or a scholarship.

Interesting.......

So you think that a high GPA gets you into college for free?

Originally posted by ProphecyPhD
reply to post by TheRealTruth84

 

If these young kids were white i'm sure the thread would be filled with criticism for the manager vs. criticism for wearing a hooded sweatshirt to a supermarket. Did you actually read the responses i got

edit on 7/15/2011 by ProphecyPhD because: added 2nd quote

You are continuing to miss the point. This happens to all people, especially teens, regardless of race. I am not saying that race didn't play apart here, as it very well could have. But to generalize your opinion based on this video, will cause others to question your logic. This is why I keep saying to find another reference to base your opinion off of, this topic is a losing battle as it sits now.
You keep asking me to read all of the post, which I have, I ask you to read all of my post in this thread again. I am not against you, I am for you, I only look to help broaden your views and provide some logical feedback.
In regards to the manager, the dude is a jitbag who I'm sure was pissed off when the teens in the video confronted him the way they did. At this point we change the topic from race, to testosterone and anger...they ticked him off so he found it necessary to tail them the entire time. Right? No. Racism? We can never tell for sure...again we aren't standing in his shoes.

reply to post by ProphecyPhD

Everyone seems to agree that the young boys were being profiled/stereotyped. We can all clearly see them purchase something and in no way shape or form were they threatening or even mischievous. I'm just pointing out a very small portion of something that happens every single day to people who might not even be aware of these types of activities. I am a black male and this is something i can relate to (and a lot worse) so i wanted to share it with you guys.

i agree with this. they are certainly stereo typed, the only real discussion is based on what? skin color, the way they were dressed, or age, or a mixture of two or three of them.

they were treated unfairly either way.

Reply to post by lifeform11

Ah, bull puckey.

You're LOOKING for something to complain about.

They played a game with that man.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply to post by ProphecyPhD


That is incorrect. I could not get a scholarship with a 4.0 GPA because I was not a minority and made too much money. These days, scholarships have less to do with grades than they used to...

reply to post by ProphecyPhD


I know...
he was totally following you like you were a white guy.
no respect

Originally posted by ProphecyPhD

Originally posted by jerryznv
reply to post by ProphecyPhD

 

WHITE PEOPLE WOULD NOT LET BLACK PEOPLE READ, WRITE OR SUPPORT THEIR FAMILIES FOR 400 YEARS.

I didn't have anything to do with what happened in the past to black people...so why am I excluded from loans and scholarships that only apply to minorities?

How long should I be oppressed from higher learning based on my skin color before it changes up again?

How are you being oppressed? Are you saying that there are only loans and scholarships for black people? Maybe you should log off ATS and go study, with a high GPA you won't need a loan or a scholarship.

Sorry but I thought I had linked this quote to my previous response:

That is incorrect. I could not get a scholarship with a 4.0 GPA because I was not a minority and made too much money. (NOT a lot of money mind you, but just enough to get by.) These days, scholarships have less to do with grades than they used to... NOBODY likes feeling that they are being discriminated against.

reply to post by Sherlock Holmes

Not in the UK. According to Home Office figures, convictions for petty theft amongst those aged 21 and under makes up over 60% of the overall total.

Because elderly people are not busted as often. Why? They don't look "suspicious"

Really, that's the truth of it. But no, it can't be that way, because the elderly do not look suspicious damn it! Quick, grab additional incomplete statistics to prove it ain't so.

Yes, I am saying that it's usually the socio-economic and sub-cultural implications of young people dressing this way which leads employers to profile and discriminate against them, not the racial factor.

AH so being racists in a politically correct way is a good thing you say.

Pointing out, as you are seemingly too obtuse to realise, the ridiculousness of your comments which you made in your initial post. Need I remind you of them ? OK, I guess I have to:

It's quite simple really; don't make excuses when you don't understand. Need you be reminded of this? I did not think so.

Considering that I was one of the people who was pointing out that the motivation for the manager to follow the two teenagers may have been because of how they were dressed, you were snidely and cowardly tarring me as making underhanded racist comments, despite the fact that I did no such thing.

The mere fact that you feel you need to post to make sure the manager is NOT looked at as a racist is telling to me. Minimizing the OP's post as well and that in one breath.

Of course. Businesses are invariably amorally driven, and their main priority is making money. If one demographic is more likely to commit theft than others ( such as teenagers from lower-socio economic backgrounds ), then they will tar all of them with the same brush.

So you just said it is okay to discriminate. Sorry, but you're losing your grip.

It has everything to do with the OP's post and your rather ill-informed, unelightened initial post in this thread.

Ill-informed and unenlightened? It's okay.

First of all, you asked what ''street'' clothing meant, so I provide you with an image of what I would consider ''street'' clothing to mean.

Your assumption that I do not know what it means is ridiculous. What I am doing is breaking that mold you so snugly fit in, but you can't take it. And you're talking about unenlightened...

The fact of the matter is that, whether you like it or not, those teenagers in the photo I provided would be stereotyped as soon as they entered the shop, purely because of their look.

Whether you like it or not, that has NOTHING to do with the OPs post. It's called a straw man.

The video in the OP showed two teenagers in similarly attired ''street'' clothing, yet the automatic assumption was that racism was the reason why the manager chose to follow them.

You assume too much. I bet the OP knows what I say when I say; Not the first time.

I agree that there may well have been a racial motive to the manager's actions, but, then again, it may well have been because of how they were dressed, or how they were acting before the camera started rolling.

It may have...it may have been....or maybe it was that....no this, definitely this.

You're talking about enlightened. How enlightened does this last bit I quote from you sound? Sounds pretty ignorant to me...

To knee-jerkly throw around terms like ''racist'' without first thinking of other reasons why something happened is not very helpful and also counterproductive, not to mention rude, insulting and slanderous to the person who you have accused without any supporting evidence.

Yes of course it is, grow the # up will you.

I have been discriminated against on a number of occasions because of my skin colour. The thing is, I don't tend to cry about it and wallow in a sea of victimhood.

Yeh? How have you been discriminated against? Ever wonder WHY?

The world isn't perfect, racists will be racists, and it's not worth the time or effort getting too worked up about the thoughts of the more Neanderthalic amongst us.

Yes, I've maybe saved a life or two like this. Doesn't mean I'm not going to call anyone out with words. It exists, and it has existed for a long time. Why is it allowed to exist? I'll let you figure that one out since you are enlightened, big boy.

reply to post by ProphecyPhD


You probably stole something from the shop the previous week
Second....................

Originally posted by ProphecyPhD
Star for you. Thank you for actually having a discussion with me instead of just trolling. You come across as very educated and as a "thinker". What do you think of some of these replies?

Well, thank you for your kind words. I fear, however, that they are misplaced, as if you met me in person you'd quickly realise that I am as thick as a brick.

Sadly, all threads discussing racial subjects tend to bring out some people who, hiding behind the anonymity of the internet, decide to let their thinly-veiled racial prejudices boil over into unpleasant comments.

While I think that some posters mentioning affirmative action, black scholarships, BET etc. have valid arguments and concerns, I believe that your thread was intended to highlight the subtle and pervasive nature of racism that can affect people on a day-to-day, low-key basis.

Topics about racism always end up leaving me feeling rather depressed, because the fight against racism and prejudice always seems insurmountable and hopeless.

Even statistics back this up. In the US, 72% of people are white and 13% are black. So, for every 100 people that a black person meets, 87 of them could potentially be someone who harbours racist thoughts towards black people. Whereas, for every 100 people that a white person meets, only 28 of them could be potential anti-white racists.

Ignoring all of the other historical, cultural and other factors which contribute to the racial divide, it's just statistical probability that black Americans, on average, will have to endure three times as much racism as white Americans.

This leads to self-perpetuation of negative and harmful attitudes and a vicious circle of ''whites did this, blacks did that'' in all communities, which doesn't help anyone.

What can we do about it ? Personally speaking, I'm strongly against ''pulling the race card'', but I actually appreciate the intention of your OP ( although I disagree with the conclusion drawn from that video ).

Pulling the ''pulling the race card'' card ( ) on everything race-related is also a very unhelpful move which is played by some who want to brush these issues under the carpet, or who just want to stifle any reasonable complaints from people of other races.

The whole issue is a mess, and I just wish that people would grow-up and let go of all of these petty, superficial differences within our species.

Sadly, as a realist, I know that this isn't going to happen. :shk:

reply to post by ProphecyPhD


anyone walking around in a store holding a camera in the air is attracting attention to themselves. what do you expect? stores have policies. you're in 'their house', you're not in public. they don't know what someone is doing with the camera. people know of YouTube and flash mobs and security probably doesn't know what to expect. i've read many stores have a no camera policy.

if yellow shirt was a brother would we being seeing this post?

employees have to do what they're told. yellow shirt probably has better things to do than follow you, but he has a boss too. you're old enough to know that.

when you draw attention to yourself you draw attention to yourself. you wanted attention, you got attention. there are 52 cards in a deck. i hope you are not going to play them all, you seem much smarter than that.

as the wise man said of the man in the Jester costume: What good is being a Fool if you don't show everyone?

reply to post by Zamini

Yes, I've maybe saved a life or two like this. Doesn't mean I'm not going to call anyone out with words. It exists, and it has existed for a long time. Why is it allowed to exist? I'll let you figure that one out since you are enlightened, big boy.

I think we've established in this thread that racism exists among a variety of races. It's wrong, yes.

So, my question is, why are you intent on believing you can make people behave the way you want them to? Do you not see that this is an exercise in futility? More than likely, a person who is racist is not going to change. That is the sad truth. The only thing we have control over is our own behavior. It's that simple. Racism is driven by ignorance, intolerance, and fear no matter who is guilty of it.

This issue is very complex, but it ultimately is the responsibility of each individual to examine himself/herself to make changes in racist behavior. Just as someone doesn't like being considered a thug because he is black and wearing a hoodie, a white person doesn't appreciate being stereotyped as a racist who is determined to undermine the black man.

reply to post by NightGypsy

I think we've established in this thread that racism exists among a variety of races. It's wrong, yes.

Well I'm glad you're smart enough not to...ow wait, you did minimize the issue again. In my life I have never seen as much discrimination towards any people as I have seen discrimination towards people because of their skin color. It's nothing short of disgusting really, just because of skin color some people need to be more careful about their image due to the fact that OTHER people feel threatened otherwise? That's DISGUSTING.

So, my question is, why are you intent on believing you can make people behave the way you want them to?

Where did I say this? Where did you get this idea? Or are you projecting your own thoughts once again?

Do you not see that this is an exercise in futility?

Maybe to people who want to see a segregated future or people who are too stupid to think about the future.

More than likely, a person who is racist is not going to change.

When they die it's over though.

That is the sad truth.

Not really. The sad truth is that these racists will try and indoctrinate their children with their racist gibberish.

The only thing we have control over is our own behavior.

So what do you call it when someone spots racism and uses their words to combat that racism? A persons own behavior right? Grow the # up will ya.

It's that simple.

It is simple yeh: STOP MAKING EXCUSES FOR RACISTS.

Racism is driven by ignorance, intolerance, and fear no matter who is guilty of it.

Generic statement number one billion + 1.

reply to post by LargeFries


And another one bites the dust.


You want a side of racist cola with those fries?