Christians: You know who you are praying to? Not who you think

Originally posted by Seektruthalways1
I have heard arguments from Christians such as, the Creator has many names, or it really doesn’t matter what you call Him. Sadly, these folks are mistaken and are gonna find on judgment day. Did I not say the 3rd commandment states you do not take His Name in vain?

It does matter.. It does. I tried having this same conversation with people and their so wrapped up in tradition.


I knew something was wrong, I just didn't know what it was. Why did they use God and Lord in the KJV? That's just common terms with no name meaning at all. It took for me to realize- a trip to Egypt and almost converting to islam in 2006 for me to wake up. I could have been killed easily and no one would ever. I don't talk about this to just anyone. I now have a Restoration Scriptures True Name Edition Bible. But in it, it's Yahweh and Yahshua. I notice the differences in the Names. If that's a mispronunciation- I don't want to be wrong I really want to know. 400 years this lie was being told that what upsets me extremely!!

Originally posted by Leyla

Originally posted by Seektruthalways1
I have heard arguments from Christians such as, the Creator has many names, or it really doesn’t matter what you call Him. Sadly, these folks are mistaken and are gonna find on judgment day. Did I not say the 3rd commandment states you do not take His Name in vain?

It does matter.. It does. I tried having this same conversation with people and their so wrapped up in tradition.


I knew something was wrong, I just didn't know what it was. Why did they use God and Lord in the KJV? That's just common terms with no name meaning at all. It took for me to realize- a trip to Egypt and almost converting to islam in 2006 for me to wake up. I could have been killed easily and no one would ever. I don't talk about this to just anyone. I now have a Restoration Scriptures True Name Edition Bible. But in it, it's Yahweh and Yahshua. I notice the differences in the Names. If that's a mispronunciation- I don't want to be wrong I really want to know. 400 years this lie was being told that what upsets me extremely!!

I have a question for today's Hebraic Judeo-Christians about this name business.

Obviously the OP thinks it's important. Some people posting are convinced it's important.

If it's not akin to a "magic word", then I would wonder WHY exactly it's so important to have this name "right"?

You said it "does matter", and that you've had this conversation before. What do you tell people when they ask, "why" does it matter?

I realize this has been addressed from a couple of angles before, but as the thread gets longer, maybe it's good to get your perspective too, for the benefit of others who just shake their heads and wonder why all the fuss...

JR

reply to post by JR MacBeth

If it's not akin to a "magic word", then. . .

They don't say it in so many words but I have to think that is how it is used.
People have to remember what the context is to the story of The Name.
Think of the serpents made by the sorcerers of the Pharaoh. The Bible does not say it was a trick. If God had given his actual name, and Moses went to Pharaoh and told him what it was, he would have used it in magical spells. God knew better and refused to say His name and "just suffice it to say I am here speaking to you now and I know your ancestors because I was before them."

Originally posted by TDawgRex
Growing up as a military brat and serving as well I liken the holy trinity to a Chain of Command.

Father = the Commander
Son = the Executive Officer
Holy Ghost = the First Sergeant

The first two may help you along your way and help you to accomplish things, but it is the Commander that bestows rewards or punishment. So, that is who I pray & talk to. In private of course, can’t have people thinking I’m crazy.

Hmmm, maybe I’ll put a Bluetooth in. A direct line, ya think?

I know a lot of you out there like a quick summary so here it is.

God good…Religion Bad

Whatever works for ya. It's all cool.

The only problem with this, as I am also a military member, is that the Commander, the Executive Officer, and the First Sergeant are NOT the same person. Christianity claims The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are 3 in 1; and clearly your example is wrong because those three positions are not held by one person.

Also the Chain of Command asks you to go through the lowest level of authority before reaching the Commander, i.e. God. So who do you pray to then?

reply to post by Seektruthalways1
I do not know how to thank you. I can not explain why I believe you. Some how I have always known. Our father, I will call him since I have not learned the correct way to say his holy name, would not want to condemn us for this conspiriacy but because deep in my heart I knew, but he would condemn us because we did not try to find the truth and that is why I am here. I don't want to go into detail but I have asked Christians the questions and have never gotten a correct or satisfying answer or even an answer. I thank you from the bottom of my heart and I will continue to Learn the important names and pray to those whom I love and who I know loves me. Thank you.

reply to post by JR MacBeth



Let's see would you answer if I call you by a name other then your own?

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by JR MacBeth

 

If it's not akin to a "magic word", then. . .

They don't say it in so many words but I have to think that is how it is used.
People have to remember what the context is to the story of The Name.
Think of the serpents made by the sorcerers of the Pharaoh. The Bible does not say it was a trick. If God had given his actual name, and Moses went to Pharaoh and told him what it was, he would have used it in magical spells. God knew better and refused to say His name and "just suffice it to say I am here speaking to you now and I know your ancestors because I was before them."

edit on 3-7-2011 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

Thank you jmdewey60, I've seen many of your posts, you seem to be one of the more knowledgeable Christians here on ATS.

In your example then, there is certainly "power" in the name, but it doesn't look like there was ever intention to have it abused. Makes perfect sense to me.

As far as modern Hebraic Judeo-Christians, I wonder if they shouldn't go all the way, as long as they are trying to return to their roots, and do what Jews do today.

Of course, maybe some of these folks have never been in a synagogue. When Jews read the Scripture, and the rabbi gets to "that word", they go silent. They really take "not using the name in vain", seriously!

I'm not a religionist, so no big deal to me, but I do like to see things like consistency. There is something about this getting the name perfectly right business that smacks of the same stuff as witchcraft, and magic, etc. I'm sure everyone can defend their various reasons, but common sense tells me God can't be as worried about pronunciation as many of these folks seem to be, and further, as you pointed out, he wouldn't hand a "weapon", if that's what it could be, to the bad guys.

I think on this point, your regular more traditional Christians are probably more consistent than their modern Hebraic counterparts, who might not have thought the whole thing through (yet).

Maybe some of them will appreciate your common sense approach, as well as your scriptural example. Good contribution to the thread.

JR

Originally posted by Leyla
reply to post by JR MacBeth

 

Let's see would you answer if I call you by a name other then your own?

Just don't call me late for dinner!

Read jmdewey60's insightful post above that I just responded to. He even has a scripture verse. It might be that there is more to this than God's vanity.

JR

mmm, Jesus Rules! yay!

reply to post by Leyla


You can try yourself online the Restored KJV with the correct names replaced for Father and Son, I use the Scriptures 2009 edition from www.isr-messianic.org... They still spell the Son's name wrong missing the last waw or vav called today. Just remember the real Name of the Father is pronounced Yahuwah, and the Son's Name is Yahuwshuwah.

Originally posted by Seektruthalways1
reply to post by Leyla

 

You can try yourself online the Restored KJV with the correct names replaced for Father and Son, I use the Scriptures 2009 edition from www.isr-messianic.org... They still spell the Son's name wrong missing the last waw or vav called today. Just remember the real Name of the Father is pronounced Yahuwah, and the Son's Name is Yahuwshuwah.

His Name is pronounced in English (and a few other languages) as Jesus just like the spelling sounds and I do not say this due to anything I've read (at least not beforehand) or was taught but rather by direct revelation from a personal visit where I was spoken to in an audible voice yet

Revelation19
His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

reply to post by Seektruthalways1

Just remember the real Name of the Father is pronounced Yahuwah. . .

Nice with the pronunciation part but how about the part of identifying the Father.
There is no direct link that I can find between the angel of Sinai, and the God and Father of Jesus.
Jesus said No man has seen the Father, so that would exclude the person you are talking about.

reply to post by jmdewey60


What does the Name of the Heavenly Father have anything to do with seeing Him? I didnt say anything about that, and why would I? And do you not know that Yahuwah our Heavenly Father is not an author of confusion? How come Christianity teaching is so completely confusing that you need to be "brainwashed" in Seminary School to understand it?

So want to explain how man can change the Name of the Heavenly Father and His Son whenever they want? Who gives man the right to change the WORD OF THE HEAVENLY FATHER. Maybe you should stop blaspheming Him and His Son, and start using the true name. Jesus is a Latin Name, not English.

reply to post by Seektruthalways1
I'm asking how you can show that the God and Father of Jesus ever went by that name in the first place.
The person you are naming was an angel and said that in past times, "I was the one representing the various names that represented god to whoever I was talking to. But now I am representing myself, the person who I am, who I am". He was the great and feared Angel of Sinai.
Now there is this person I describe and the translation of what he was saying to Moses is that name you (wrongly) apply to the Actual God who is above all Gods and is of such a divine nature to not set foot within this creation as long as there is sin it. This is the One who Jesus spoke of and never called by name other than Father and God.

Originally posted by Seektruthalways1
reply to post by jmdewey60

 

Maybe you should stop blaspheming Him and His Son, and start using the true name. Jesus is a Latin Name, not English.

The New Testament was written in Greek.
If you want to get technical, I suggest that we adopt a phonetic written form for Jesus, such as, Iēsoús, since writing it in the Greek characters would be meaningless to most people, as in the saying, "that's Greek to me!"
So copy that and have it on your desktop to paste it in, whenever you come to where the name of the Son of God would be appropriate.

Here is something helpful when reading the New Testament.
I will post the link so you (meaning anyone who reads this)
can benefit in the same way as I do.
www.helding.net...
Listen to the MP3 of someone who knows the old pronunciation,
as you read along with the old Greek script, a lot better.
Listening to this reader, it seems to be very similar to the Spanish
pronunciation but without the harsh H at the beginning.

reply to post by jmdewey60


I not going to bother arguing. Obviously you didnt come here to talk about my OP, but just to confuse people with your explanations and to make it sound like you know what your talking about. This is exactly how the preachers and scholars and thologians nowadays speak.

1. First get an audience by having something to attract them to you.
2. Then start talking in simple terms they can understand to get them to pay attention.
3. Next, start throwing out big words, phrases, and meanings that are completely meaningless to confuse and dumbfound them.
4. Now you have successfully brainwashed your audience. Now end off your conversation with something simple that everyone will understand.
5. And now your audience 'thinks your very wise" and will treat you as such and listen to everything you say without question.

Romans 1:22-23

Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
And changed the esteem of the uncorruptible Alahym into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

reply to post by Seektruthalways1
You had an earlier thread by the same name and you abandoned that in favor of the newer one.
I could not see what the difference was except for a lot of questions you did not want to answer. I will not think worse of you if you start another new one and abandon this one. I will respect your thing and stay off it, so you can promote your agenda in peace. Just to be on topic, I should add: I have an idea who I am praying to and I get that from Ἰησοῦς, in the New Testament.

reply to post by jmdewey60


I missed some things on my first thread, and it wasnt laid out the way I wanted it, so I made another hoping it worked out better. I am no afraid of questions, dont see why you came to that conclusion.

reply to post by Seektruthalways1
Just from looking at a bunch of posts towards the later pages and the absence of posts by you in answer.
Don't take it too personally and you most likely mean well and are concerned for people.
I don't think you are like an agent supporting someone else's agenda, just your own.
Anyway don't get too paranoid about me. I'm not one to dog people, and once I tell someone something I leave it at that, having discharged my obligation of saying what I think is true.
I don't have an interest in refuting your every post and probably none of your posts, at this point.