'Fearmongers' Were Right about Obamacare

Originally posted by tylermbell
reply to post by DarkspARCS

 

we have awhile until we have to worry about 'obamacare'.

its not implemented so why complain about it. shouting at an invisible threat.

Yeah, what he said! I MUCH prefer waiting until a bear has his teeth in my ass before doing anything to try to stop that from occurring!



[edit on 2010/5/4 by nenothtu]

This garbage needs to be "repealed and replaced" immediately. How many times was the public warned about this from the republicans? This is not the only study to state these facts. All the people who believed Obama the "Great One" are just plain ignorant.

Originally posted by piddles
all of you people always describe the HCR bill as some kind of homosexual fantasy when the current system guarantees you will pay WAY more than necessary..."out the ass" if you will.


whatever dudes

[edit on 4-5-2010 by piddles]

Huh? You can't possibly be serious - and actually be thinking - all at the same time.

Under the 'current' system, not only do I NOT 'pay out the ass', I don't pay anything at all. I take care of my own health, doctors, hospitals, lawyers and insurance companies can kiss my... non-payments.

[edit on 2010/5/4 by nenothtu]

All that is just more speculation about what it will bring. With the title "'Fearmongers' Were Right about Obamacare" and claims that the worst had been proven, i was expecting something concrete.

All your alleged evidence has words like "will" in it, as in the future tense, meaning it's just more predictions, and *drum roll* fear mongering.

Still going to have to wait and see.

[edit on 4-5-2010 by Risen]

reply to post by Risen


Does that mean that you can't plainly see the control of most aspects of your existence is what this law is geared for? That they can dictate to you how you must live. What your recreational, food, entertainment preferences will be and if you choose to participate anyway against their restricted rules you will be considered unqualified for care? It is not health care but control!

This is NOT the domain of what the government has any right to delve into. They have their dictates clearly shown in the Constitution of what they can and what they must deal with. This restriction of personal liberty isn't one of them!

Zindo
Edit for my terrible spelling!

[edit on 5/4/2010 by ZindoDoone]

[edit on 5/4/2010 by ZindoDoone]

ITT: ultra Right wing republicans upset about having there "hard earned" money taken away from them to better the united states. Sometimes i think the world would be a better place if they just went to texas and it succeeded.

reply to post by ZindoDoone


I live in Canada, and the government footing the bill for my hospital visits and surgeries hasn't been a slippery slope to a totalitarian socialist state, so i kind of snicker when i hear Americans acting like it is. That's all.

reply to post by Risen


The tenants of your health care responsibility are no where near what this law requires. If you have not read OUR law then you have NO idea of what you speak, Your health care and this law have absolutely NOTHING in common other than it is 'Supposed' to cover everyone! Our hospitals on our Northern border are getting rich because YOUR damned health care is so good!!


Zindo

reply to post by ZindoDoone


They always have to put all kinds of details in which are meant for specific cases, and to protect the system from being abused, which aren't meant to be applied to every single person. In the absense of anything really damning, the detractors have been trying to make nightmare scenarios out of every little thing.

But for the record, i used to try and locate these terrible things people claimed are in the health care bill, but after about a dozen hoaxes i stopped. People have been making up outrageous exaggerations and fabrications intended to incite people against it, and they've lost all credibility with me.

No one knows exactly how it's all going to work out, and anyone who says they do is lying. Like i said before, just wait and see. It's already been passed, so there's nothing else you can do. If it is bad news, you'll have plenty of SOLID evidence soon, and won't have to bother with predictions like this.

[edit on 4-5-2010 by Risen]

Originally posted by bakednutz
This garbage needs to be "repealed and replaced" immediately. How many times was the public warned about this from the republicans? This is not the only study to state these facts. All the people who believed Obama the "Great One" are just plain ignorant.

Ohhh I don't know, Obamacare is very similar to the plan the Republicans wanted during the Clinton years. Lets not think about that to much shall we.

Originally posted by rationaluser
ITT: ultra Right wing republicans upset about having there "hard earned" money taken away from them to better the united states. Sometimes i think the world would be a better place if they just went to texas and it succeeded.

If it was your hard earned money. . . . .

And don't even give me no philanthropist crap. Especially when viewed in the liberal claptrap of the more we give the more you'll owe us.

This bill is designed to take away your freedom. When they can mandate your healthcare they can then mandate what you eat, what you do for a living, what cereal your kid eats for breakfast, all in the name of progress. They aren't going to shell out for healthcare if it can be avoided by mandating "healthy" life styles.

It's about control not health.

You know how those pesky health insurance companies sometimes refuse to cover the obese the smokers the chronicly ill. Well if you think the government won't have similar stipulations your crazy.

I'm sure sometimes those "ultra-right" wingers wish they could move to texas and it just succeed.




[edit on 4-5-2010 by constantwonder]

Social services have been 'gamed' by many over the years. Often by people with short-sighted thinking - gain a bit now to lose something later. Like the teenage mothers I knew who get pregnant to get bigger checks.

There are 139Million employed in the USA out of a population of 305Million.

Those supported by social programs are a burden on society. We need to shrink the number of people who are a burden on society. Government healthcare just made all your neighbors a burden on society.

Not to be too brutally frank, but isn't it lying to say "the fear mongers were right" in the past tense? Speculation about what the legislation might one day do is not proof of anything. I'll not lie - I'm of a liberal bent. Mind you, I am hardly a cheerleader for the Democrats. In fact, here's a shocker: neither of the United States political parties can be considered liberal from a political science perspective. The entire nation is skewed to nationalism and foreign adventurism. Hardly liberal traits.

But, whatever. That doesn't matter to this discussion. What matters is this: the divisive, hate-filled rhetoric directed at whomever does not share your shock! and! alarm! with regards to Obama says much more about the one flinging the vitriol than it does the recipient. One must not necessarily be drinking any sort of kool-aid to disagree in a rational manner, but this kind of dialog (if one can call it that) is not designed to invite rational discourse. It's designed to bait your opponent into equally ridiculous behavior. Shame on those indulging in that particular vice.

To shut up an Obama supporter ask them to name 1 of his accomplishments.
After they don't list anything (and probably make up an excuse), mention Obama's promises that he has broken.
Note: saying he has a nice personality doesn't count, and couldn't be farther from the truth.
The devil will speak of good intentions.
And yeah, people only like him because he's black (because they think he's black*). No one can argue that. He doesn't even look black. Looks more like Osama Bin Laden. That's probably why his name was changed to Obama, to test how stupid the American public really is. His fake name sounds like a freakin terrorist. Barry sounds much more American.

"While Congress spent the last year debating how to provide health insurance for the uninsured, a little-known provision slipped into the heath care law that could cost some Americans upwards of $2,000 a year.

Under-reported and the under the radar of most lawmakers, the program will allow workers to have an average of roughly $150 or $240 a month, based on age and salary, automatically deducted from their paycheck to save for long-term care.

Supporters say the program will relieve pressure on Medicaid and should help keep us out of nursing homes by enabling Americans to save for something most will eventually need -- assistance in eating, bathing or dressing in their old age."

www.foxnews.com...


I love the reasoning, what do you say to a teen who just started working their first job? Shut up you little brat, one day your going to be incontinent so we're taking your money now for when that inevitably happens?

reply to post by Risen


These little details, as you call them, run against the grain of typical Americans.

• Page 16: States that if you have insurance at the time of the bill becoming law and change, you will be required to take a similar plan. If that is not available, you will be required to take the government option!

• Page 22: Mandates audits of all employers that self-insure!

• Page 29: Admission: your health care will be rationed!

• Page 30: A government committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process)

• Page 42: The “Health Choices Commissioner” will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. None.

• Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services.

• Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Healthcard.

• Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer.

• Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (example: SEIU, UAW and ACORN)

• Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange.

• Page 84: All private healthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans)

• Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens

• Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-run Health Care plan.

• Page 102: Those eligible for Medicaid will be automatically enrolled: you have no choice in the matter.

• Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No “judicial review” is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed.

• Page 127: The AMA sold doctors out: the government will set wages.
Zindo

The Rand Corp is a very well known Right - Wing think tank. I'm not sure what to think about the health bill. I do know that I don't like the government telling me what to do. Posting this thread as factual regarding the Rand Corp. as the source is very misleading because they work for the Republican party to misrepresent the Democratic party.

Originally posted by Florida Muck Monster
The Rand Corp is a very well known Right - Wing think tank. I'm not sure what to think about the health bill. I do know that I don't like the government telling me what to do. Posting this thread as factual regarding the Rand Corp. as the source is very misleading because they work for the Republican party to misrepresent the Democratic party.

They do have a good reputation overall. Their stigma as a right-wing think tank is definitely in dispute. Having said that, however, there is this creepy little snippet from the Wikipedia article:

In April 1970, Newhouse News Service reported that Richard Nixon had commissioned RAND to study the feasibility of canceling the 1972 election. RAND denied it and reviewed its recent work for possible sources of the story. They said that the review was fruitless.[18]

Haha, I saw the "RAND Corp" part and knew all I needed to know. Expand your media diet, instead of feasting at the table of the far-right's self-fulfilling prophecies...RAND, Heritage Foundation, FreedomWorks. They feed the Mary Matalins and Charles Krauthammers and Peggy Noonans who in turn distribute that information to the public as if it were fact, and not totally slanted "findings" from conservative rendering facilities.

reply to post by ZindoDoone


Why not copy paste the proof of all that right out of the bill? If it's there, show me it word for word exactly how it's said. I'm not going to spend the rest of my night reading page after page looking for things, but you seem to be very passionate about this subject, and can probably locate the parts you're summarizing pretty quickly. Right?

[edit on 4-5-2010 by Risen]