Is a run on American Banks in progress? You be the judge

Just another NORMAL banking day and just another day on ATS. No consequences for OP for fear mongering. I'm with Johnny 2127, where's the outrage? Unless we are supposed to simply wait for next Cry Wolf. Oh, do we just let it die on the vine? What about Denying Ignorance?

There was NO RUN ON BANKS today despite baiting by OP. I'm on East coast, but nothing on the news or industry sites.

In parlance of thread title. Is the OP full of dookie? You be the judge.





[edit on 12-4-2010 by kinda kurious]

There is no money in the banks, to have a decent run on them.
you got to be kidding me, you think your going to have a run on
a empty bank. check out the numbers bank robbers are getting
these days, its a depression even for the crooks. I bet they do
an average daily flow + 2% to limit their risk of robbery.

well, I'm not sure how they are earning a nickle. there books are full of loses (or is it..>?> we are assuming they are full of loses, if they off loaded the Junk as the numbers suggest they sold all of it and shorted it to boot. So $$$ lets find where the money went for all those CDO, CDS and the like, who has the $), employment has not picked up so the need for capital demand is slack. cash flow is well, a trickle. and I recall, the earnings as way better than expected. and the only money I can see them having is our money. the bailout cash. I wonder if they used our cash to gamble on the markets and crash Dubai Inc. and shore up the chinesse with Cash for Clunkers, and that was a Green Thing, remember, it was a chinesse demand for steel that cost the taxpayer what 4500$ ea. to give the steel that cost
what 150$ at any junk yard - but no, they took a paid off car off the road. they financed a new car for what 70 months @ $350 a month, insurance went up, and the trade in got squished and shipped to china in exchange for credit. *Cash for Clunkers was a Chinesse Suggestion.
so other than those cars that got financed - I dont see any demand turning a profit, for the foreseeable future.
so, I would question why they needed bailing out if they are turning such great profits. while the society at a whole is still bitter. is kind of arrogant.


[edit on 12-4-2010 by Anti-Evil]

[edit on 12-4-2010 by Anti-Evil]

well, I'm not sure how they are earning a nickle. there books are full of loses (or is it..>?> we are assuming they are full of loses, if they off loaded the Junk as the numbers suggest they sold all of it and shorted it to boot.

I can speak to this. First, for any publicly traded bank, you can take a close look at their audited financial statements, and read about the bank's loan loss reserves and percentages of delinquency in their loan portfolio. As weak banks fail, stronger banks assume their deposits and well-performing loan assets. The FDIC and the assuming bank typically have a loss-sharing arrangement on the delinquent loans. It's a superb deal for the assuming bank - They get all the upside, and very little downside. Some banks are able to dramatically increase their market share - even doubling their size with a few of these acquisitions. As a result, banks get bigger, and the weak players fail. The FDIC still has several hundred more banks to shut down in the next year or two.

As far as losses, I think the real key here is understanding the underlying real estate collateral of the mortgages held on the books of the bank. In some parts of the country, real estate values have declined by as much as 50% or more. A bank that wrote a mortgage for $180,000 for a house appraised at $200,000, may now have a huge shortfall in the collateral value. The borrower still owes the $180,000, but the house might only be worth $100,000. And the borrower certainly doesn't have the capacity to pony up additional collateral in the form of real estate, investments, cash, etc. to try to make up the shortfall. Most borrowers are tapped out.

In the event of a default, and foreclosure, the banks have been treading water trying to avoid having to write-off these losses for as long as they can. The banks really don't want to recognize these collateral shortfalls on their books if they don't have to.

It is also important to make note that there is a huge difference between a Wall Street investment bank (such as Goldman Sachs), and your local retail bank. Wall Street was involved in the packaging of huge bundles of mortgage loans, and selling them as investment products. Your local bank is in the real estate financing business - writing loans on hard asset real estate. Big difference. Don't confuse the two.

Wall Street investment banks (remember Lehman and Bear Stearns?) that played this game of bundling these mortgage loans are all on the ropes. Even Merrill Lynch had to find a buyer. Merrill Lynch! So you can look at Wall Street players - the investment banks - have really been hit hard already. There are only a few really big players left. Chase for one. Goldman Sachs for another. Eventually they will regroup, smaller boutique firms will pick up the slack, etc.

The retail banks are still in a heap of trouble. As I said, the FDIC hasn't finished shutting banks down. This will continue for many more months to come. These retail banks are struggling. Most of the stock prices for these banks have been decimated. Loan demand is weak if not non-existent. Banks aren't hiring new people. Many are on the ropes trying to figure out how they can raise more capital in this tough environment, as well as how to deal with these toxic real estate mortgages on their books.

I will say, however, that many of these retail banks have made some significant progress in cleaning up their messes. We still have some very, very strong retail banks in this country that are well-capitalized and well-managed. The areas you need to look at are where all the huge residential construction took place - Florida, Georgia, California, Arizona, Utah, etc. That's where the bulk of the failures are coming from - the Southeast and the Southwest.

Originally posted by kinda kurious
Just another NORMAL banking day and just another day on ATS. No consequences for OP for fear mongering. I'm with Johnny 2127, where's the outrage? Unless we are supposed to simply wait for next Cry Wolf. Oh, do we just let it die on the vine? What about Denying Ignorance?

There was NO RUN ON BANKS today despite baiting by OP. I'm on East coast, but nothing on the news or industry sites.

In parlance of thread title. Is the OP full of dookie? You be the judge.





[edit on 12-4-2010 by kinda kurious]

I'd just like to bring to everyone's attention this person and his posts.

not only does he spread contaminated interaction on this thread pertaining to insults, contextual alteration and character assasination, he does it in such an immature way.

NEVER DID I MAKE THE CLAIM THAT MONDAY THERE WOULD BE A RUN ON THE BANKS

I mentioned in my original post that I was thinking to myself about the POSSIBILITY that there could be a run on the banks.

This post was about a personal experience I had, and we as an ATS collective discussed the possibilities. That's all.

Thanks ATS - those of you who helped bring the truth of this matter to the light.

As for you kinda kurious, and the others who may have opted to throw insults around on this post like it was candy, you'll be checking your messages real soon.

Where do you, and people like yourself deduct your intelligence from? the sewer?

[edit on 13-4-2010 by DarkspARCS]

[Edit to add] I apologize for not having time to post here on Monday as I had to visit my father in California.

Yes, it's obviously apparent that there are forces from several different directions that are seeking to topple America's financial institutions... INCLUDING A MAJOR EFFORT BY AMERICAN BUSINESSES AND INVESTORS THEMSELVES.

I NEVER ONCE SAID THAT I HAD A WISH FOR AMERICA'S FINANCIAL STABILITY TO CRUMBLE - AS HAS BEEN STATED BY ONE SPECIFIC POSTER ON THIS TOPIC - I AM NOT A DOOMSDAY PROPHET

That being said, I'm just going to flat come on out and address this topic, and try to correct the issues that have arisen here.

THIS IS A DISCUSSION, not a CLAIM by myself that AMERICA IS COOKED... and for the most part, folks added thier input - whether it was for or against my query of what folks thought about my experience at the bank last Saturday.

This was a hypothetical discussion, where it was intended for everyone to get together to try to SEE if there was merit to this, and if it would be high time for people to start seriously consider securing thier finances against a possible upcoming financial crash.

I posted this topic out of genuine concern, not of the issue, but for people's well being

Those who started making comments of opinionated fly by night insinuations about myself, or your opinionated beliefs about my intentions had no place on this thread, and derailed the topic of this post with your insults.

I should hope that my saying something to you would allow you to see something about yourselves that is one of the reasons why the world has issues like it does, because you fail to maturely interact with your peers in a civilized manner.

I should hope that in the future you take my message to heart and get serious about your lives, because I know that I am about mine.

This was a real issue, and it still is. If you chose to continue to have faith in a government and it's institutions that have been unprecedentedly proven to have been lying to you, exploiting you, endangering you, and stealing from you to enrich themselves at the cost of taking the food out of your children's mouths... that is your priviledge.

I choose to remain aware, and to act according to my benevolence, and for that of my friends and my family. You are my friends here on ATS... I should hope people will try to start thinking in like manner, not just towards me, but others as well... from the old school to the newbie.

Take care, and fare well.

Originally posted by DarkspARCS
NEVER DID I MAKE THE CLAIM THAT MONDAY THERE WOULD BE A RUN ON THE BANKS

I mentioned in my original post that I was thinking to myself about the POSSIBILITY that there could be a run on the banks.

Direct quote from OP:

Originally posted by DarkspARCS
It's my experienced summation folks, that a run on remaining American Banks is in progress........I can only speculate what Monday is going to bring....

Perhaps you think typing in all caps will somehow erase your OWN words.

Mis-remember much?

[edit on 13-4-2010 by kinda kurious]

reply to post by kinda kurious


Oh KK why is it we all must sometimes be cruel to be kind!

In all fairness he was partially right. I mean this in the most honest and factual way, when I say it, but he was himself withdrawing his money from his bank out of fear over the banks health.

That is a run on the bank, its just a small run though, without too many other people joining in!

So since he himself was making a run on the bank, he was technically correct that a run was in progress. He was just off on how significant the run was.

He did go on to say he couldn't really say what would happen on Monday.

Now the truth is, that fear itself is at an all time high, and in part that's because no matter which news station you turn on, its nothing but fear, anger, doom and gloom.

We don't often see the story of who won the National Spelling Bee, or who just won the Lottery Jackpot or who just gave birth to a brand new baby boy or girl.

It's all for the most part bad news, earthquakes, murders, kidnappings, terrorists, nuclear ambitious states, commissions, investigations, riots, plane crashes, business failures, layoffs. political infighting, political bashing.

One station is afraid of Obama, another is afraid of Palin!

Fears are almost always imagined, but our media feeds us so much fear, so much anger, so much bad news, that its hard for a lot of people to not end up imagining the worst.

The problem is that we are really screwed in that there is no real healthy middle ground.

You have one group who is afraid of everything, and expecting the worst, and the other group is almost oblivious to everything, and sees nothing wrong and no threat in anything.

Neither is really healthy, one group tells us everything is wrong and to be very afraid, always afraid, and the other group tells us nothing is wrong, and there is never anything happening behind the scenes that our politicians don't have well under control, and that they all, always mean well.

In the middle is where we get closer to the truth, but its too the poles that most people end up, and believe me both groups are part of the problem.

If we can't get our fears in control, we are never going to rationally and intelligently deal with our shared problems, and if we can't get some people to stop pretending there are no problems, and experts that we should all trust are already hard at work on them, we likewise are never going to deal with our shared problems.

We do have real problems, and while our politicians are out capturing photo ops at things like nuclear reduction treaties (wow we have reduced weapons we never use, and will now spend a small fortune disposing of some, and a bigger fortune upgrading the ones we are still going to keep that could blow up the world three times over) foreclosures here in our state my friend, set a new all time high record last month.

We have some very serious problems, that frankly no one in Washington is up to task to solve, no matter what side of the political aisle they are on, because they are all more interested in their next photo op, next sound bite, and next pork barrel polka and sandwich.

Trust me they love that half of us are scared to near terror, and the other half of us are nearly oblivously and in total denial.

We all need to work towards the middle, and get off the far extreme polls.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Thanks for weighing in Proto. Your contributions are usually insightful albeit rarely brief.

Inasmuch as I don't feel I need mediation, I respect your input. In my book and simply put, actions have consequences. I stand behind my assertion of fear mongering. Admittedly, nothing is ever black & white. But it is too easy to get mired in all the shades of gray.

On a personal note, I had a keen interest in this story and truth be told was a tad alarmed by the OP's accusations. As Successor Trustee to my late father's estate, I had to disperse some rather hefty funds on Monday as part of the estate settlement. In all 6 US banks were involved and recipients in 3 different states received wire transfers in the 6 digits. All went without a hitch. (Granted wire transfers are not cash withdrawals but I make my point.) The US banking system performed flawlessly.

My scorn and skepticism was, in my own mind, justified. Although I don't pretend to be very smart, imagine those of inferior intellect falling prey to this ruse.

I stand by my assertion. Sincerely...kk


[edit on 14-4-2010 by kinda kurious]

reply to post by kinda kurious


Well these kinds of things is why I keep all my money in Coffee Cans buried in the ground at 22 minutes West of the 78th Parallel and 2 minutes North of 38th Meridian.

As long as no one knows but me that they are there they are safe!

Cause I is smart!

I don't plan on telling anyone that they are all burried right under the base of the big pine tree there that was split by lightening!

That would be dumb!

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Thanks for the mocking and ridicule.

I'm unapologetically grateful.

Can't people just keep their negative feelings to themselves? How can any of you consider yourself intelligent when you can't even give a person room to express their thoughts and beliefs? Is ATS not dedicated towards people being able to workout their beliefs and ideas among peers with a somewhat similar subjective view?


Change starts with you! hah.

Originally posted by kinda kurious
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

Thanks for the mocking and ridicule.

I'm unapologetically grateful.

No such thing, I might have been making fun of myself and everyone there.

With my luck a horde of Viking Gold is probably burried there in that exact location and someone is digging it up right now!

I chimed in on the front page, cautioning people how banks manage there on site cashflow, and there was likely no cause for alarm.

I think one thing you might have missed in your contentions, regarding on how people are easily duped by Posts that don't always consider all the logisitical facts and current trends but focus on fear, and that they are sometimes easily duped because of a lack of overall greater knowledge and understanding, is...

That if an average ordinary person like you, has that concern, that people of lesser knowledge are easily duped by anything they hear that plays to their emotions...

Is it really safe to assume that the Government, Politicians, Media Heads, Corporate Heads, and Banking Heads don't have that same low, but often fairly accurate opinion of how easy it is to convince people of things not well rooted in fact, with just a bit of supposition that plays to their emotions.

Many of these entities listed above, would have both strong motive and opportunity to do such a thing, for their own self gain, and the majorities detriment.

Which is why my back page post was simply about pointing out, there likely is an inherent danger of being so polarized to one side of the extreme or the other.

People who see fear, and Martial Law, and the potential for rioting and FEMA camps in everything.

People who believe that despite how easy it is to convey fictional information, trust that the Government and the Media and the Corporations and Banks never ever would, and everything is always just as they put it out there to us.

It's why I suggested maybe instead of the extreme pole of one side, attacking and deriding the extreme pole on the other side, and them doing the same, that we ALL try to show a little compassion, and a greater degree of open mindedness and try to meet closer in the middle, where instead of being at war with each other, and aiding those who use divide and conquer warfare and the synergy of the Thesis versus the Anti-Thesis to effect an outcome, that we find a common ground, that allows us to RATIONALLY explore possibilities, with one side putting the breaks on a bit more and a bit more often, and the other side, taking the blinders of a bit more and a bit more often.

We remain our own worst enemies in these regards in my humble opinion, and truth be known, if we take ourselves so seriously we can't occassionally laugh good naturedly at the folly of our ways, then we are certainly cursed and doomed to suffer in perpituity from them.

In my humble opinion, I think ultimately everyone wants at least heard and considered, and because its often the polar extremes that do most of the shouting, versus talking, we don't do a very good job at hearing and considering others, or finding a truly productive common ground to share.

That we have the propensity to then easily be provoked towards an emotional reaction, and our own insecurities, versus being able to consider some loftier goals and principles to guide us, is in my humble opinion also a huge part of the problem.

Reason should prevail and common sense, which is neither fearful to the point of terror, or oblivious to the point of denial and blind trust.

We all should try to find the middle ground, because chances are that's the highest ground, and there is a flood coming...

A horrible flood, that will wipe all of humanity except those living in the Rockies, Himalayas, and Alps, on the 13th of June, at 1:00 PM, I am positive of this because my Cat has been acting jumpy lately!

Has your cat by chance been acting strangely!

Relax, I always enjoy your posts.

Just trying to get people to think a little deeper and wiser is all.

United we will stand, divided we are in fact falling.

The above was a non-paid, assessment by the committee to apoint Protoplasmic Traveler as Emperor of the World for Life and is not a reflection of staff or management of this website!

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Brevity is the soul of wit.

- Shakespeare

reply to post by kinda kurious


Who many historians conclude was actually Francis Bacon and was the consumate liar.

Proving both our points on how easily people are decieved!

I have a dream of a kinder gentler Roman Empire, even now as we speak I am watching the Lion Trainers teach them how to gum the Christians and not bite them!

Eww, well that one still needs some work!

Keep at it guys...

Won't you help make this dream come true.

Ah another Barney Song moment is coming on...

Everyone sing along now...

I love you,
you love me,

we're a happy family...

with a great big hug and a kiss from me to you...
won't you say you love me too



[edit on 14/4/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


You seem to enjoy all things you so I got you a little present:
It is nice and long the way you like 'em.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/70f94bb51d74.jpg[/atsimg]

“Humility is the only certain defense against humiliation”

Enjoy!



[edit on 14-4-2010 by kinda kurious]

reply to post by kinda kurious


Fiar enough, you reject the argument.

Too bad you can't just say that.

I think maybe, thats what some people are trying to tell you.

You can choose to deride people, or you can choose to understand people, and try to help them find a middle ground.

Clearly there are some people on ATS whose sport is trying to make others feel foolish, to build them selves up.

Yet no matter how often someone else is wrong about something, that doesn't necessarily make the other person who points it out, is right about anything other than pointing out someone else was wrong!

Help people deny ignorance, revelling in it with them, might not be the most productive way to go.

Thanks,

Sorry to have allowed myself to become sidetracked. So back On Topic.

Is there ANY evidence to claim in OP that a "Run on Banks" is in progress?

I see no no proof. Thread date was April 10th. How long does a run take to become evident?

Legitimate question in search for "common ground."


[edit on 14-4-2010 by kinda kurious]

All of you making 'bank runs' realize that if the dollar were to collapse right this second, the money you have in your possesion is worthless, right?