OOBE - Astral Projection - Dissociation: Related?

Welcome to my first thread. This seemed a semi-logical place to put it.

I've been wondering about this for a while. It would seem that these phenomena are related due to their descriptions.

I can't speak personally on any of the three but I have studied quite a bit on dissociation.

WHAT IS DISSOCIATION?

It's a continuum. Everybody dissociates; it's normal. On one end you have things like highway hypnosis, where you get home but don't remember parts of driving. At the other end you have dissociative identity disorder(multiple personalities).

DID is caused by extreme, repeated trauma in childhood, generally sexual. Sexual abuse survivors (dissociative: multiple or not) often speak of being out of their bodies. Psychological tests like DES (Dissociative Experiences Scale) and MMPI (Minnesota Multi-Phasic Personality Inventory?) ask questions about feeling like you are out of your body or watching from above.

ASTRAL PROJECTION

Described as leaving your body and going elsewhere.

OUT OF BODY EXPERIENCE

Being, well.... out of your body.

NEAR DEATH EXPERIENCE

People frequently report looking down at their own bodies.

REMOTE VIEWING

Non-local awareness.


What do they have in common? Leaving your body, more or less.
So I'm wondering... could they be related?


Thoughts welcome.

Howdy, lefty

What the tests ask is one thing. How the answers are best interpreted is something else.

Anything that happens within 20 minutes or so of being asleep ought to be interpreted differently from waking experience. For the purposes of the heuristic, being clinically dead is an acceptable substitute for being asleep .

Context, the answers to related questions, matters, too. And, anything interesting can be explored further in a more focused session.

The OBE community seems to me to be almost "opposite" from the clinical dissociation sufferer. The typical OBE'er, I think, even the NDE'er maybe, sees the episode of separation as part of the ongoing story of their lifetime relationship between their body and their consciousness.

What the disorder is about, in part, is the sufferers' feeling that it isn't their life, body, or consciousness. Things which happen to them are happening to "somebody else," in some sense.

It is a curiosity of language that two wildly different perspectives can lead to the same answer to some one single question. Also, language is lousy in conveying fine distinctions in purely personal experience. That's why there's more than one question, and why there should be follow-up.

Only my opinions, of course.

Originally posted by eight bits
The OBE community seems to me to be almost "opposite" from the clinical dissociation sufferer.

Hello and accepted.

It is a curiosity of language that two wildly different perspectives can lead to the same answer to some one single question. Also, language is lousy in conveying fine distinctions in purely personal experience. That's why there's more than one question, and why there should be follow-up.

Thanks for the perspective!

I figured I'd ask, as they seemed similar, even if via language.
We (all of us plus the experts) need to get these things out into the open. This way, perhaps we can gain the benefit of commonalities in understanding the whole.

Or so I think.

reply to post by leftystrat


I think you are sort of putting some things together that really are quite different. Dissociation is completely different from astral projection/OoBE. I have not only studied dissociation itself, but have had a lot of experiences with different dissociatives. Now I will agree there is some elements that are alike, in fact people have had OoBE from using certain dissociatives (DXM, ketamine, etc.)

However, in your OP the way you stated your view[?] on dissociation is sort of screwy (no offense). It's not that what you said is necessarily untrue, but it's just a tip of the iceberg. There is so much more to being dissociative then what you described. I honestly have spent many countless hours reading about different types of mentalities, I also have extensive knowledge in the area of pharmaceuticals, so I know that whole area as well. I would consider myself knowledgeable as well with psychology, and when I put all my information together there is plenty more too it then the simple way you explained it.

If you ask me a certain question I may be able to enlighten you, or anyone else, on that specific subject when it comes to really anything you stated in the OP. Although astral projection/OoBE is described differently by everyone there is a basis that many can agree on when it comes to OoBE).

Ultimately, they all have common aspects but there are plenty that are different as well. The whole consciousness aspect is very different through out these experiences people have. Higher consciousness usually means a much more deep experience (usually more spiritual) and when you try and compare dissociation to consciousness you need to realize when one is dissociative they are not usually in a state where they remember much, but one can remember such situations if they have certain conditions, and/or learn to remember. So like I said this is all being sort of general, if you ask me a question that is more specific I can give some more input.

I hope what I said made sense, I've been up for many hours so I don't even know if what I just said makes complete sense, but hopefully you all can understand what I am trying to say.

I have felt extreme dissociation while on a specific drug that will remain unnamed. And let me tell, it is an absolutely horrid feeling. I would imagine you'd have a bad time trying to have an OOBE while on it.

Originally posted by highlyoriginal
reply to post by leftystrat

 

I think you are sort of putting some things together that really are quite different. Dissociation is completely different from astral projection/OoBE.

Ok, that's what I'm trying to find out.

However, in your OP the way you stated your view[?] on dissociation is sort of screwy (no offense). It's not that what you said is necessarily untrue, but it's just a tip of the iceberg.

It wasn't a view so much as an elementary explanation for those reading.

I have what I'd refer to as second hand knowledge of dissociation, via a wife with dissociative identity disorder. I met her long before diagnosis so we learned together.

If you ask me a certain question I may be able to enlighten you,

Thank you.
What's the difference between dissociating from your body, astral projection, OOBE's, NDE's and the like?

All I know is that at some point, all seem to involve being out of one's body.



Much appreciated!

Hello, I saw this about 2 years ago because i was wondering the same thing. Has this question evolved or gone anywhere? I think they are related although i've never had experience with an OOBE. I look at this idea from of point of how do we get there. In the book "Adventures beyond the body" it tells you the steps to have an OOBE. I don't have the book with me this second but off the top of my head it involves, laying down, clearing your mind, extreme focus (like thinking of your living room, then focusing on the clock then focusing on the number 2 very intensely) couple other things but also an huge desire to leave your body. All this while in a very calm and safe place. BUT! Imagine your a 8 year old child lying in bed about to be sexually abused or raped. A lot of things you would do to have an OOBE, you kind of end up doing in this situation too especially a huge desire to be out of your body. Victims of sex abuse having issues like feeling out of there body even during sex or even referring to themselves in a plural way (we instead of I), seeing everything fuzzy or out of focus, thats something OOBE i think talk about.

For whatever reason, the mind is able to leave the body. But why is that possible? From an evolutionary survival point of view, it seems logical to consider that any OOBE is a byproduct of this ability to separate ourselves from the body during extreme events.

a reply to: awolJ

The assumption is that the mind is in the body in the first place. It might exist in a totally other dimension, and operating the body remotely. The body is just a composite of 48 common elements, limited by the laws of dimensional space , the mind doesn't appear to be thus limited. Since these common elements of the body get completely recycled a few times in a persons lifetime, and you in fact appear to be inhabiting a new body, after the complete recycling The definition here is that the mind, is loosely associated with the body it inhabits, in the first place.