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Originally posted by Matrix Rising
Humans always come to conclusions based on the available evidence.
Originally posted by DoomsdayRex
Originally posted by Stillalive
doomsdayrex your always here to discredit people and call names. why dont you stop trolling man?
How is having a discussion "trolling" other than you don't like my opinion? Disagreement is not trolling. However, using "trolling" as an ad hominem to attack someone you don't agree with for the sin of disagreeing is itself trolling.
Originally posted by Full_Vision
Surely all of us have had our fair share of debates and arguments with these kinds of people..the skeptics who refuse to listen to any other perspectives that may go against their stubborn beliefs..they arent usually able, it seems, to open their minds at all and instead close it off to feel 'safe' that they are right and everyone else that doesnt believe the same as them are of course, wrong.. What frusterates me the most is the constant calling for proof.. solid proof is sadly not yet attainable due to the levels of governmental secrecy over the past few decades..
Originally posted by Full_Vision
[What of the numerous Christians who refuse to believe in UFOs, other dimensions and alien life forms because they havent ever seen one themselves? how then do they believe in their God or Jesus? (and i'm sorry, a warm fuzzy feeling doesnt prove Gods existance)!
Originally posted by Full_Vision
Over all, its most likely easier for the skeptics to simply believe everyone who believes differently to them are crazy head cases and they are centred in their little closed off world feeling safe and content in their lack of real thought..to think about things such as this would then make them doubt much of what they were raised in this society since day one of life, to trust is fact..it would turn any religious system they are a part of on its head..causing massive changes in themselves and life around them.. but most likely they dont have care or energy to think outside of their tiny box..frustrating to say the least.
Originally posted by Full_Vision
Please know i am not saying we who believe are 100% correct,
because as i said previously, no one has solid proof.. but there are far too many real accounts, seen by more than one or two people that other life forms do indeed exist, and i refuse to close my eyes and pretend its not highly likely..eventually i do believe facts, proof and disclosure will one day arrive..on that day, i have a few people on my phones speed dial who i will just have to call and rub it in with a big immature HA! lol
This is I think the problem with belief - it turns ufology into an angry discussion. On any given thread on this forum whenever a video or a photo is presented every time anyone tries to even consider the possibility that there is another explanation to that evidence other than alien visitation you immediately see a cry of outrage from those who don't need facts they just believe and to even mention the word "proof" is an insult to their belief.
Bill Chalker is one of Australia’s leading UFO researchers and the author of The OZ Files: The Australian UFO Story and Hair of the Alien: DNA and Other Forensic Evidence of Alien Abduction.
Bill's personal 'top ten' regional Australasian case list...
1. 31 August 1954 Sea Fury case, near Goulbourn, NSW, Australia (experienced naval pilot, radar visual confirmation, independent ground witnesses, apparent intelligent responses to witnesses’ thoughts about possible collision)
2. 23 July 1992 Peter Khoury “Hair of Alien” DNA case, Sydney, Australia (abduction-type encounter with female Nordic blonde yields anomalous hair sample that suggests “hybrid origin” and unusual genetic profiles)
3. 27 June 1959 Father Gill UFO entity sighting, Boianai, Papua New Guinea (credible multiple-witness sighting of animate entities on UFO with intelligent interactions)
4. 30 September 1980 George Blackwell’s UFO landing and physical trace case, Rosedale, Victoria, Australia (compelling array of physical evidence – ground trace, missing water, effects on witness, other witness)
5. 8 August 1993 Kelly Cahill’s abduction experience, Narre Warren North, Victoria, Australia (possible independent multiple-witness UFO encounter with abduction aspects and physical evidence)
6. 19 January 1966 George Pedley’s UFO nest encounter, Tully, Queensland, Australia (daylight close encounter with UFO take-off leaving physical evidence – “UFO nest”)
7. 14 April 1966 Ron Sullivan’s “bent headlight beam” experience, Burkes Flat, Victoria, Australia (striking UFO encounter, physical traces, bent light beams, possible related fatalities)
8. 6 April 1966 Westall school daylight UFO landing encounter, Westall, Victoria, Australia (multiple-witness daylight landing, physical traces, “cover-up” dimensions)
9. 1977–78 Gisborne UFO abduction milieu, Gisborne, New Zealand (complex and high strangeness UFO and abduction milieu – entities, multiple witnesses, multiple abductions)
10. May – August 1973 Tyringham Dundurrabin intense UFO flap area, New South Wales, Australia (long-term intense UFO flap, multiple witnesses, physical effects, paranormal aspects)
Nick Pope once ran the British government’s UFO desk at the Ministry of Defence, and has since written a number of books on UFOs, including Open Skies, Closed Minds and The Uninvited.
1. Rendlesham Forest Incident, December 1980 – UFO landing.
2. The Belgian Wave, March 1990 – UFO tracked on radar; F-16 fighters launched in attempted intercept.
3. The Cosford Incident, March 1993 – Direct overflight of two RAF bases by large triangular UFO.
4. RAF Lakenheath/RAF Bentwaters, August 1956 – Radar/visual case.
5. Manchester Airport, 1995 – Near-miss between UFO and civil aircraft.
6. Captain Zaghetti’s Sighting, 1991 – Near-miss between UFO and civil aircraft.
7. Pitlochry Photograph, 1990 – Diamond-shaped UFO in daylight; MoD technical analysis finds no evidence of fakery.
8. Iranian Intercept, 1976. F-4 Phantom jets chase UFOs.
9. North Sea Overtake, 1990 – RAF Tornados overtaken by UFO; other sightings and radar detections in Europe.
10. Captain Graham Sheppard, 1967 – Two radar/visual sightings.
The following presents a statistical analysis of data found in 3,189 reports involving observations of anomalous phenomena or objects on or near the ground resulting in physical effects generated by the unknown objects observed. These events took place in 91 countries between 1490 and 2006. There are hundreds of additional reports of possible trace sites which do not involve the observation of a UFO. All but the most significant of these events have been removed from the primary files and located in a secondary catalog.The analysis permits certain regularities of these phenomena to be brought out. The data indicates there is a certain type of phenomenon which shows stable statistical properties.
Originally posted by Witness2008
reply to post by InTrueFiction
Skeptics v Believers....It all comes down to you see want you want to see.
In this forum and many other places the skeptic often times belittles those with the burning questions..not all... but in my opinion the majority.
90% of my experiences have been ridiculed and chalked up to explanations that make even less sense. The remaining 10% is made up of truly bizarre opinions and those that actually pay attention and methodically use deductive reasoning. I find solace in the later.
I came to ATS because of a particular sighting and of all the members I spoke with there were two that I felt attempted a true analysis. The percentages are even less out here in the world.
The opening of this thread is loaded with possibilities for a real discussion and I have yet to see any conversation pertaining to them.
My favorite is the Travis Walton case and all those witnesses. We condemn people to death with less.
"In my mind, there is no question that they're out there. My Career is well established. My texts books are required reading in all the major capitals on planet earth. If you want to become a physist to learn about the unified feild therory-you read my books. Therefore, I'm in a position to say: Yes- Most likely they're out their, perhaps even visted, perhaps on our moon. - ABC News Quote --
-- Professor Michio Kaku Author of Theoretical Physics UNY
"I've been convinced for a long time that the flying saucers are real and interplanetary. Another words we are being watched by beings from outer space."
--Albert M. Chop, deputy public relations director, National Aeronautics and Space Administration,(NASA) and former United States Air Force spokesman for Project Blue Book.
"When the long awaited solution to the UFO problem comes, I believe that it will prove to be not merely the next small step in the march of science, but a mighty and totally unexpected quantum leap." "We had a job to do, whether right or wrong, to keep the public from getting excited"
--Dr.J Allen Hynek, Director US Air Force´s project Blue Book as a scientific consultant, astronomer, investigator and analysis.
"Given the millions of billions of Earth-like planets, life elsewhere in the Universe without a doubt, does exist. In the vastness of the Universe we are not alone."
--The Bible According to Albert Einstein
"It is my thesis that flying saucers are real and that they are space ships from another solar system.There is no doubt in my mind that these objects are interplanetary craft of some sort. I and my colleagues are confident that they do not originate in our solar system." --Dr. Herman Oberth (The father of modern rockerty)
"I am completely convinced that UFOs have an out-of-world basis." --Dr. Walther Riedel (Once chief designer and research director at the German rocket center in Peenemunde)
I believe, and I scientifically am certain, that there are endless other living forms out there, including intelligent sentient beings. I do know that there are entire universes of living forms out there.
--Dr.Story Musgrave NASA scientist-astronaut
"I believe that these extraterrestrial vehicles and their crews are visiting this planet from other planets which obviously are a little more technically advanced than we are here on Earth." --Colonel L. Gordon Cooper (Mercury 9, Gemini-5 Astronaut)
"Mission control, We have a UFO pacing our position, request instructions!"
-- Astronaut Cady Coleman NASAtransmission shuttle mission STS-73
"I've been asked about UFO's and I've said publicly I thought they were somebody else, some other civilization."
--Commander Eugene Cernan, Commanded the Apollo 17 Mission. (LA TIMES, 1973)
We have contact with alien cultures."
--Astronaut Dr. Brian O'leary
"In my official status, I cannot comment on ET contact. However, personally, I can assure you, we are not alone!
--Charles J. Camarda (Ph.D.) NASA Astronaut
Originally posted by yeti101
reply to post by Matrix Rising
still not given us any evidence. What do you have an alien body? a piece of ET spaceship? A clear photo with sufficient providence?
Where is the evidence?
Originally posted by yeti101
reply to post by Matrix Rising
I'll give you the truth but you wont like it. The suggestion we are being visited by ET in spaceships is pure bunk. Ufology is an industry designed to make money from gullible people. But those people are willing participants becuase they desperately want to believe. There are various reasons for this but i wont expand here.
The ufo BS artists have become more sophisticated and more diverse over the last 60 years catering to the needs of the believers. The only problem i have is them trying to force people to accept those crazy beliefs as fact thats where i draw the line.
Originally posted by Matrix Rising
It just seems to me that the skeptic is absent any reason because they want to remain in a state of perpetual possibility.
There's evidence that has accumulated over the years that we can weigh as to what's most likely and what's less likely.
This is how you know most UFO skeptics are not interested in evidence. They are just interested in saying,"it could be anything" or "that doesn't prove anything."
Most of them want to act as if there's no evidence and that there's no good research out there.
They do this because they want to remain in a state of perpetual possibility.
My point is, there's a lot of evidence that has accumulated over the years that can be weighed as to what's most likely and what's less likely.
If it was left up to the skeptic the evidence would never be weighed and we would remain in a state of perpetual possibility.