Is Israel the real Antichrist?

what is worse, insanity or ignorance ?
what can change the present ?

people react in insanity because of care,
but ignorance does not react.

in a growthprocess, there is growth by falling first,
ignorance doesn't.

so is the antichrist the insane ? or the ignorant ?

reply to post by mamabeth


Please, I have just as much right to debate the issue as anyone else. Even you religious folks should be able to understand that much from scripture. Don't start cherry picking God's word now, you know he doesn't like that.

reply to post by HappilyEverAfter

Hey thanks, I'm not trying to bash anyone ,I just dont get the whole superiority destiny thing with the Israel / Jewish thing, way to much pride kill pride kill entitled vibe if you understand, and once again not bashing just want to understand how that whole mind thing works,

I understand what your saying, but you have to look at it from their point of view. It's their religious duty if they followed God's word to the letter. Some do, some don't and it's the one's who do that we need to worry about, but not the whole religious message itself.

Signatures like no peace for land not one inch, and I'm seeing the land being "taken" from an entire people being exterminated, by people who want me to feel bad about them being exterminated,

Put yourself in their shoes for a minute. They strongly believe that God has created the universe, our planet and all life on it for them. The bible even goes so far as to validate that belief as their God does say this is what he did. The God of the bible in the Old Testament is the God for the House of Israel and the House of Judah, not the Christian God. Yet, the Christians and their version of God consider themselves to be more religiously superior and right and demand the two houses bend to their will or suffer consequences. No wonder their are all these petty wars and feuds right?

How can a person or a people who've "been through it" do it? AND AND justify it?
And make people feel bad about questioning all their killing?

The two Houses and their religion deem them the chosen one's and any who oppose or attempt to destroy the chosen one's are enemies of God and God commands both houses to destroy those who oppose him. This is how some of the more violent one's of the religion can and do validate their actions, by listening to what God tells them they should do.

Yeah, i'm thinking thats like twisted , maybe anti? maybe anti christ.

But it's not Anti-Christ, there is no such thing. Jesus as the Messiah is a false belief, he never fulfilled all the prophecies, so any concept of a prophesied Anti-Christ is invalidated. The entire New Testament is a perversion of the God of the Old Testament.

Just blind myopic hate, preaching about love and peace? wow!

The logic is actually pretty sound, if you still follow the Old Testament. God validates their actions to a certain point. Your mixing the teaching's of the New Testament with the teachings of the Old Testament. God doesn't put up with his enemies and he wants them all destroyed. It was Jesus who perverted the Old Testament God into teaching love and peace. Not many people actually bother to read the bible in full and every church only cherry picks certain verses to validate their own interpretations these days. Read it cover to cover and take note of important sayings and events. Then compare that with the New Testament.

[edit on 15-10-2009 by sirnex]

Jesus did not pervert him, he made him full...
Israel has a function in the bible, curse and blessing.

There is a difference between seed and state.

The son of man is leveled...
but allready exsist in this world as destined.

but everybody can join it.

David was declared a son, because he was the son of man,
before he became one with it...jesus fullfilled this further,
and stayed after he took his mental cross to take the literal one.

There are no contradicitons.
The old testament god is one of love...
his law was, I am one, love me (one,all) with all your heart...
But Israel in the old testament was given time to grow towards this,
by misunderstanding and folowwing the symbol-law,
whic are symbols rather then a real law, the law has 2 sides,
blessing as curse....one or symbols.
because god wanted logic to build up over thousands of years.



[edit on 15-10-2009 by pasttheclouds]

If you really want to know who/what is the Antichrist, then I urge you to read this thread:

The Antichrist - The Unhived Mind

there is a differnce between 'whore' and 'beast'

reply to post by pasttheclouds

Jesus did not pervert him, he made him full...

False. Jesus changed God's word and not only that, Jesus was a hypocrite to his very own teachings. Re-read the New Testament.

.jesus fullfilled this further,
and stayed after he took his mental cross to take the literal one.

Jesus never took to the cross because he wanted to. Jesus did not want to die for you and he attempted to work out a different plan with God.

The old testament god is one of love...
his law was, I am one, love me (one,all) with all your heart...

You speak on God's behalf? "For I am a vengeful God."

reply to post by sirnex


I was raised between vengefull god interpretations,
it learned me that god is love and logic.

You can only speak for god if you know God
the best you can do, and both logic and the holy books
are clear, god/truth is one.

A Revengefull god is the god you pick. Yes he the revengefull is there,
Divided or One, Baal or God. But all are parts of the one.

[edit on 15-10-2009 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by useless eaters


Unfortunatly some of you cannot believe this but it is a -man form being- not a country a being, spawned from the DRAGON NATAS-JUST LIKE THE LEVIATHAN FROM THE SEA IS SPAWNED FROM THE DRAGON NATAS


[edit on 10/15/09 by Ophiuchus 13]

reply to post by pasttheclouds


There are no clear to parts of God you fool. God is a God of love only to those who worship him and a God of vengeance to those who oppose him. Nor can anyone speak for God, please read your bible. Logic implies without contradiction, and God's own word is riddled with contradiction, especially if we take the Christian perversion of God at face value for what it preaches.

reply to post by sirnex



So?? it's as I suspect, created ancient control B.S. hijacked and owned by a select few, used as a power weapon on those without knowledge "of" its origins?

reply to post by sirnex


You do not understand logic yet, so for you the fool is outside you.

God will come back as elijah, which will be for religion (whore) the false prophet,
delusion as promised. And for the real antichrist (ignorance) the way out
to even have more false peace (ignorance)

A beast doesn't reflect.

But it is logic that makes god come down...because God is another name for Truth.
And truth is alive.

I understand you can't understand me yet, because what i spread sounds as dumb for both religion as atheism.

just the way it's meant to be.

If someone reads my post, god's other name is truth,
and you can't speak for Truth without growing,knowing logic/truth/oneness
People speak based on observations, visions.
Both religion as science as atheism.
The way out is logic, and logic confirms the holy books,
by first leaving them, so their stories can fall in place
in logic...and what stays is a god that is one as
absolute truth that chooses to include instead of
exclude. One means lies are included as in paradox
so they become excluded.



[edit on 15-10-2009 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by HappilyEverAfter


Correct, people don't understand that the true origins of the mythology is from other people themselves. It's a decent form of controlling the masses though, get everyone to follow a certain belief system and you have total power over them as they don't fear you, yourself, they fear what may be above you.

reply to post by pasttheclouds


Ahh, OK. I understand what your doing now, your redefining what God is by your own personal beliefs. IIRC, doesn't he say something against folks like you as well? Now, you have to remember yourself, the monotheistic concept of God is born from the bible, it would in essence be the only truest form of God, not any misguided misconceptions you wish to decide for yourself.

you react on the same way you blame religion acting,
you take verses or saying or generalisations and put them out of context,

but it doesn't work like that. Truth doesn't start from the whole as divided, it start from the whole as one...and then verses start to translate logic into right. People first see parts, but the way to god/truth is to start at the beginning, which is the end, which is One. Verses can not be used to judge, only to help.

truth is logic, but logic is very simple which makes it very difficult to understand,
and only people who question god with an open mind, will find god as truth in their lifetimes..as promised in all prophesies from all cultures.


The moon to shine. Just as the eagle (michael, the prince) landed
on the moon 40 years ago. The moon will see the sun and start to shine,
to be attacked by what is blind. Angels to become. But eclipsed they will be.
To fullfill the prophesies of the son of Man. The prophesies of the Hopi in their real meaning to be fulfilled. The prophesies of Qumran, and Quran. Enoch. They all tell the same story in another colour and flavour, that's why their messages get attacked, but it is still the same message.


God is logic. Logic is something you can not beat. Even when spoken through a person.
Logic talks to you in you, and there it kills the fool. You are a part of it, even when you fight it, we all do. We fight God to win just as Jacob did when he received his promise.
Your replies are your reflection. When you beat, don't forget to salve. Because it is you on the other side, that's why Truth is love.



[edit on 15-10-2009 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by sirnex


So..... if one was inclined and crafty enough to create several of these belief systems touting select indivdual groups to be deemed with total exclusivity and access to "the only way" it would in itself pit one against the other just as the devote extremeists insisted on assisting their "one" to reach its fulfillment? And all the while there need only be a few to control the many, to keep them bound and blind.

where is self responsibility in that ?
It's the other one fault, isn't it ?
In that state God can not be reached.
Truth can not be reached, when truth is the guilty one.
It makes you guilty. What is One can do to himself what it wants,
just as truth does in this lifetime for a reason it sees as fit.
His glory. Truth as Logic.

When you cared for someone , you cared right or was it imperfect care ?
did your care make mistakes ?
Ignorance doesn't make mistakes. Sees no fool in being divided.



[edit on 15-10-2009 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by pasttheclouds


When it comes to the monotheistic God of the bible, your logic fails. When you attempt to throw in other cultural religious beliefs in your personal definition, your seemingly only including what is in agreement with your beliefs of God and truth while discarding and ignoring thing's from those beliefs that contradict your logic. You are the true fool here my friend. Logic doesn't contradict nor asks you to ignore something that goes against what you spout as truth. Love, love is a funny thing, we thrive on love as a society, but love oddly enough is a bunch of chemical pheromones that in most cases keep you from mating with your sister or brother. There is no such thing as love as a physical reality or truth of the universe. Your logic is flawed because your mind is vacant of knowledge in what you speak.

you are right in a way,
but that's why you can't understand me.

You built up logic, but it's in rest now,
so you see me as part of something that is past,
when it allready made the u-turn of the lost sheep
and went home.

I don't see a reason to attack your views... keep them,
just refine them a bit more. You can attack everything,
because they are words, but sometimes truth is hidden,
just as in the holy books.

Truth asks patience. I can not explain something that was fighted over
for thousands of years in 5 minutes. So i agree with the fact that in your view i am a fool.

I am sure truth likes to be questioned with patience.
People will find it and shine soon.

[edit on 15-10-2009 by pasttheclouds]

reply to post by sirnex


I have to answer on thing though:

"""""There is no such thing as love as a physical reality or truth of the universe. Your logic is flawed"""""""


So truth doesn't exsist, your visions do not exsist ?
Nothing can not exsist when there is nothing.
Because it has to be believed to exsist.

There is one absolute truth that contains everything.
Truth can not be untruth, and that is love...love is another
word for understanding, which is seeing, which is a new word
for repenting, which is opposite of ignorance.

Love exsist, I react on you, and that is love, because i see you,
just as you try to see my words, which is love.
Ignorance doesn't even react and can't reach truth.

Originally posted by pasttheclouds
where is self responsibility in that ?
It's the other one fault, isn't it ?
In that state God can not be reached.
Truth can not be reached, when truth is the guilty one.
It makes you guilty. What is One can do to himself what it wants,
just as truth does in this lifetime for a reason it sees as fit.
His glory. Truth as Logic.

When you cared for someone , you cared right or was it imperfect care ?
did your care make mistakes ?
Ignorance doesn't make mistakes. Sees no fool in being divided.



[edit on 15-10-2009 by pasttheclouds]

Now hold on, I'm not saying I'm looking to transfer responsibility for my choices or actions onto anyone else or remove them from my ownership, I'm saying it would be nice to "have the truth about religious origins" KNOWN, "prior and or during" the moments and lifetimes of my choices.
Truth can not be all or nothing, it can not encompass every single option out there, if that were true in itself then the act of taking a life would as equally bring you closer to love as saving a life, just as its own individual act.
Do not assume I am a fool, putting yourself in a higher place so quickly shows me nothing but self pride.
I am aware of what is to the left and right of me on this plane, I have not walked and searched without answer or without progress.
Truth? on a scale that can not be comprehended in this form has no ownership by you nor I, but the sharing of knowledge does lead to understanding a little more, I just want to understand the lies and their purpose, their apparent purpose.I'm not insulting you please respect that.