2012. We have two choices.

i totally agree with you,
that we do not have to fear god
we only have to fear ourselves a little bit



i do not agree choice is between fear or love
fear is honesty, you were never afraid of death ?
so why are you searching ?
never afraid of the hardness of life ?
so why r you searching to understand ?

its fear that helps
its ignorance that 'kills'

if it annoys you i reply like this, you can tell me,
i think though it's time we try put the dots on the i'ss


ciao.

Originally posted by pasttheclouds

if it annoys you i reply like this, you can tell me,
i think though it's time we try put the dots on the i'ss


ciao.

No your replies do not annoy me. I see what you are trying to say and I know what I want to say to you but Im struggling to put it into words.

You are saying fear is good, that it helps us in some way and maybe at this time for you that is your truth but for me it is not.
Do I fear dying you ask? No I do not. ( I have died many times before what does one more time matter) When we allow fear into our being we are closing off our ability to feel and connect to unconditional love. No fear is a negative feeling, a lower vibration and serves us poorly.

I will try to put my feelings on this a little better to you as I say it is not easy to put into words what is a personal knowing to another. Its like I said in a previous post, I can say a lemon is bitter but until you experience this my words will mean little. Experience and feeling are the language of the soul not the written word, but I will try.

You obviously feel fear and embrace it in your daily life. Can I ask you how do you think this helps you become closer to God and enlightenment?

Many thanks for your interest in this thread, all points of view are very welcome.

well, lets be honest,

and be rational

we are all afraid ...
you are not afraid of the ones you love, not loving you ?
you aren't afraid of not being justified ?
you are not being afraid of not being able to receive love ?
you are not afraid of fear ?
You are not afraid of not being able to stop rape, war, and ignorance,
or at least seeing a sort of justification ?
or you don't care about that ? because of a truth that is good allready,
but not complete yet ?
You are not afraid of what could happen to loved ones ?
especially when you believe the times could become hard ?
you are not afraid of not having value ? if no, why do you write ?
because you care ? but this cares also points to a search,
you are not afraid the search will take forever ?
you are not afraid to know nothing ?
you are not afraid to be without money once ?
you are not afraid to have no security ?

maybe not all, but some ?

we are all afraid...

if you say love is the thing to do
which i agree
do you understand love is seeing bad
to make it good

how can you do that
if you do not use fear to turn good
fear to avoid that what you fear
fear that makes you understand
instead of acting it out

you aren't afraid you say ?
so why are you afraid of fear ?
or you aren't ?
then allow it.

A negative is the motor of the next positive
honesty allows to see bad allows to make right

fear is not a bad thing.

understand love = love is seeing something to be good = justifying

you see the good of fear ? or you do not love totally ?
when you say love is the key
which is right to say, but then act it out, and start to love fear.

if you love the 'devil',
you love god. One.
How do you love the 'devil' ?
by seeing him, this is what fears do
then you allow him to be in truth, not exsisting anymore.
ending in NO FEAR

now, instead of a general reply, a personal one to your question,

i think by being more fearfull then anyone else
im now less fearfull then anyone else
because i understand what honesty does,
and what ignorance takes.
because of my fears i understand truth as absolute.
not as a subjective thing we use to ignore further.

you become a hero after you became a coward.
a coward doesnt have a choice then to do the thing he HAS to do
he acts as a slave and that is becoming and being one.
we only put the label hero on him, after we saw him doing it,
before that most heroes were cowards, or became cowards
by knowing that they were a slave to the thing they were afraid to do,
but did. thats why real heroes mostly try to normalise their status,
and say 'i did what everybody woud do'...they know they didnt had
a choice, by their honesty.

honesty is love.

again : i do not say this to annoy you, i dont think you believe wrong,
and that is only your thing to decide in the end, but lets put the dots
on the i, let us allow to see things clear.



[edit on 23-8-2009 by pasttheclouds]

Originally posted by pasttheclouds
well, lets be honest,

and be rational

we are all afraid ...

Yes many are afriad but they have no need to be.

you are not afraid of the ones you love, not loving you ?

No I am not, for to love unconditionally means you expect nothing in return.

You are not afraid of what could happen to loved ones ?

No this is a fear of what could be not what of actually is. To constantly fear of what could be is to become unconscious in thought, all we need do is concentrate on the moment we are in...the Now.

you are not afraid of not having value ? if no, why do you write ?

I write because I wish to share and learn.

you are not afraid the search will take forever ?
you are not afraid to know nothing ?
you are not afraid to be without money once ?
you are not afraid to have no security ?

No I am not afraid of any of the above.

we are all afraid...

Only in the mind, the spirit is not afraid.

if you love the 'devil',
you love god. One.
How do you love the 'devil' ?
by seeing him, this is what fears do
then you allow him to be in truth, not exsisting anymore.
ending in NO FEAR

I do not believe there is a devil, the devil is our creation. I also do not believe there is a hell. The only hell there is, is the hell we create for ourselves while on Earth. The dark is part of the light, it was created in order for duality to exist and for the Source to manifest what it was not. The only devil I must face is the devil within, not a creature within hell that man has created through his fear over the many years he has allowed his fear to manifest this devil. Think there is a devil then there will be one .

This is why fear is not a choice we need, fear manifests such things as the devil.

I chose fear for many years and spiritually this lead me to actually manifest all sorts of dark entities that took me away from the light. I believed in them, I manifested them because that is what I had chose...through fear. I agree by feeling and experiencing this fear it did actually lead me to the light, I saw what I was not, I saw that a light was making this shadow in order to guide me to the light...however such pain is not necessary, all we need do is choose love. Why put ourselves through such pain when all we need do is choose love over such fear.

Why is it so hard to reject what we are not? How long do we all need to keep experiencing this pain that fear brings? Fear is a negative vibration , it is not of the source, the Source would never send such pain for us to feel in order to remember who we are.

The dark created at the big bang was a shadow from the greatness of the light manifesting itself into duality ( necessary for it to experience life through form), this dark is now fading and is desperatly trying to hang on to itself through ego and fear deeply rooted in the human mind.


You are not your mind, you are your spirit and spirit has no fear. Spirit only knows pure love.

Yes, this is the conclusion that one will probably come to if you think about it enough. But have you talked with "normal" people about "love"? A lot of people don't really know what it is. Or they don't realize that they know. They mix it up with sex and such emotions between only two people, some people say it's only compassion etc. I think it's a bit more than that.

I think it's a bit absolute to say that you only have two choices, but yeah, this is what Hicks also talked about. It's an old cliche, but it's true.

In 2K, the beast is out of the cage and peoples greed and negative behavior becomes more and more arrogant and apparent.

Originally posted by pasttheclouds

fear is not a bad thing.

With 2012 we are talking about absolute energies not just what people percieve as Fear. The two choices given are absolutes, and in this context of choosing absolute fear for the soul to vibrate at in my opinion is a bad thing. Love and fear when in pure form are complete opposites and can not survive together , we can not have a frequency of both.
People seem to be happy to accept fear as their spirits frequency, yet the choice of love is there waiting for them.

For years I have searched for answers. Nothing ever truely resonated with me because I was always looking outside of myself in fear. To loose the fear and finally look inwards has lead me to this conclusion that I have two choices. It is IMPOSSIBLE to look inwards and feel fear, this is how I know fear is now not an option for me.

Although I now share this with you, this truth may not be yours. I do not know your truth and only you can find it because only you can look within yourself. Never take anothers word on anything. 2012 is all about finding our inner truth.

It is good you question, this means you are aware, you dont take others word on your reality. By asking you are looking. Those that look and ask honestly will find. If after you have looked inwards and heard your spirit tell you something else then this is YOUR truth. Whatever your truth is it will be found within and never from the word of another. Truth is never found outside of ourself.

If I no not
go within
I
go without

- ND Walsh

For me 2012 and the unusual times we now find ourselves in is all about dropping fear and going within. It is about finally seeking within our personal truths with a totally open heart centre to find your TRUTH and NOT what we have been told by others for centuries.

God/Source/Being/creator (many names meaning one) is never to be found in following the words of others, the word of others is almost always laced with fear even though it may not be intentional or even a conscious fear. The Source is to be found within YOU, within YOUR heart and soul.

No part of the source vibrates within the frequency of fear. Do not take my word for this though, look within, ask your soul while choosing total love if this is the case. Once you have done this you will have your answer.



[edit on 24-8-2009 by Mr Green]

i dont agree with your sayings, your logic
because it's contradicting.

(i do agree with your growing love, but love it truth, truth is absolute,
make it absolute, you even say yourself it's absoulte, but then you contradict this absolute)

god,life is more human then humans,
and you are not being honest, from how i look to you,
so yes, that's my view.
in my view,
it's because you do not see everything yet
that you say you are not afraid,

thats ignorance, opposite of love

the ultimate choice is between two opposites not ?

love or ignorance

you react so strongly and in such a theory on the fears i proposed,
that i don't buy it. Even God fears to loose you, even when he doesn't fear it.
You think God is by being nothing, feeling nothing ?
no he is all feelings, but because he is one, he is justified to be all those feelings.


fear is good, what they feared now, they don't have to do in
the years ahead, when all fear and reactions get concentrated.
if everything gets concentrated you do not have time to think about fears,
fear will rule you in such moments, that's why fear can prepare you.

if you would understand me you would see very fast,
that i do no believe in a devil either, i explained
it in my past mail, but you did not really read that.
you react with a lot of nice words, but they all are symbols.
(frequency, energy, its all symbol, logic is simple and behind it)
and you think symbols can drive away truth ?

so for now this is enough to share for now.

put the dots on the i.
please, be human, god in all his logic
is more human then humans,
he knows what is fear.
fear is a part of god, but for him a part forgotten,
to forget fear you first have to be fear.

look, i am going to be honest,
truth is simple, but i am bored of explaining it,
so i can not even write it nice,
because i know it gets ignored.
it's easy anyway,
but absolutes are not wordgames, not symbols
they are absolute.

if you talk about energy, tell me what energy is.
sorry but do you understand energy ?
how is related to movement ?
what else ?
if you talk about energy know what it is.



[edit on 24-8-2009 by pasttheclouds]

i was just drinking a coffe, overthinking your sayins further
in a way you are totally right in what you try to explain
but if you try to explain absolutes
sorry you have to try to understand them too as absolutes.

i know you are love, but make it full, then you will be peace in truth.
dots on the i.



[edit on 24-8-2009 by pasttheclouds]

people are so paranoid about something they aren't really sure of.

yes, you are true,
thats honesty, we are not sure,
that fear drives you, us.
to search.

you are right,
its doubt, fear that drives us.

anyway, im really bored,
i mailed so much in 2 weeks,
but i cant stay talking like this,
it bores me.
i know gods time to show himself is
near otherwise we stay talking forever.



[edit on 24-8-2009 by pasttheclouds]

Very donnie darko'esque'ish . You cant just go lumping everything into fear and love, there is a whole spectrum of different emotions that exist. Fear and love are bull pucky. Its all about Life or Death, and if you fear one or both then we are all just chasing monkeys.

I'm kinda with PTC on this: Fear (and many other negative emotions) could actually be the byproduct of ignorance, but I can't really see how fear could be good. It's a paralyzing, blinding force that prevents a person to live their life to the fullest.

I understand that being in contact with some darker stuff can be educational and necessary, but being under constant fear (terror) is just simply not positive.

Thanks so much for this. I have been thinking a lot about good and evil, what devides them. I think truly evil people lack love and have a deep terrible fear. You helped me find words for that

I was reading this and thinking of the spiritual riddle of human existence; the basic premise of "becoming" what you already are in truth. The notion that you cannot not know yourself (in truth) as your "life" is expression of yourself. And yet, we insist that we are this and that and not quite whatnot. I agree that there seems to be a choice, but logically if we "are" LOVE, then there can be no other "choice." So, instead of a simple choice between LOVE and FEAR, it may be instructive to examine what the FEAR is, really. Isn't the fear a fear of the true self? Isn't the fear the veil itself? A fear of the truth of one's own true nature? Aren't all smaller fears built upon this one? So, instead of viewing it as a choice that one, in a nuetral position, makes between love and fear, isn't it more helpful to view fear as a sort of function of, and also result of the desire to not be as we are. Like it's a kind of BS. That you can get lost in, I suppose, but nonetheless, entirely without reality in truth. Is that not the true choice, to avoid or accept the truth of ourselves as LOVE?
This is where the question led me, anyway. Thanks for the stimulating thread. Peace.

"Collective fear stimulates herd instinct, and tends to produce ferocity toward those who are not regarded as members of the herd."

- Bertrand Russell

you are all right
and all wrong



its a spectrum of emotions yes,
but we are talking about the spectrum now as a whole
to understand the colors. So dont think its bad to talk
in absolutes, if you know the absolutes you can understand
the colors. i said god is everything, not only absolute, also the opposite.

and im tired of the name 'god', for me god is life as one.
god is like what he never was, that name.

anyway, i answered all that, and yet everytime nobody really reads.
which is okay.

as long you stay seeing and keeping fear as a negative
you do not have to pretend you love fully
because you do not, love grows, yes,
but to become absolute, you have to love everything,

that is what good, life does with himself
loving everyhthing by justification = understanding it to be good = setting free

anyway, take care.

reply to post by pasttheclouds

so for now this is enough to share for now.

Indeed it is and may I say what an absolute pleasure it is to share with you. You ask me why do I write? I write to share with people like you, people that are able to discuss with an open mind but make no judgements. Your points have made me think further and that can only be a good thing.

I think we are actually talking about the same thing but have different ways of writing our truths. This is why the writen word is not the best way to find truth, only energy and its experience and feelings can deliver that.

reply to post by joechip


Good points. Actually fear has been studied a lot lately (when I read some scientific pressings) as has love. Maybe scientists are now interested in these emotions (or behavioral patterns) that dictate so much how we act.

When talking to a lot of random people about the subject, many (could say majority) are afraid of death and a lot of things they can't really explain. It's like this unknown anxiety and fear. Maybe this is 'cause of the fear of letting go. Trying to make impermanent things permanent.

All of this stuff is really talked through before, millions of times. Mostly by the hippies

reply to post by Mr Green


thanks, its nice to read your words, and how how open you are yourself,
because i criticised you to open your mind towards some things,
as you did with me

anyway, i do believe what we feel
we can write in words,
because truth is logic, and logic is soemthing you can write


you see al the previous reactions,
they talk about what love is
when the definition of love was given
some mails before... absolute love = justification of everything = setting everything free, including past and present and future and horror and our dreams.

truth only comes when you want to see it.

take care.

Originally posted by platipus
people are so paranoid about something they aren't really sure of.

Exactly which is why its so important to find our own truth and not blindly follow anothers just because we have been programmed to do that through fear. Many people are actually fearful of what they may actually find when they look within and choose to live with what another has told them as its safer/easier that way.

I tell you it is not fearful to look within, it is actually liberating. Yes you may at first be confronted by terrible and horrible truths that must be faced and dealt with, you will be tested by what you are not, this is all part of the process to face up to your fears and see what you are not...to finally reveal what you truely are.