Klein: Neocons think 'it's raining Nazis' in Georgia

Originally posted by heliosprime
The instant russia attacked, B2's should have bombed Moscow...

So, the instant Georgia attacked, the Russians should have bombed Washington? The Georgians started this and it works both ways remember.

reply to post by heliosprime


Simple question really. Who started shelling a town on the 8th August this year?

Was it Russia? No. What does that tell you?

When the region is made up of 95% Russian citizens, what do you expect the Russians to do? Sit back and take it?

If you compare this action to the Nazi's in WW2, then what was the invasion of Iraq by your standards?

reply to post by AllSeeingI


And the liberals and left wing supporting the enemies of America once again.

Originally posted by neformore
reply to post by heliosprime

 

Simple question really. Who started shelling a town on the 8th August this year?

Was it Russia? No. What does that tell you?

When the region is made up of 95% Russian citizens, what do you expect the Russians to do? Sit back and take it?

If you compare this action to the Nazi's in WW2, then what was the invasion of Iraq by your standards?

This was a setup by the Russians. Tit for tat attacks and rhetoric have been going on years between these two countries.

They mobilised hundreds of armoured vehicles and thousands of troops. Bombed Georgian communications facilities and utilities across the country and levelling apartment blocks in towns outside of South Ossetia.

Yes, I understand what you are trying to say. The Georgians are not blameless and they may have poke the bear in the eye. But this is what you call a disproportionate response.

Originally posted by Nerdling
Oh, and if you want to talk about Kosovo, remember that the Russians airdropped a brigade into Pristina airport to face off NATO.

They did, because they believed they would be given control of an area of Kosovo, but were then told that reather than operating as UN peacekeepers, they would be under NATO command, something that they couldn't accept.

They did not, however interfere with NATO actions, or fight against NATO troops.

reply to post by Nerdling


you mess with a bull you get the horns...

what were the russians supposed to do drop flowers on the georgians?
plus the if you want to talk about disproportionate response lets talk about the US and israel.

Originally posted by Nerdling
This was a setup by the Russians.

How did the Russians setup the Georgians to start shelling the city in the middle of the night? The press releases from the Georgian government seem to indicate they thought it was their own idea and a pretty good one at the time.

reply to post by Nerdling


yes of course russia PAID georgia to attack south ossetia so it could then roll in , stop the genocide of rusiian citizens and smash , completely the georgia military , just like the USA did to iraq.

or *gosh* georgia started this themselves believing the USA and Nato would fight the war for them.
.

Originally posted by Nerdling
But this is what you call a disproportionate response.

By who's standards? Not by the Western ones.

Not after Iraq.

It wasn't the shelling that started it, fighting had been going on for a week before that in the form of skirmishes between paramilitary forces and Georgian security forces.

South Ossetia IS a part of Georgia regardless of the ethnic makeup, giving Georgia the legal authority to act and put down and seditionist activity.

Russia staged an incursion into Georgian territory after intermittent shelling, which ITAR-TASS reported as being in response to shelling. And Russia had battalions in place for days beforehand.

This was always going to escalate.

Originally posted by Nerdling
South Ossetia IS a part of Georgia regardless of the ethnic makeup, giving Georgia the legal authority to act and put down and seditionist activity.

That's indefensible. Having the 'legal authority' to put down seditionist activity does NOT justify shelling a residential area in the middle of the night. And as far as the Ossetians and Russians are concerned, South Ossetia is NOT a part of Georgia and they ARE Russian nationals.

And I still don't see how the Georgians were set up to attack Ossetia?

Who opened the floodgates to the Georgian apologists?

I wonder what the US would do if their men got shelled from Iranian artillery?
Or if 2 American jets went down over Iran?

The level of hypocrisy displayed here astounds me.

"Disproportionate Response"? That was a good one.
What was Iraq then?

Jesus H Christ people how quickly do you forget your history?

Everyone is on Russia's back for escalating the conflict yet no one bothers to think back to 2003 or what America is setting up in Iran currently...

Russia has 10 times the justification America had for invading Iraq here, you can't deny it.
Whether Georgia wanted to or not, whether Saakashvili is a Western puppet or not, the simple fact of the matter is they opened fire on Russia first.

Everything else is scenery, look at it from the simplest perspective possible. Georgia attacked Russia without provocation.

Georgia's fair game in the mind's of Putin and Medvedev...

As I recall Iraq didn't open fire on UN Inspectors or down American planes, even Saddam wasn't that insane.

[edit on 12/8/08 by The Godfather of Conspira]

Originally posted by Nerdling
South Ossetia IS a part of Georgia regardless of the ethnic makeup, giving Georgia the legal authority to act and put down and seditionist activity.

... by attacking civilians sleeping in their blocks? By forcing 20.000 South Ossetians to leave the province in order to NOT get burned alive or shot?

Russia is giving Georgia a disproportionate response to an disproportionate attack [on civilians]! There is little footage, but at least there is from S Ossetia, showing the real side of the story. And all of that happened only one day after Georgia agreed to a ceasefire .

I wonder, if you had any Russian relatives in S Ossetia, wouldn't you write in a different personal view? Yes you would - but being anti-Russia is so funny lately, isn't it? Or is it modern? Sorry, but I simply don't understand your "logic".

Originally posted by Vitchilo
Sorry, but the neocons are ruthless warmongers scumbags. They spouted the propaganda for Iraq, Iran, Georgia, the bogus al-qaeda, the bogus WMDs, all the Bush administration lies and the police state. Those anti-freedom goons should go to jail for their help in war crimes committed by the Bush administration. I have only hate for warmongerers and people who love torture like the Bush administration does. And a PNAC member who in PNAC call for the use of race-specific weapons? And a new Pearl Harbor? And the overthrow of over 5 countries? PNAC is the modern Mein Kampf.

Right on. Right on. RIGHT ON! That is why you are on my friend list. Way to tell it like it is.

Here is how I see it. The problem with Iraq and Afghanistan.

After we rolled in and flattened the country we should have left....why america has to rebuild and feed a defeated enemy is beyond me. Afghanistan I could understand why we went there, fine. Iraq.....I honestly think that was just unfinished business...but if you look at these people there....they need a ruthless dictator to keep them in line. We didn't do anyone a favor by taking Saddam out.

Everyone hates America...but don't worry, when we turn on you....we'll rebuild your house, and stuff a cheeseburger in your face.

reply to post by Harlequin


I agree with you 100%

Is like everything the present administration do and get our nation into, no accountability for actions, just do the destroy and conquer and the hell with the ones that are against their warmongering feast, (usually the American citizens).

Interesting to see how propaganda works, when US did it to Iraq the war happy applauded, when Russia do it ( they are violating another nations sovereignty and they are axis of evil)

The pink glasses and Coo laid is working mighty well.

reply to post by Nerdling


and what of the georgian battlions still in the field after there `training` with US advisors? barely afterwards they went steaming rolling into SO , to be turned back - any country worth a damn will have it forces on high alert and in position if there had been `weeks` as you say of fighting


and you seem to have overlooked the detail that these are russian citizens that Georgia slaughtered.

Only mad man will start now confrontation with Russia. But i foresee a new "cold war" with different rules and borders, different players - like China and EU, new economics. Ex-USSR countries will now try to get in NATO or have NATO forces in its territory. Ukraine will be in NATO very soon now, thanks to Russian aggressive foreign policy. And Russian leaders have no problems with sort of cold war - easier to become monarchy again.
This war will not cause global conflict but it will change a lot in the world politics. As in any war, hard to spot winners. Maybe it was the purpose behind starting it? Since i until now cannot understand how Georgian government without promises of help from big players - EU or US - started this potentially suicidal attack.

Bad News! Georgia Says Russia Still Bombing Despite "Halt"
Looks like this thing is far from over.

Originally posted by AllSeeingI
Bad News! Georgia Says Russia Still Bombing Despite "Halt"
Looks like this thing is far from over.

Of course not. Russia never intended to "halt" the fighting. They continue bombing, and when Georgian forces defend themselves, Russia will escalate, blaming Georgia for not adhering to the "halt."