Obama: “America is no longer what it once was"

reply to post by Andrew E. Wiggin


If you were half the ethical person I assume you to be, you would tell it like it really is. I know you want Obama to win but don't twist the facts.

You act like Bush was the only one who believed that Saddam had WMD's. He is the only one you can condemn.

You need to go back and see what KERRy, Pelosi, Kennedy, Gore, Clinton, and Many other Democrats had to say about Saddam and his WMD's.
While you are at it see what other countries leaders said about Saddam's WMD program. They also believed that Saddam had wmd's and would use them if giving the chance.

You also act like Bush acted alone. Did Congress not give him the authorization to got to war? If Congress would have said No, we wouldn't be in IRAQ today. But yet you blame Bush for getting us into the war as if he had that much power.


If you hate Bush/Republicans then you have that right. But don't blame Bush for everything that is wrong with America. There is a lot of blame to go around.

that's one of the problems I have with Obama. He blames Bush for everything when in reality he is to blame as well. Congresses passes the bills and the President signs them. Obama is part of that Congress that shares the blame.


Obama has right to say what he did but he should have added that it never will be again. Just like the old west, them days are gone. We are now headed to a global nation.

[edit on 10-8-2008 by jam321]

Originally posted by jam321
Use to be 16 months to BRING THEM HOME. NOw its 16 months to send to Afghanistan, some stay in Iraq, some in surrounding area. You are correct timetable the same but it is a change.

Not to doubt you, but can you show me where he said "bring them home"? Because I actually don't recall hearing that. I could be wrong, but I'd like to see his statement. I remember him speaking about a phased redeployment and troops out of Iraq, both within 16 months of him taking office, but I don't recall him saying he would "bring them home" by then.

June 2007:





Jan. 30, 2007:

Obama said troops should be sent to three locations — home to the United States, in countries around Iraq to prevent regional conflict and to Afghanistan, which he said is in danger of falling back to the Taliban.

Source

[edit on 10-8-2008 by Benevolent Heretic]

reply to post by jam321


Barack Obama publicly denounced invasion of Iraq from the beginning.

I am not twisting ANY facts.

You just choose to not recognize them for what they are

[edit on 8/10/2008 by Andrew E. Wiggin]

Originally posted by Andrew E. Wiggin
reply to post by jam321

 

Barack Obama publicly denounced invasion of Iraq from the beginning.

I am not twisting ANY facts.

You just choose to not recognize them for what they are

[edit on 8/10/2008 by Andrew E. Wiggin]

Yes he did. But in reality, Iraq was a HUGE success. Why we decided to stay after the success is beyond me and the answer is NOT for oil.

You have to think, other countries joined us based on their own intel. That says a lot. Obama is very inexperienced when it comes to military related anything. I guarantee you if he is elected, we will be attacked on a massive scale.

Obama is too arrogant and stupid to take preventive action. Nobody likes it, but its the only way a country can maintain itself. The proof is in the pudding a.k.a. history.

[edit on 8/10/2008 by AndrewTB]

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

Bring Our Troops Home
Obama will immediately begin to remove our troops from Iraq. He will remove one to two combat brigades
each month, and have all of our combat brigades out of Iraq within 16 months. Obama will make it clear that
we will not build any permanent bases in Iraq. He will keep some troops in Iraq to protect our embassy and
diplomats; if al Qaeda attempts to build a base within Iraq, he will keep troops in Iraq or elsewhere in the
region to carry out targeted strikes on al Qaeda.

source

I bolded the bring our troops home.

“It is past time to end this war that should never have been waged by bringing our troops home, and finally pushing Iraq's leaders to take responsibility for their future.

source

reply to post by Andrew E. Wiggin


I am not talking about Obama. i'm talking how you paint Bush and get all over Bush for things where other people share the blame too. Many Democrats believed we needed to do something about Saddam but all I hear is blame Bush. Not even talking about Obama.

With all due respect jam. You do NOT go into a country without a clear strategic plan and an exit strategy. Shrub had neither. That is why we continue to look into the abyss.
Commander and chief messed up. Period.

The eye on the prize has always been Iran. Iraq was merely a stepping stone. And we stepped on a lot of corpses to get there.
This does not make me proud. At all.

This has carried on longer than WW2. We aren't going anywhere. Blood for oil.

[edit on 8/10/2008 by jpm1602]

[edit on 8/10/2008 by jpm1602]

reply to post by jpm1602


I agree. the invasion plan was screwed up which in return screwed up the exit plan. Blame that part on the administration.

but don't tell me Bush got us intio Iraq, or bush lied to us about WMD;s, or that bush is spending 10 billion a day etc etc. because there are other people who you should blame also.

Agreed. Bush is only the dog and pony show for Cheney. And a bad show it has been. I believe Bush tried to feel his oats for a minute until they forcefed him pretzels.
I'm not going to lie to you. I hate Bush. I hate a man that rides on daddys coat tails and messes up everything he dips his finger in. He can mess up a wet dream. Like me.

[edit on 8/10/2008 by jpm1602]

[edit on 8/10/2008 by jpm1602]

reply to post by jam321


Thank you. I stand corrected.

It would be great if they could all be home in 16 months. But my main desire for this election is to get us out of Iraq. I would prefer we get out of the ME altogether, but that's not going to happen anytime soon. That's why I never expected them all to come home within 16 months. It's not very likely.

But it was the invasion of a country that had nothing to do with 9/11 that really bothers me. So getting our troops out of there and discontinuing the deaths of innocents are my concerns.

But w said Saddam was a bad man heretic. And condi said a big mushroom cloud was gonna go off.
Dripping sarcasm.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

But it was the invasion of a country that had nothing to do with 9/11 that really bothers me. So getting our troops out of there and discontinuing the deaths of innocents are my concerns.

an invasion that Congress Authorized.

I agree with you 100% on getting troops out. However, I want them all to come home now, not in 16 months.

Originally posted by LLoyd45
For a man who seeks the highest office in the land, Obama sure doesn't seem to think much of his country.. his response to this little seven year old girl is very telling if you ask me, and is reminiscent of his wife's opinions about America.

Maybe his 20 year association with people like Rev. Jeremiah Wright and Bill Ayres is beginning to show just a bit

Llloyd,

Obama's quote has not a thing to do with Wright or Ayres.

The last several years, there has been this US President, named Bush and his overseer Cheney. Normally the President is supposed to be the leader of the country, but not this time. They've actually been advised by this guy named Henry Kissinger. Kissinger was the power behind our country's decision to go to war in the 1960s with a country called Vietnam.

Anyway, they've done a lot of things bad in this country. You should read up on it. They are the ones responsible for the sorry states of affairs in this country, not some crazy preacher, though if this preacher is aware of the reason for the state of affairs in this country, he might be someone worth listening too, though I have not seen evidence of it in the sermons I've heard.

[edit on 10-8-2008 by c3hamby]

[edit on 10-8-2008 by c3hamby]

[edit on 10-8-2008 by c3hamby]

[This country is great, it is better than any other country, Obama did not grow up in America, he definately will fix America and I think he's warning that seven year old, that she better be ready for some big changes...

Why is this a thread...i started reading ATS a few years ago to learn about conspiracies and UFOs and stuff I couldnt get anywhere else. These types of repetitive partisan political threads are just garbage.


Please! before you start a thread, ask yourself...is there anything remotely "top Secret" about what I am about to post, or am I political firestarter who just saw some crap on Fox News I wanna whine about?

I continue to muse about the Czek secret service report that did implicate Iraq as a key player in 911. It was denied vigorously by the administration.
It would have been a ringer to use for invasion.

Originally posted by LLoyd45
reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

 

Do you think he tells his seven year old daughter all those things? If he's a good parent he don't.

If he is a good parent he would, it would be nice to sugar coat and hide the truth from our children. How can you even make this statement and not be ashamed of yourself in the least, there are children all over this planet who are very aware of how harsh life really is, to not start explaining these things to any child is to raise apathetic and lazy children who really have no clue.

Children are supposed to be happy, and not have to worry about finances, homelessness, racial intolerance, oil shortages, or hunger. They have the rest of their life to learn about such things.

Ironically the greatest generation this country ever produced saw every single one of those things and despite all of those experiences turned us into the world power. Mind you I dont like Obama in the least I have severe issues with many of his stances on many many issues, but to sit here and say he should be lying to a child is a bit nonsensical. But it is apparent that instead of telling your children the truth instead of teaching them that this country has issues and how to live up to that responsibility you would rather they follow the exploits of Hannah Montana. He is right our children should know several languages, our standards for graduating high school are too low.

Perhaps obama is correct, i mean this is ecactly what happened to Britain, it was the worls super power, it had a masive empire, and then over 50 years, its power has decresed.

Perhaps the US is just following the same rute, i mean, maybe their power in the world is declining.

This happens to all the worls main powers and empires throughout history, the Roman empire, the British empire, and the rest

I know america isnt an Empire, but its still the most powerfull!

He is right, America is NOT what it used to be.

If it were, he would be hanging from a telephone pole, just another "uppity 'n-word'" that got lynched.

Irish would be denied jobs because of their religion. Jews would be excluded from housing, jobs, education and much of society just because they were Jews. Italians, and everyone that was not a white anglo-saxon protestant would be discriminated against in almost every area of their lives.

Only those that own property, and were male,. could vote.

Women would be literally the property of their fathers or their husbands.

Child labor would not only be legal, but would be expected in most urban areas.

The vast majority of American citizens would have no schooling at all.

There would be no governmental pure food and drug acts, and horribly dangerous patent "medicines" would be sold virtually everywhere.

Children could be raped with impunity by their fathers, uncles, brothers, etc.

Prayer would be mandatory in every classroom, and in many governmental offices. But nobody could utilize their own prayer, only the "approved" prayer would be allowed.

Anyone earning over $50,000 a year would see 90% of that income be taken as Federal Income Tax. This was true into the 1960's.

Yes indeed, it sure isn't the country it used to be. Thank God for that!

To the person that wants to compare the US to Britain, sorry, but Britain has been in decline since the 1870's. They were effectively bankrupt after the First World War. If the US had not provided them with billions of dollars worth of ars before December 7, 1941, Britain would have fallen.

They WERE bankript after World War II. They still have not paid even 50% of the debt they owed to the US (we wrote it off eventually). The Labor governments of the late 40's, the 50's and the 60's destroyed Britain as a major power, drove its industry into ruin and almost destroyed the will of their people to survive.

Without their colonies, they can't really compete on the world stage. They are just too small..