US leads world in jailing children for life

US leads world in jailing children for life

www.theage.com.au

THE United States has far more juveniles serving life terms than any other country — 2387. Israel, the only other country that imprisons juveniles for life, according to a new study by the University of San Francisco's Centre for Law & Global Justice, has seven — and has not issued such a sentence since 2004.

(visit the link for the full news article)

This is a difficult topic. I think it is very complex and statistics alone can paint a skewed picture. I personally don't know where to stand on it. I do believe that there are cases where children 10-17 can commit a crime that is deserving of a life sentence. I admit it is rare, but I do think there are circumstances where they just would not be capable of being a functioning member of society.

I don't know the solution, but I found this to be an interesting article.

www.theage.com.au
(visit the link for the full news article)

Maybe the title should read...

US leads world in CREATING children that need to be jailed for life.

A bit cynical yes, but from one who has been in many parts of the US, and seen many walks of life, there are alot of lousy parents out there that take away opportunity from children, before they are adults.

reply to post by smirkley



I agree with you. I also agree w/ the OP.

This, for me too, is a topic I struggle with. I see all sides to it, yet I cant commit to a side. I think because each case is different. I believe some children can be rehabilitated. I also believe some can not.

Now the article doesnt say what crimes these children comitted, but I would believe it is for crimes of murder, rape and God knows what else that is just as serious.

I will have to look further into this topics.

I heard the other day on the news that the prison term for adults who commit murder was very low. So, Im not sure why children would be receiving life - while adults might not.

Very good topic and thanks for posting it. Something I will be looking further into myself!

Well if the little morons would stop killing people they wouldnt be in prison now would they?

The real problem here is the asinine thinking of the global populous that giving someone a life sentence is not taking someone’s life. Anyone who is given a life sentence in this country should instead given a death sentence. Life in prison is no life.

A life sentence is just a weak person’s way of ending someone’s life without actually taking it from them. It is a “politically correct” answer to crime that, in practice, is absolute evil. Death penalties are in the Bible, The Word of God. But today we would rather be evil at heart and give someone 20 years or more of suffering at our expense so that we don’t feel guilty for ending a young person’s life.

Where is the guilt for the victim of the crime? Where is the guilt for causing 20 years of suffering to a person just because you don’t want to feel guilty for doing the right thing and giving them the death penalty as your bible tells you to do?

So many people in this world are evil and heart, but think that they are noble and true. They go against the penalties listed in the Bible and instead, stupidly think that they are doing the “right thing.”

reply to post by Karlhungis


Your post instantly reminded me a book I read a few years back called All God's Children by Fox Butterfield.

...Bosket was tried and convicted of the murders in the New York City Family court, where he was sentenced to five years imprisonment, the maximum sentence for someone of his age. The short length of Bosket's sentence caused a huge public outcry, and led the New York State Legislature to pass the Juvenile Offender Act of 1978. Under this act, children as young as thirteen years old could be tried in an adult court for crimes such as murder, and receive the same penalties as adults...

en.wikipedia.org...

The book is a great read. It gives an account of one family, going all the back to the late 1700's, and shows how violence was always inevitable within this Americcn family generation after generation.





[edit on 21-11-2007 by Conundrum04]

First, thank you for the responses.

www.cnn.com...

Here is an article you may remember from a few years ago when a 12 year old boy killed both of his grandparents with a shotgun and burned down their house. He then confessed to the police, saying that they deserved it for paddling him and locking him in his room.

Aparantly his defense was that the Zoloft he was on made him do it. Jurors found him guilty and sentenced him to 30 years in prison, the minimum sentence.

reply to post by Hot_Wings


Would you be willing to serve as executioner when it came time to execute all of these children? You personally would have to throw the switch, deliver the injection, or whatever form of execution is chosen. Would you be willing to watch them die at your hands? All 2000+ of them?

Here is more on Willie Bosket and his family if you are interested.

www.crimelibrary.com...

He is the reason why the laws changed to convict juveniles as adults.

reply to post by Conundrum04


Good link. That kid was definitely an example of why kids sometimes should be tried as adults. What is sad though, is that the mentality that he displayed, that was so shocking to society back then, is much more common in some young people now.

The answer my friend to your question is yes, I would serve as executioner to these children who were given the death sentence as per the Bible for their crime. Of course, I need to explain to you why or else you would think that I am just a cruel and sadistic person.

It all starts and ends with the belief in God. If you do not believe in God then you will not feel as I do about this matter.

So why would God have death penalties in the Bible? Well, there are infinite reasons for why God’s word is what it is, however I can think of a few good reasons myself. Those reasons deal with love, not hate. For true love, is doing what is just and right, no matter how painful it is.

Tell me, what good does a life in prison do for someone? Nothing at all. The only thing that can come from a life in prison is that the individual will have the time to reflect upon their crimes and turn back to living a life of good and not evil. The only thing that can come from a life in jail is the hope for a change of heart. But that rarely happens when you put someone in jail for many years and then release them. In fact, I have heard that the statistics for reform in prison are terrible. Is it any wonder why they call the criminal justice system, “The Revolving Door?”

The reason that prison has a poor reform statistic is that prison itself is perhaps the poorest environment for personal reflection and change. They say that all you have is time in jail, but that is not true. What you have in jail is bunch of people trapped in a situation of personal survival. Prison is rife with gangs and crime, not personal reflection and change. The saying goes, “I had to go to prison to learn how to become a good criminal.”

What I think God knows, that most people chose to ignore, is the truth that life threatening situations are what causes us to reflect upon our choices the most. I think that God in his wisdom knows that when someone commits such a serious crime as murder that only the knowledge that they will pay the ultimate price for their crime is what may offer repentance and change.

Remember the story of Christ upon the cross. Beside him were two thieves. Thieves mind you, it does not say that they were murders. Only one of those thieves chose to repent of his crimes. And what did Christ say to him? He said, “From this day forth, you shall be with me in paradise.”

It only takes a moment to be saved, but a lifetime of evil makes it much harder for that to happen. If you were to take that child who committed one of the grievous sins, of which the Bible lists the death penalty, and you were to let him live in prison for 20-40 years before giving him the death penalty, what are the chances that he would repent and change at the last moment? Even by the Cross of Christ, only one of the two criminals chose to repent and be saved. Would that older person who lives 20-40 years in prison repent? Or would they instead be bitter and resentful of everyone around them and society in general. I think that they would not repent after being forced to live 20-40 years in prison before they died. However, I think that if they were given the death penalty before a long life in prison, as the Bible dictates, then I think that their chances of repentance are much higher.

I also have to trust that God knows what he is doing above the emotionally charged people of this planet. I have to trust that what God tells us to do in regard to criminals is what is best for everyone involved equally, including the criminal himself. Is that not what perfect love is all about?

I think that God knows that the death penalties listed in the Bible are what are best for the victim’s families that crave justice as well. Indeed, I have all ready stated that what God tells us to do must be what is best for all, including the person who, as you put it, throws the switch.

As well, if we do what is listed in the Bible, and then we do so because of justice and not revenge. We do so because we know that it is right despite whatever personal feelings that we have about it.

Without making this any longer, I would have to say yes, I would gladly do my duty, as a Christian, as someone who believes that God knows better than man, and be the person who has to throw the switch, or make the injection. And if I ever do become that person, which I don’t think will happen, then I would pray that I do my duty to God and Justice with all professionalism and reverence.


[edit on 21-11-2007 by Hot_Wings]

reply to post by Hot_Wings


Thanks for the well thought out response. I can't say that I agree with you, but I appreciate the contribution. Now I would think that it would be one thing to be a person of faith, to administer the death sentence to someone that God himself has judged. But with all of the problems in our legal system, wouldn't you worry that someone was wrongly convicted? Then you would be executing an innocent child. That would sit OK with your conscience?

Christ himself was wrongfully convicted. I think that if a person was given the death sentence, and was innocent, then I think that they may have a wonderful eternity with God in heaven. What is a short life of suffering on earth compared to eternal life with Christ and God and all those who follow them?

A true belief in God is knowing that death is not the worst thing that can happen to us. The apostles even welcomed death because they knew that they were living their life according to God’s will. The worst thing that can happen to us is a life where we only commit evil after evil, and instead of becoming closer to God, we only get further away, for evil begets evil.

My duty, and yours, is to make sure that those who are convicted of crimes are those who are truly guilty of them. But for an innocent man to die is a tragedy, but it is not the worst thing that can happen if you truly believe in God. The worst thing that can happen is for one to be separated from God for all eternity.

In essence, I believe that a “Life Sentence” actually makes it harder for someone to enter the kingdom of God, not easier. For, as I said before, I must trust that God’s Word (The Bible) is what is best for all, including the criminal, the victim’s family, the person throwing the switch, and society in general, all of us.

My charge if I knew that a person was not guilty, would be to refuse to throw the switch and even to lose my job if need be in order to do what is right. But that is if I knew that they were innocent.

reply to post by Hot_Wings


Oh Christ, my Lord Buddha! You talk about an entity as if it was a PERSON. In my time of Christianity THAT was heresy.

FYI, God, if you believe in one, is EVERYTHING, including YOU. Your twisted dualism is in essense nothing more than a perverted way of thinking. No wonder the world looks like it does.

So you are advocating cruel punishments just because at a time some thousands of years ago they fit a feudal, nomadic society. You ever heard about progress?

Thank you anyway, now I know there is one thing a greater danger to this planet than Islamic Fundamentalism. It is the Christian Fundamentalism.

BTW, when you support a "biblical" law like this, much like the Sharia laws of Islam, what name does this perversion, your so-called law from the Bible, what name does it have in that book?

Like to know, so I know what to be on guard against.

Christ himself was wrongfully convicted. I think that if a person was given the death sentence, and was innocent, then I think that they may have a wonderful eternity with God in heaven. What is a short life of suffering on earth compared to eternal life with Christ and God and all those who follow them?

All I’ll say is try telling that to someone who is innocently convicted and sentenced to death, you sound like an entertainingly crazy executioner out of a movie or something. Life in prison has the possibility of appeals if you can prove your innocence.

Having said that, these kids should hang:

I just heard a story today about a pair of 16 and 18 year old boys that lured a guy into their garage and stabbed him a bunch of times in the back. Then they cut his head off and threw it in a river and burned his feet and hands with a torch to try and hide his identity. They did it seemingly for fun, TV people said prosecutors will probably push for the death penalty.

[edit]
they said the 16 year old is talking but not the 18 year old, my guess is they will let the 16 year old off easier and sentence the 18 year old to death.

[edit on 21-11-2007 by captainplanet]

I kind of find the title a bit unbelievable....

"US leads world in jailing children for life."

say what?? do you know in some countries, the children are born in jails, live in the jails, are tortured in the jails, and quite possibly die from that torture in the jails...

not that I don't feel good about our kids getting life sentences about these horrendous crimes they are for some reason committing.....personally I would rather they devout at least some of those resources and time to trying to find out just why these kids feel the need to do such stupid things, and well, see what we can change within the society to offset the problem before it becomes such a big problem.

but, well, there's no way you're gonna get me to buy the idea that we lead the world when it comes to jailing children....

news.independent.co.uk...

www.counterpunch.org...

hrw.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

www.preda.org...

www.commondreams.org...